Question The Acceptance of Mediocrity

[blues exile]

Why would you run the risk of putting us out of business when you aren’t even chasing the “promised land”? Are you actually RM?

The risk of going out of business? For goodness sake, you can't apply the same rules of running a business to running a football club. It is not about bean counters and cost centres. It's about the beating heart of a community asset which can only be saved by getting back to a proper football league where over time it would be 'sustainable' to use the current fashionable jargon. It certainly can never be 'sustainable' in the NL no matter how you dress it up with new revenue streams, business opportunities and sponsorship deals. Put lipstick on a pig and it's still a pig. There won't be crowds of 7k to watch this dross in years to come.

 

[BoyWonder2]

Staying in this league runs the risk of us going bust. A business with a bad product is a bad business.

Since when?

If we cut our cloth accordingly, we could survive in any division. Obviously we want to do more than just survive, but we don’t need to risk the safety of the club, so soon after we nearly didn’t have one, to get to somewhere we claim isn’t the promised land.

 

[BoyWonder2]

The risk of going out of business? For goodness sake, you can't apply the same rules of running a business to running a football club. It is not about bean counters and cost centres. It's about the beating heart of a community asset which can only be saved by getting back to a proper football league where over time it would be 'sustainable' to use the current fashionable jargon. It certainly can never be 'sustainable' in the NL no matter how you dress it up with new revenue streams, business opportunities and sponsorship deals. Put lipstick on a pig and it's still a pig. There won't be crowds of 7k to watch this dross in years to come.

You do realise how close we were to going out of business previously?

You do realised we were a matter of minutes away from the National League not giving us our licence to compete.

You do realise that a judge was very, very close to winding us up?

You do realise that if we weren’t a football club, we wouldn’t exist right now? If we weren’t a business, we would be gone.

But let’s throw money at players that may or may not work to get to somewhere you claim isn’t the “promised land”.

A football club in the national league can be sustainable. You cut your cloth accordingly, you increase your revenue streams and you turn the club into a money making business 365 days of the year as opposed to 23 in a season.

Would you hire Roots Hall for a business function? A wedding reception? An end of season awards do? Would you put on England age matches at Roots Hall or Lioness matches? Would you put on a concert at Roots Hall? In its current state, it’s a big fat NO.

 

[Southend Elvis]

Since when?

If we cut our cloth accordingly, we could survive in any division. Obviously we want to do more than just survive, but we don’t need to risk the safety of the club, so soon after we nearly didn’t have one, to get to somewhere we claim isn’t the promised land.

You are clearly happy with mediocrity, who is talking about bringing in a Wrexham type player. We could go cap in hand to try and recruit better loan players. We were lucky with Bim, as he didn't come with a glowing record. Someone stated on here about Rochdale, they have loanees coming out of their ears. Get us up the league and start recruiting better players, we deserve that as long suffering fans, don't we ?

 

[blues exile]

You do realise how close we were to going out of business previously?

You do realised we were a matter of minutes away from the National League not giving us our licence to compete.

You do realise that a judge was very, very close to winding us up?

You do realise that if we weren’t a football club, we wouldn’t exist right now? If we weren’t a business, we would be gone.

But let’s throw money at players that may or may not work to get to somewhere you claim isn’t the “promised land”.

A football club in the national league can be sustainable. You cut your cloth accordingly, you increase your revenue streams and you turn the club into a money making business 365 days of the year as opposed to 23 in a season.

Would you hire Roots Hall for a business function? A wedding reception? An end of season awards do? Would you put on England age matches at Roots Hall or Lioness matches? Would you put on a concert at Roots Hall? In its current state, it’s a big fat NO.

The assumption of superior knowledge together with overblown rhetoric is just meaningless noise. Conentrating on and prioritising expensive renovation of Roots Hall for possible extra curricular functions at the expense of success on the pitch is looking at the wrong end of the telescope. The club can only survive if it gets back to the FL pronto. Do you seriously believe that crowds will continue to turn up to see the likes of Wealdstone, Eastleigh, Solihull and Braintrre for ever and that the key to 'sustainability' is wedding receptions and chicken wing functions rather than a successful team?

 

[BoyWonder2]

You are clearly happy with mediocrity, who is talking about bringing in a Wrexham type player. We could go cap in hand to try and recruit better loan players. We were lucky with Bim, as he didn't come with a glowing record. Someone stated on here about Rochdale, they have loanees coming out of their ears. Get us up the league and start recruiting better players, we deserve that as long suffering fans, don't we ?

No of course I don’t want mediocrity, where have I said that?

I want us competing at the top end of the table, winning week in week out, but I’m also realistic enough to know we are still suffering with the hangover of the RM reign.

You say lucky with Bim, why not good recruitment? As I mentioned JS mentioned him, and him and Kev went and watched him and we know Darren Currie reached out to a former manager from the interview the other day.

Loanees is one way to go, but as I’ve stated numerous times, Kev isn’t a massive fan of the loan system. He’d rather have 22/23 of our own contracted players supplemented with loans to fill in gaps, and promising players from the youth team.

Again, every player is a gamble. Whether it’s a loan, a free agent, undisclosed fee or a record signing. Just because Rochdale have X amount of loan doesn’t mean they will instantly be successful. He also advocated Bury & Scunthorpe as prime examples we should follow, one isn’t in business and the other plays at a level below ours…

 

[C'mon you Shrimpers]

Loaded question if ever there was one. I'm just happy we have a club, that COSU are slowly but methodically changing the culture, improving the "Roots Hall experience", getting the ground up to safety so we can get back to c12000 capacity and get the training ground operational. I absolutely do not want wealthy owners splashing ridiculous amounts on my pleasure. They are wealthy but this isn't the way forward. They've been very honest about this. They've splashed the cash getting to the point we're at and I for one am impressed. Others have made the points already at how the late completion of the sale nearly buggered every thing up to the extent that this debate could have been hypothetical.

 

[RHB]

This is off topic, but where were all of the 'it's not good enoughs' on here when we were battling Rat man to save our club? It's all very easy to say that the team needs this and that, I'm sure it does, but by staying at Roots Hall the Consortium has to make it safe and fit for purpose, they also have to suffer the debts the scumbag left behind, and that they are doing. Leaving aside the shenanigans of no decent pre season etc, getting more players in is a balancing act for our club leaders and coaches. That means that we have to accept what we have now with a hope that we will steadily improve. If that's mediocrity then I'll live with that for now.

 

[BoyWonder2]

The assumption of superior knowledge together with overblown rhetoric is just meaningless noise. Conentrating on and prioritising expensive renovation of Roots Hall for possible extra curricular functions at the expense of success on the pitch is looking at the wrong end of the telescope. The club can only survive if it gets back to the FL pronto. Do you seriously believe that crowds will continue to turn up to see the likes of Wealdstone, Eastleigh, Solihull and Braintrre for ever and that the key to 'sustainability' is wedding receptions and chicken wing functions rather than a successful team?

There is no assumption of superior knowledge. All those things I’ve put out there are in the public domain, read the Echo, Chris Phillips mentioned all of that (after me on some occasions). London Shrimper has mentioned it on Twitter along with many other well connected people.

I don’t know why you mention the chicken wing contest when that’s nothing to do with COSU or Southend United, but I assume you know that anyways.

Who said they are concentrating on that? Roots Hall had been left in a state of disrepair. COSU had to spend money to get the safety certificate once again. That was essential works. They’ve managed to open parts of the stadium that haven’t been opened in months, they are working on giving us the North Bank back. Improving food and drink options.

The more money we make on the match day, the more money we make on non-match days, the less any owner has to put in. Surely that’s just sensible.

We can survive at any level, this who thing of we will go out of business at this level is nonsense. If we cut out cloth accordingly, we will be fine. Our cloth can be better with more revenue.

Football fans should turn up through thick and thin, I know they don’t, but it’s different being a supporter of a football team rather than a curry house. We turn up in our droves, and in my lifetime we probably have lost more games than we’ve won, yet I still turn up. If I go to a curry house and get food poisoning, I don’t return.

We may not still get 7,000 every week, but we aren’t dropping down to 3,000 every week.

 

[blues exile]

Making Roots Hall safe and fit for purpose is of course essential but talk of developing it to grow other revenue streams is a matter of choice not necessity when the priority should be devoting whatever money is avaiable to strengthen the squad to be able to mount a serious challenge for promotion.Trust is not a given it has to be earned by actions not words and we need to see some progress where it realy matters, on the pitch.

 

[blues exile]

There is no assumption of superior knowledge. All those things I’ve put out there are in the public domain, read the Echo, Chris Phillips mentioned all of that (after me on some occasions). London Shrimper has mentioned it on Twitter along with many other well connected people.

I don’t know why you mention the chicken wing contest when that’s nothing to do with COSU or Southend United, but I assume you know that anyways.

Who said they are concentrating on that? Roots Hall had been left in a state of disrepair. COSU had to spend money to get the safety certificate once again. That was essential works. They’ve managed to open parts of the stadium that haven’t been opened in months, they are working on giving us the North Bank back. Improving food and drink options.

The more money we make on the match day, the more money we make on non-match days, the less any owner has to put in. Surely that’s just sensible.

We can survive at any level, this who thing of we will go out of business at this level is nonsense. If we cut out cloth accordingly, we will be fine. Our cloth can be better with more revenue.

Football fans should turn up through thick and thin, I know they don’t, but it’s different being a supporter of a football team rather than a curry house. We turn up in our droves, and in my lifetime we probably have lost more games than we’ve won, yet I still turn up. If I go to a curry house and get food poisoning, I don’t return.

We may not still get 7,000 every week, but we aren’t dropping down to 3,000 every week.

Using language like 'do you realise' several times over in the same post suggests you know something the poster doesn't.
You are probably not old enough to remember but gates in the early 80s dropped alarmingly compared to those of the Dave Smith era. It could well happen again as consumers have more choice what to spend their money on in these hard times.

 

[BoyWonder2]

Making Roots Hall safe and fit for purpose is of course essential but talk of developing it to grow other revenue streams is a matter of choice not necessity when the priority should be devoting whatever money is avaiable to strengthen the squad to be able to mount a serious challenge for promotion.Trust is not a given it has to be earned by actions not words and we need to see some progress where it realy matters, on the pitch.

We won’t be able to devote all money into that until we have satisfied ALL of the debts from the RM reign.

At the moment, it’s like earning your wages at the end of the month, paying your mortgage and bills and other essentials, but the RM reign is your credit card bill. Until that’s paid off, you aren’t able to do everything you want to so you have to pick and choose.

Money is available for the right players, as I’ve said on numerous occasions and JR hinted in his last podcast appearance too. Easy to ignore that though and shout from the rooftops when it isn’t your money.

 

[stewart]

It sounds like you're grappling with the balance between realistic expectations and the passion we all have for the sport. Being a fan can be challenging, especially when financial constraints dictate the club's strategy and approach. COSU's pragmatic decisions might make sense from a financial perspective, but as fans, our hearts yearn for more thrilling and competitive performances on the pitch.

For some context the below are the number of seasons we have spent within each league and it shows that we are seem to yoyo between what is League 1 and League 2

League	Number of Seasons
Southern League Second Division	1
Southern League First Division	4
Football League Third Division (South)	38
Football League Fourth Division	17
Football League Third Division	7
Football League Second Division	15
Football League First Division (Championship)	1
Football League One	14
Football League Two	22
National League	3 (ongoing)

i do believe we have spent more than 1 season in the championship

 

[Southend Elvis]

No of course I don’t want mediocrity, where have I said that?

I want us competing at the top end of the table, winning week in week out, but I’m also realistic enough to know we are still suffering with the hangover of the RM reign.

You say lucky with Bim, why not good recruitment? As I mentioned JS mentioned him, and him and Kev went and watched him and we know Darren Currie reached out to a former manager from the interview the other day.

Loanees is one way to go, but as I’ve stated numerous times, Kev isn’t a massive fan of the loan system. He’d rather have 22/23 of our own contracted players supplemented with loans to fill in gaps, and promising players from the youth team.

Again, every player is a gamble. Whether it’s a loan, a free agent, undisclosed fee or a record signing. Just because Rochdale have X amount of loan doesn’t mean they will instantly be successful. He also advocated Bury & Scunthorpe as prime examples we should follow, one isn’t in business and the other plays at a level below ours…

You have only got to read your posts, stating that you don't mind putting up with our position in the league all because of what we have gone through. I don't want to put up with it, we have had years of Rat not putting any money in, I don't want the new owners to do the same.
Bim was lucky, as his record of only scoring a couple in the Scottish league denotes that.
If we had more bodies, even loanees, we could see if they work or not. We signed Bonne for a year, without knowing what he could do for us, now we are stuck.

 

[BoyWonder2]

You have only got to read your posts, stating that you don't mind putting up with our position in the league all because of what we have gone through. I don't want to put up with it, we have had years of Rat not putting any money in, I don't want the new owners to do the same.
Bim was lucky, as his record of only scoring a couple in the Scottish league denotes that.
If we had more bodies, even loanees, we could see if they work or not. We signed Bonne for a year, without knowing what he could do for us, now we are stuck.

I’ve never said I’m happy at this level. I understand why we are here and why we probably will be next season too, but that could all change.

COSU have put loads of money in. They funded signings before the owned the club, paying off debts that aren’t theirs etc etc. to say they aren’t putting money in isn’t telling the truth.

Of course Bim was lucky, no point praising those that scouted him etc, lot easier to say it’s luck.

So we should sign more players to see if they work or not, what if they all turn out like Bonne? Do we then sign loads more? I agree we need more quality in the squad, more pace, more creativity, more guile, but that means we have to be selective over who we bring in.

Our recruitment team have identified loads of players who have gone on to do well, and would have here potentially, but RM’s embargo and “legacy” put paid to that.

 

[blues exile]

We won’t be able to devote all money into that until we have satisfied ALL of the debts from the RM reign.

At the moment, it’s like earning your wages at the end of the month, paying your mortgage and bills and other essentials, but the RM reign is your credit card bill. Until that’s paid off, you aren’t able to do everything you want to so you have to pick and choose.

Money is available for the right players, as I’ve said on numerous occasions and JR hinted in his last podcast appearance too. Easy to ignore that though and shout from the rooftops when it isn’t your money.

You are trying to have it both ways. If money is available it should be used for strengthening the squad not on unnecessary alternatives. It's a football club first and foremost so 'picking and choosing' is very simply a matter of priorities. The old and by now discredited analogy of comparing a household budget with running a country or a business doesn't wash anymore.

 

[BoyWonder2]

You are trying to have it both ways. If money is available it should be used for strengthening the squad not on unnecessary alternatives. It's a football club first and foremost so 'picking and choosing' is very simply a matter of priorities. The old and by now discredited analogy of comparing a household budget with running a country or a business doesn't wash anymore.

Everyone does.

We shouldn’t have to rely on owners putting in money to cover debts. We are having to because of the situation we find ourselves in.

If we had more revenue streams, the ones I have mentioned and others, cup runs, selling players etc then we have bigger budgets without owners putting in unlimited resources.

I was us to be successful. I don’t think gambling on players to do that, the way we have down for 20 odd years under RM, is the way to do it. We are lucky to still be a football club don’t forget. It’s almost like some have learnt nothing this past two years or so…

 

[stewart]

why keep bringing Bonne into your threads , he is not the only one that hasnt scored ,Do you think he is the cause of us being 14th in the ladder ,give it a rest , reading the match day threads seems many think he playing well . Even Kane early on in his career went out on loan a few times and was hardly a recognised goal scorer ,yet now he is Englands all time top goalscorer , i wonder how he would have felt back then if he got all the abuse Bonne gets .

 

[blues exile]

Everyone does.

We shouldn’t have to rely on owners putting in money to cover debts. We are having to because of the situation we find ourselves in.

If we had more revenue streams, the ones I have mentioned and others, cup runs, selling players etc then we have bigger budgets without owners putting in unlimited resources.

I was us to be successful. I don’t think gambling on players to do that, the way we have down for 20 odd years under RM, is the way to do it. We are lucky to still be a football club don’t forget. It’s almost like some have learnt nothing this past two years or so…

This trope about being lucky to still have a club is too readily being used to justify the present situation. The consortium are not fairy godmothers, they took this on knowing full well what the situation was and being hard headed businessmen as well as loyal supporters must have been aware that finances could well be worse than at first thought. This does not give them immunity from being questioned about their plans and priorities.

 

[stewart]

You are trying to have it both ways. If money is available it should be used for strengthening the squad not on unnecessary alternatives. It's a football club first and foremost so 'picking and choosing' is very simply a matter of priorities. The old and by now discredited analogy of comparing a household budget with running a country or a business doesn't wash anymore.

question : what are those unneccessary alternatives the club are wasteing money on .