Woolwich-Killing

[pickledseal]

"Today, from Boston to London, what gives so-called acts of ‘al-Qaeda terrorism’ their impact is not the acts themselves, which are always tragic but also small and scrappy, but rather the fragility of the target societies themselves, the deep feeling of insecurity in modern Western communities. It is our fearful response that gives terrorism its momentum, which completes the terrorist script set in motion by one or two men with knives or homemade bombs."
http://brendanoneill.co.uk/

This bloke talks some sense.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

My original post was my own opinion, respectfully argued, and made without any attempt to offend anyone on this forum. You've since resorted to portraying me as something that I'm not, and your last clever retort was a smiley flipping me the bird; isn't it about time you grew up old timer and allow the fact that not everybody has to agree with your/The Guardians opinion.

I will not reply again to this nonsense, but will more than happy to take this onto private message if you're calling it on.

Oh pack it in! This thread is not the place for your petty squabbling, have some respect.

As you can see Barna was the original protagonist and that was the point I was making. Target the correct people Kay

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

As you can see Barna was the original protagonist and that was the point I was making. Target the correct people Kay

You're never wrong it seems.Except about terrorism in the UK.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

You're never wrong it seems.Except about terrorism in the UK.

Wrong about terrorism in the UK? Turn it in will you. All terrorists are scum and don't deserve life in their lungs. There are plenty over here that should be weeded out and either locked up in their own country or put to death. You can talk about the UK when you decide to live here again. Until then, shut the **** up

 

[Jam_Man]

****ing hell. I can't believe these terrorist scumbags have made me agree with BarnaBlue about something.

If we weren't waging two ridiculous, pointless, un-winnable wars for no reason whatsoever other than $$$ then yesterday wouldn't have happened and thousands of people including many brave British and American servicemen and women would be alive today.

RIP Lee Rigby.

I dont even see that its about $$$.

We waded into Afghanistan with no real purpose or clear objectives and I dont see any reason at all why we are there, not that there will be anything achieved when we leave.

Its cost us billions to fight and hundreds of lives and just given these extremist idiots a cause to rally behind.

After 9/11 the US had to strike back but they have achieved nothing by doing so.

 

[Supernaut]

After 9/11 the US had to strike back but they have achieved nothing by doing so.

Just as every Middle East expert predicted at the time.
George Dubya should have taken better advice, and Tony Bliar never should have got us involved.

 

[Jam_Man]

Just as every Middle East expert predicted at the time.
George Dubya should have taken better advice, and Tony Bliar never should have got us involved.

Indeed. Trying to fight terrorism with armies is never going to work.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Indeed. Trying to fight terrorism with armies is never going to work.

There must be a way. I understand the terror attacks would probably stop if all troops withdrew but is it too late? Why are troops still in these places? If we left them to fight their own battles would there be more genocides? So many questions.

 

[GBJ]

That is insane,

No. Extreme? Maybe. Insane? No. I'll tell you what is insane, allowing the fanatical, hate preaching mobs, free speech to spread their vile hate in public areas. Also insane, being very soft to those who go against our traditions & heritage.

I believe that our justice system is too lenient

I agree totally, and I'd point to this as to why we have so many problems these days. Everything from race/religious related crime to 13-year-old herberts carrying blades

but everybody deserve the right to a trial, suspicion is not enough.

Not where general public safety is concerned. If you're a suspect, it'll normally be for a specific reason, rather than just your religious belief/skin colour. Turns out that one of the men from the other day was part of a demonstration back in 2007, inciting hate/death on innocent people. If all those people at that demonstration had been severely reprimanded and or deported, along with their families, then incidents like we witnessed the other day, may not occur. Zero tolerance is the only way to act with people who are simply not willin to comply with the laws/heritage of the land.

If we go to that system the government/police could throw anybody away they wanted.

I'd say, as long as the authorities had definitive proof or reason to suspect them, then yep, fair play to me.

 

[Jam_Man]

No. Extreme? Maybe. Insane? No. I'll tell you what is insane, allowing the fanatical, hate preaching mobs, free speech to spread their vile hate in public areas. Also insane, being very soft to those who go against our traditions & heritage.



I agree totally, and I'd point to this as to why we have so many problems these days. Everything from race/religious related crime to 13-year-old herberts carrying blades



Not where general public safety is concerned. If you're a suspect, it'll normally be for a specific reason, rather than just your religious belief/skin colour. Turns out that one of the men from the other day was part of a demonstration back in 2007, inciting hate/death on innocent people. If all those people at that demonstration had been severely reprimanded and or deported, along with their families, then incidents like we witnessed the other day, may not occur. Zero tolerance is the only way to act with people who are simply not willin to comply with the laws/heritage of the land.



I'd say, as long as the authorities had definitive proof or reason to suspect them, then yep, fair play to me.

Firstly, you cant deport a British person (without checking Im not sure if the one in the demo was British born).

Secondly, do you think reprimanding someone who is willing to hack someone to death in the middle of a street, and then wait for the armed police to arrive knowing he would be shot would be stopped by a reprimand, or even a jail sentence? Id say a jail sentence would have done nothing but give him more purpose.

Its hard to apply logic and expect normal behaviour and responses to someone who is that "fanatical".

 

[Napster]

Loving this video

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/woolwich-attack-watch-shocking-video-1907772#.UZ8pKdBH2mI.twitter

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Wrong about terrorism in the UK? Turn it in will you. All terrorists are scum and don't deserve life in their lungs. There are plenty over here that should be weeded out and either locked up in their own country or put to death.

You need to ask yourself, why was that vile murder committed in Woolwich? I happen to agree with you that it was an act of terrorism.

It seems pretty clear to me (at least), that it was also designed to provoke a reaction, of exactly the sort you're falling for.

(Btw,the death penalty has been abolished not only in the UK but in all EU states).

 

[Napster]

You need to ask yourself, why was that vile murder committed in Woolwich? I happen to agree with you that it was an act of terrorism.

It seems pretty clear to me (at least), that it was also designed to provoke a reaction, of exactly the sort you're falling for.

(Btw,the death penaly has been abolished not only in the UK but in all EU staes).

They didn't like the bank?

 

[Jam_Man]

You need to ask yourself, why was that vile murder committed in Woolwich? I happen to agree with you that it was an act of terrorism.

It seems pretty clear to me (at least), that it was also designed to provoke a reaction, of exactly the sort you're falling for.

(Btw,the death penaly has been abolished not only in the UK but in all EU staes).

Because they wanted a soldier and thats where a Barracks was?

As you say it was all about a statement and the shock value. Thats where its impossible for an army to win against terrorists. They just need a couple of knives and a car to create more of an incident than we can with 10,000 troops in Afghanistan.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

They didn't like the bank?

I much prefer The Co-op myself. :winking:

 

[GBJ]

Firstly, you cant deport a British person (without checking Im not sure if the one in the demo was British born).

No, but if they brought in a new terrorism law, which bordered treason, they could be given a life sentence in clink.

Secondly, do you think reprimanding someone who is willing to hack someone to death in the middle of a street, and then wait for the armed police to arrive knowing he would be shot would be stopped by a reprimand, or even a jail sentence? Id say a jail sentence would have done nothing but give him more purpose.

Well if he was banged up or life, I'd say that would have probably slowed him down a bit.

Its hard to apply logic and expect normal behaviour and responses to someone who is that "fanatical".

Exactly!! So we need tougher laws & punishments, put in place to prevent them

 

[londonblue]

Wrong about terrorism in the UK? Turn it in will you. All terrorists are scum and don't deserve life in their lungs. There are plenty over here that should be weeded out and either locked up in their own country or put to death. You can talk about the UK when you decide to live here again. Until then, shut the **** up

I assume you would say the same to HWWJ then?

Come on guys, this is getting childish now. And let's not have another post of "Well, he started it". Blimey, I get enough of that from my 4 year old.

 

[Jam_Man]

No, but if they brought in a new terrorism law, which bordered treason, they could be given a life sentence in clink.

Well if he was banged up or life, I'd say that would have probably slowed him down a bit.

You cant put someone in jail for life for being on a 'hate filled' demonstration, or you'll be locking up half the EDL as well.

Even if you could and did, that would then just inspire other extremists who hadnt been on those demos to join up. Imagine what locking 500 people up for life would do for these fantatics. Wow.

There are laws in place for what they did, they were shot and will serve life, but punishments have to fit crimes.

Certainly Id like to see a crackdown on the demonstrations but even if they were made illegal you wouldnt stop people like this.

Exactly!! So we need tougher laws & punishments, put in place to prevent them

Suicide bombers and terrorists don't care about laws or punishment, they think they are above that.

 

[mrsblue]

Depressing reading from some of you,These 2 cranks were born here and were Christians until they decided to seek Islam also they were both on the radar .

To stop this madness our troops need to be withdrawn from all conflicts within the Middle East and the human rights act needs to be torn up in order that the police in future can nick nutty terrorists without charge and lock them up.

 

[BaileytheQuitter]

There must be a way. I understand the terror attacks would probably stop if all troops withdrew but is it too late? Why are troops still in these places? If we left them to fight their own battles would there be more genocides? So many questions.

You are precisely right, which is just why we aren't fit to make the kind of rash and irrational comments which have been made in this discussion. No one here is qualified enough or has the solution.