SUFC: The Future SUFC up for sale

[shrimpled]

portsmouth - a far bigger club went for 3 million to the pompey trust - and they were told the same story about zillions of pounds of debt from premiership days etc etc etc

you see a lot of football clubs have been sold to supporters for relatively modest sums but they did not have many supporters who believed the owners propaganda/rubbish/bull-sh=t/lies/fantasies...

If you did some basic research on this you will realise 2 million is not laughable -

but none of this matters because hopefully the club will sell - RM will not get his millions and if you watch the process closely you will learn something about the realities of how an insolvent business is disposed of ..

Serious question, have you ever been involved in the sale, purchase, or liquidation of any company?

From the things that you say, I really don't think you understand the intricacies involved in these type of transactions.

Having been involved in many, as both a purchaser and a seller, (though never of a football club, thank f**k) I expect the sale of SUFC would be a really quite simple transaction, but the rest of it...

The £2m you mention might cover both parties legal fees and settle the current HMRC outstanding bill, but you're not going to get a lot more for your money..

The football club does not own RH, B&L or indeed FF. Rent has been paid on paper, but the football club has never actually paid the cash to the landlord (RM), hence the debt. If you wanted to buy the football club for a £1, you probably could. But that isn't going to buy you the stadium, training ground(s) or FF.. and suddenly the landlord might come asking for the actual cash and could even up the rent..

I suspect it's then that you might see RM start to 'profit' from the football club. £2m isn't going to do it.

Anyone buying the club but not the ground/ FF would be off their ****ing rocker IMO.

 

[pottster]

portsmouth - a far bigger club went for 3 million to the pompey trust - and they were told the same story about zillions of pounds of debt from premiership days etc etc etc

you see a lot of football clubs have been sold to supporters for relatively modest sums but they did not have many supporters who believed the owners propaganda/rubbish/bull-sh=t/lies/fantasies...

If you did some basic research on this you will realise 2 million is not laughable -

but none of this matters because hopefully the club will sell - RM will not get his millions and if you watch the process closely you will learn something about the realities of how an insolvent business is disposed of ..

It's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, hopefully Ron understands this.

 

[overseas shrimper]

Apparently the training pitches were cut today

So ergo, Ron is loaded. We should be fine now. ;-)

 

[Billy Bests boot laces]

Apparently the training pitches were cut today

I presume preseason seeding & work on our pitch etc, will be on hold until after 17th May?. And if we live to fight another day, where will the money come from for the necessary work?.

 

[Rayleigh boy]

people have told you numerous times that you're talking rubbish.

mate - I make up my own mind and take people how I find them..

it looks like you went and checked on Google how much Pompey sold for - well done.

as I said it not that much money is it ?

lots of people are rude and unpleasant to me on here .... occasionally I lose my sh=t and get into being rude back but try not too.

people say things like...

you're talking rubbish.

which is an interesting judgement from someone who thinks RM is owed 40 million - or 24 million - or 14 million ... or some other cobblers ..

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Serious question, have you ever been involved in the sale, purchase, or liquidation of any company?

From the things that you say, I really don't think you understand the intricacies involved in these type of transactions.

Having been involved in many, as both a purchaser and a seller, (though never of a football club, thank f**k) I expect the sale of SUFC would be a really quite simple transaction, but the rest of it...

The £2m you mention might cover both parties legal fees and settle the current HMRC outstanding bill, but you're not going to get a lot more for your money..

The football club does not own RH, B&L or indeed FF. Rent has been paid on paper, but the football club has never actually paid the cash to the landlord (RM), hence the debt. If you wanted to buy the football club for a £1, you probably could. But that isn't going to buy you the stadium, training ground(s) or FF.. and suddenly the landlord might come asking for the actual cash and could even up the rent..

I suspect it's then that you might see RM start to 'profit' from the football club. £2m isn't going to do it.

Anyone buying the club but not the ground/ FF would be off their ****ing rocker IMO.

thanks for this interesting contribution - I think the GBP 2 million is a slightly provocative low figure but based on dealing with administrators .. i.e. the club in administration .

you mention the intricacies but they are involving associated (or not) property deals - the fundamentals of the football club are simple and cheap.

my experience of businesses collapsing is that once the plates stop spinning they crash to the floor and smash into smithereens and there is nothing left - that is what I think is the situation with RM and all his companies .. nothing left.

 

[Shrimper]

mate - I make up my own mind and take people how I find them..

it looks like you went and checked on Google how much Pompey sold for - well done.

as I said it not that much money is it ?

lots of people are rude and unpleasant to me on here .... occasionally I lose my sh=t and get into being rude back but try not too.

people say things like...


which is an interesting judgement from someone who thinks RM is owed 40 million - or 24 million - or 14 million ... or some other cobblers ..

Just going to ignore the rest of the post then because it doesn't fit your view?

The difference is I can back up the numbers with sources. You can't.

I'm interested though. Lets say you raise the £2m and he says yes. What money are you going to use to run the club with? How are you going to fund it?

 

[Snowy]

It's just a forum, let's all calm down.
No one knows the true figures, so let the process unwind.
We either find ourselves losing to HMRC / gaining a stay of execution or a New Buyer / Investor arrives.
Time will tell which comes first.

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Just going to ignore the rest of the post then because it doesn't fit your view?

The difference is I can back up the numbers with sources. You can't.

I'm interested though. Lets say you raise the £2m and he says yes. What money are you going to use to run the club with? How are you going to fund it?

in 2019 the club turned over 7 million pounds ... (companies house)

that is 7 million quid came into the club - for sure that is considerably reduced now but it still a considerable revenue stream - maybe even halved

but money comes in all the time

season tickets
matchday tickets
away tickets
parking
advertising
sponsorship
match day income food and bars
hospitality
tv money

a decent set of management accounts and off you go ..

 

[danbowen]

He is not personally skint - I am sure he has stashed his personal money away safe from taxman and creditors - the money he was extracting from SUFC was about 350-400k per annum.

Nice car - nice house - nice holidays ...

His companies and businesses are all a skint - hence grass not cut, staff not paid and the prize asset SUFC up for sale at any price ..

LOL you actually think he was taking that amount out of the club each month? WOW!

 

[Shrimper]

in 2019 the club turned over 7 million pounds ... (companies house)

that is 7 million quid came into the club - for sure that is considerably reduced now but it still a considerable revenue stream - maybe even halved

but money comes in all the time

season tickets
matchday tickets
away tickets
parking
advertising
sponsorship
match day income food and bars
hospitality
tv money

a decent set of management accounts and off you go ..

Turnover in the last set of accounts was £6.2m. That will be reduced now. Your above also ignores the Cost of Sales which were £6.8m, you then have £2m of admin expenses and £5m of wages

Suddenly it doesn't look very good, does it?

And this doesn't any cost of servicing the cost to purchase or cost of paying off debt

 

[Rayleigh boy]

LOL you actually think he was taking that amount out of the club each month? WOW!

i said per annum

"extracting from SUFC was about 350-400k per annum."

i think someone else who went through the accounts identified this - check back

 

[WestyReturns]

It's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, hopefully Ron understands this.

Going on past conversations with Ron I find it highly unlikely, hes totally delusional. Hopefully that's changed now his hands been forced.

 

[shrimpled]

thanks for this interesting contribution - I think the GBP 2 million is a slightly provocative low figure but based on dealing with administrators .. i.e. the club in administration .

you mention the intricacies but they are involving associated (or not) property deals - the fundamentals of the football club are simple and cheap.

my experience of businesses collapsing is that once the plates stop spinning they crash to the floor and smash into smithereens and there is nothing left - that is what I think is the situation with RM and all his companies .. nothing left.

Ron won't put the club into administration. He is the biggest creditor. He is far more likely to see a return on his 'investment' doing a cut and run cheap deal in the next couple of weeks. The issue as I see it, is because of the nature of the 'opportunity' that is not a long time to tie up a deal as complicated as this one could possibly be, and I would think our survival is on whether a judge accepts that a sale is underway and likely to close that will see HMRC see their money and adjourn accordingly.

If we cannot get this WUP adjourned we will be liquidated and for those unaware, there is a massive difference between the administration and liquidation.

By calling in administrators, Ron loses control of the situation. I just do not see that being the course of action. Ron still needs SUFC in order to realise the potential profits of FF, that hasn't changed.

I agree with you on the football club fundamentally being a simple transaction, but the transaction it is part of (or must be part of as as per my earlier post) is much more complicated. It is not a simple property deal, owing to the various stakeholders in the project(s).

If someone was to buy the whole thing (say, another property developer) then potentially, that would be an easier deal to complete quickly.

On RM's businesses, I can't comment. As an outsider it looks like he has had serious cashflow problems for many years, but in my experience things aren't always as they seem. There is money somewhere, it's just not obvious where, and it's probably not liquid. Again, nothing unusual in that.

 

[londonblue]

i said per annum

"extracting from SUFC was about 350-400k per annum."

i think someone else who went through the accounts identified this - check back

You mean somebody else made the same mistake as you?

You have on here people who are accountants and people who have experience in administration telling you you've made a mistake.

Are you really that intransigent that instead of thinking that maybe they know what they're talking about you think they're all wrong?

 

[Supa Shrimpa]

Ron won't put the club into administration. He is the biggest creditor.

It might not be his choice, if he's run out of cashflow

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Turnover in the last set of accounts was £6.2m. That will be reduced now. Your above also ignores the Cost of Sales which were £6.8m, you then have £2m of admin expenses and £5m of wages

Suddenly it doesn't look very good, does it?

And this doesn't any cost of servicing the cost to purchase or cost of paying off debt

well done you .. you have looked at some accounts ..

looks fine to me .. any decent business man can run a good football club on that income which is why all the mickey mouse clubs in this league can survive ..... but we cant ??????

But well done for spotting

£2m of admin expense

i would never ever suggest that anyone owning a business would sneak out a bit of printer ink - or petrol for the Bentley or a 100 k for some onions

 

[shrimpled]

It might not be his choice, if he's run out of cashflow

Unless anyone has a floating charge over any SUFC assets (and I don't believe we have any?) then it basically is his choice.

Him putting the club up for sale is his choice on how to deal with the situation (which seems to be that he has run out of ready cash, or certainly doesn't wish to put any more into SUFC).

 

[Danshrimper]

i said per annum

"extracting from SUFC was about 350-400k per annum."

i think someone else who went through the accounts identified this - check back

It’s been explained to you a million times that the figure in the accounts doesn’t mean Ron actually takes that money, it was just invoiced in that year.

The money is never paid to him/his companies, it has never been ‘extracted’. The fact the money hasn’t been extracted is the whole reason he has been able to file the ridiculous £16million charges on Companies House.

But if continuing to believe and spread something that isn’t true makes you feel better then so be it.

 

[Rayleigh boy]

You mean somebody else made the same mistake as you?

You have on here people who are accountants and people who have experience in administration telling you you've made a mistake.

Are you really that intransigent that instead of thinking that maybe they know what they're talking about you think they're all wrong?

sure - possibly very true ... maybe RM never took a penny out ... maybe he did .. there was enough money swilling about for him to do loads .. even on players sales ... we dont know - we never will ,

... it is very true that he did not ask the accountant put MONEY FOR RON in the accounts ..