Strikes take 2

[MK Shrimper]

Let's play Devils Advocate, what about his comment that only a third of the NASUWT voted for strike action?

Well the ruling Government is going ahead on just a mandate of 22% of the population.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Well the ruling Government is going ahead on just a mandate of 22% of the population.

Like it.:thumbsup:

 

[the_forgotten_man]

Well the ruling Government is going ahead on just a mandate of 22% of the population.

In a 5/6/7 horse race they polled the greatest number of votes. This coalition government received more votes than any previous post-war government, and most of the policies now being enacted were in one manifesto or other (the proportion of the Lib Dem manifesto being brought into government policy is in fact much bigger than they deserve, in terms of votes received)

In a two horse race of 'strike' or 'not strike' only one third of NASUWT members voted 'strike'.

Hugely disingenuous to liken the two.

 

[MK Shrimper]

In a 5/6/7 horse race they polled the greatest number of votes. This coalition government received more votes than any previous post-war government, and most of the policies now being enacted were in one manifesto or other (the proportion of the Lib Dem manifesto being brought into government policy is in fact much bigger than they deserve, in terms of votes received)

In a two horse race of 'strike' or 'not strike' only one third of NASUWT members voted 'strike'.

Hugely disingenuous to liken the two.

If the Lib-Dems would have jumped in bed with Labour you could say the same about the number of votes cast. As I understand democracy, the winner is the one who polls the most votes on the turn out, be it 10 million or 10. You can't bend the rules when you don't like the outcome.

 

[the_forgotten_man]

If the Lib-Dems would have jumped in bed with Labour you could say the same about the number of votes cast. As I understand democracy, the winner is the one who polls the most votes on the turn out, be it 10 million or 10. You can't bend the rules when you don't like the outcome.

Right back atcha. You can't, as so many in the Guardian and other left-wing establishments do, call this government 'unelected' or say it doesn't have a mandate and simultaneously say that NASUWT have the support of their members in calling a strike.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Right back atcha. You can't, as so many in the Guardian and other left-wing establishments do, call this government 'unelected' or say it doesn't have a mandate and simultaneously say that NASUWT have the support of their members in calling a strike.

No one voted for a coalition. Plenty vote for a strike, and who knows what the unheard voices of the NASUWT feel? You can't automatically judge that they're anti-strike, as I can't say they're pro-strike.

For something so important it baffles me how they can be so apathetic.

 

[canveyshrimper]

Well the ruling Government is going ahead on just a mandate of 22% of the population.

Like it.:thumbsup:

When was the last time we had a Government elected with more than 50% of the votes cast? We'll always have Governments that are elected by a minority of votes. And we won't get a change to the first past the post system in the life of this Parliament.

 

[Napster]

When was the last time we had a Government elected with more than 50% of the votes cast? We'll always have Governments that are elected by a minority of votes. And we won't get a change to the first past the post system in the life of this Parliament.

Tories had 51.4% in 1886; Tories had 50.2% in 1900; Tories had 55% in 1931; Labour have never had over 50% of the vote.

 

[MK Shrimper]

When was the last time we had a Government elected with more than 50% of the votes cast? We'll always have Governments that are elected by a minority of votes. And we won't get a change to the first past the post system in the life of this Parliament.

1931 as far as I can see.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

In a 5/6/7 horse race they polled the greatest number of votes. This coalition government received more votes than any previous post-war government, and most of the policies now being enacted were in one manifesto or other (the proportion of the Lib Dem manifesto being brought into government policy is in fact much bigger than they deserve, in terms of votes received)

In a two horse race of 'strike' or 'not strike' only one third of NASUWT members voted 'strike'.

Hugely disingenuous to liken the two.

I voted Lib Dem as a tactical anti-Tory vote and inadvertently I'm in the 22% that voted for this government. As many people vote tactically the 22% is an upwardly exagerated figure. But what we can say for elections and strikes is that a lot of people don't vote because they can see what the result is going to be and don't feel the need. In areas where a certain party always get in people don't feel the need to vote, the result is given. In a strike mandate again a lot of people see which way it is going and accept that without voting. In schools for example there will be unions that don't have a representative in the school and its members aren't being directly encouraged to vote but are willing to strike as they can express their views by striking but don't have to by voting.

 

[canveyshrimper]

So discounting the coalition Government of 1940-1945 no Government in 75 years has been elected with more than 50%. It's only when people or politicians don't get the result they want that FPTP becomes an issue.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Tories had 51.4% in 1886; Tories had 50.2% in 1900; Tories had 55% in 1931; Labour have never had over 50% of the vote.

In 1931 though is was Tories v Whigs, so as the same make up of todays coalition comparitively they had 100% of the vote!
Less distractions then though so putting your X in a box wouldn't mean having to pause a game on your X Box.
sigh

 

[South Bank Hank]

No one voted for a coalition.

Not sure I can agree with that. Everyone who voted Lib Dem either voted directly for a coalition or was negligent in thinking their vote might achieve anything different. The elected Lib Dem politicians acted on the mandate given to them by the electorate. That such a small percentage turned out to vote is a damning verdict on our society rather than evidence of government without mandate.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Fantasy economics?
http://gu.com/p/33tye
Does anyone have the real figure please?

 

[MK Shrimper]

Not sure I can agree with that. Everyone who voted Lib Dem either voted directly for a coalition or was negligent in thinking their vote might achieve anything different. The elected Lib Dem politicians acted on the mandate given to them by the electorate. That such a small percentage turned out to vote is a damning verdict on our society rather than evidence of government without mandate.

I'm one of those (more fool me). I can see that figure going down next election because you can't get a Rizla paper between any of them as they all cosy up to big business and the city.

 

[canveyshrimper]

I'm one of those (more fool me). I can see that figure going down next election because you can't get a Rizla paper between any of them as they all cosy up to big business and the city.

Would you have been so vehement in your opposition if the Lib-Dems had formed a coalition with Labour? And such a coalition would still not have an overall majority in the House.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I thought this thread was supposed to be about the strikes next week -rather than a re-hash of the last GE results-or are they related subjects?:unsure:

 

[steveo]

I'm one of those (more fool me). I can see that figure going down next election because you can't get a Rizla paper between any of them as they all cosy up to big business and the city.

Can I ask why MK. Surely you didnt think they could win so surely you would have voted for Labour as an anti Tory vote.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Can I ask why MK. Surely you didnt think they could win so surely you would have voted for Labour as an anti Tory vote.

Caught between a rock and a hard place. Labour are just Tory-lite and so far removed from the party they should be and it'd be a cold day in hell before my cross goes next to Conservative.

The only reason I will vote again is to keep the BNP out if they're standing.

 

[Neil_F]

No one voted for a coalition.

Very nice but totally irrelevant. The electorate vote for their constituency representative. Whomever commands a majority in the Commons is entitled to form a government.

On the topic, the union leaders and the membership are perfectly entitled to strike. The whole point of unions is to win their membership better terms and conditions than they would otherwise get in an open labour market. They are entitled to strike just as the government would be entitled to offer slightly worse terms the day after. I hope they do.

Ultimately it is a question of whether the unions think that the government will cave in. The only reason they would is if the public sided with the union position. I think the unions may be optimistic on that point.