Promotion and relegation 2019/20 season

[Westcliff DGS]

Not saying I like the idea of promotions but no relegation, but I do need to correct your scenario above.
If 2 sides get promoted from League 1 and 3 sides are promoted into League 1 from League 2, it puts the number in League 1 back to 24, not 25. Remember we only had 23 this season?
Then one team up from the National League would give:-
22, 24, 24, 22.

Talk is of a 23 team premier league now this keeping the same amount that usually get promoted.

I guess the good thing is people are now looking to see what options there are, the aim as I understand is to finish PL and Championship if at all possibly and end L1 and L2

 

[Shrimpergonzo]

Not saying I like the idea of promotions but no relegation, but I do need to correct your scenario above.
If 2 sides get promoted from League 1 and 3 sides are promoted into League 1 from League 2, it puts the number in League 1 back to 24, not 25. Remember we only had 23 this season?
Then one team up from the National League would give:-
22, 24, 24, 22.

Yes, you’re right - I’d forgotten about Bury, so under my plan (2 up from every division down to National League) it would actually be 22, 24, 23, 24.

Your suggestion is, I think, those in automatic promotion promoted only (2 up from Champ, 2 up from League 1, 3 up from League 2, 1 up from National League).

Anyway, who knows? They’ll dither and delay for a bit longer and even then there might be legal challenges. I think everyone’s waiting for what Boris says on Thursday first.

 

[BriggBlue]

My thoughts on this is that Liverpool should be awarded the premiership title , and from each division it should be 2 up and 2 down ,yes that would relegate us ,but we deserve to be relegated being 16 points from safety.

whilst I agree we haven't been good enough to stay up the facts are that we simply are not relegated mathematically and can still stay up. If we end up getting relegated they would have to relegate all teams in relegation positions in all leagues.

if the season was to be finished next year every team would have very different squads, if for example Rons backers want to invest heavily in the club and all other teams in the league are severely weakened due to not having the same budget we could win all of our remaining games. far fetched I know but this is 2020 after all

 

[Westcliff DGS]

By

whilst I agree we haven't been good enough to stay up the facts are that we simply are not relegated mathematically and can still stay up. If we end up getting relegated they would have to relegate all teams in relegation positions in all leagues.

if the season was to be finished next year every team would have very different squads, if for example Rons backers want to invest heavily in the club and all other teams in the league are severely weakened due to not having the same budget we could win all of our remaining games. far fetched I know but this is 2020 after all

that logic then no one is guaranteed promotion or championships so they shouldn’t be awarded either. Thus meaning void the season, which would mean paying back all or part of sponsorship etc.

its a complete mess.

 

[kentblues]

Every way of discussing it to me always leads back to the apparently preferred option of promotions but no relegations as the least worst option.

I’ve lost count of the number of weeks now that both this and the fact the season will not complete have been the logical end destination.

Whilst the endless dither and delay, the apparent delusions and fantasies, may harm the clubs by denying certainty it won’t change the inevitable outcome I suspect. We can only strongly hope that behind the scenes there has been significant actions taken and planned to help clubs on this basis and critical time has not been lost. If so the EFL has been hugely effective at keeping details of such activity from getting out...

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

But surely we were playing the kids? We seem to be splitting hairs and dancing on the head of pin to somehow separate praise for the teams improved performance when the majority were u23/academy, and somehow suggesting that the performance of the coaching team was somehow different?

They all together did a good job. The league position didn’t improve in part because how far we were adrift and in part because it was u23/academy competing well with other clubs first teams. So we should at least be able to agree the team and coaches did a good job?

Now if we have exactly the same team next season as now reliant on the kids of course we will likely find it tough. But I very much doubt that is the plan?

I don't think we disagree on your last point.Although where SUFC are concerned I often find it difficult to discern a plan. In any case,I'm happy to reserve judgement on SC and his coaching staff until after he's had at least one transfer window to bring his own players in.

 

[Murkey_Mouse]

My thoughts on this is that Liverpool should be awarded the premiership title , and from each division it should be 2 up and 2 down ,yes that would relegate us ,but we deserve to be relegated being 16 points from safety.

wrong as Bury was kicked out, leave a void & Bolton will go down too.

 

[Zeuss]

Yes, you’re right - I’d forgotten about Bury, so under my plan (2 up from every division down to National League) it would actually be 22, 24, 23, 24.

Your suggestion is, I think, those in automatic promotion promoted only (2 up from Champ, 2 up from League 1, 3 up from League 2, 1 up from National League).

Anyway, who knows? They’ll dither and delay for a bit longer and even then there might be legal challenges. I think everyone’s waiting for what Boris says on Thursday first.

You only needed to read my original introduction to this thread carefully mate.

 

[Austin the Shrimper]

I’ve just had a message from my step dad saying he has been told by a friend that’s a insider, that the season is being ended with no promotion and relegation. We will see.

 

[BriggBlue]

By

that logic then no one is guaranteed promotion or championships so they shouldn’t be awarded either. Thus meaning void the season, which would mean paying back all or part of sponsorship etc.

its a complete mess.

I'd agree that no promotions should take place either and the season should be voided as no-one is mathematically up or down so just skip this season and start a new one when it's safe to do so.

I'm not sure on the sponsorship thing as the sponsors will have got exposure, perhaps a small refund could be in order.

There is no neat solution to this and a lot of the blame lies with the EFL on this for not defining a method for ending a season early for whatever reason, in F1 for example each race must reach 75% distance for full points to be awarded with the running order the lap before the red flag being the final standings. Even their championship rules state that there must be a minimum of 8 races on 5 continents for a world championship to be awarded.

hopefully the EFL learn from this and bring in something similar, I doubt it though

 

[Chrisb]

I’ve just had a message from my step dad saying he has been told by a friend that’s a insider, that the season is being ended with no promotion and relegation. We will see.

I really think that is the best and fairest option - really hope your info proves correct.

 

[Boreham Blue]

As well as sporting integrity or whatever the phrase was, the EFL and Prem will be worried about the legal challenges. Voiding they would try and defend as being the league didn’t complete and so no outcome can be agreed. Promotion and no relegations would limit challenges to those mathematically possible to be promoted but not and so not too many (but still some). I suspect they will defend that no one has lost out compared to voiding but some have benefited from promotion. With relegations you add to that all those relegated but who mathematically could have stayed up which adds an additional group. I thinking voiding will be the easiest to defend but if lawyers don’t think so then promotions will reduce the exposure. Either way I think the great escape should be our new theme tune.

 

[Stuart W]

I'd agree that no promotions should take place either and the season should be voided as no-one is mathematically up or down so just skip this season and start a new one when it's safe to do so.

I'm not sure on the sponsorship thing as the sponsors will have got exposure, perhaps a small refund could be in order.

There is no neat solution to this and a lot of the blame lies with the EFL on this for not defining a method for ending a season early for whatever reason, in F1 for example each race must reach 75% distance for full points to be awarded with the running order the lap before the red flag being the final standings. Even their championship rules state that there must be a minimum of 8 races on 5 continents for a world championship to be awarded.

hopefully the EFL learn from this and bring in something similar, I doubt it though

A little bit harsh. In Formula 1 (not that I am an aficianado), races can be abandoned during the race due to a crash, or abandoned completely if the weather deems the track undriveable. Therefore they have to have regulations given these possible scenarios.
These scenarios don't apply in the same way in football.
I therefore think that blaming the EFL for not having the foresight to have a solution to a once in a century pandemic is totally unreasonable.

 

[Ailsa Road Shrimper]

Similar in cricket, there is always a risk of rain leading to a match ending prematurely so teams are aware of where they need to be in the game to win it according to the duckworth lewis formula. There is no such provision in football, if a game doesn’t finish it is abandoned and replayed. So if this season can’t finish realistically we are going to have to abandon it and play again whenever it is safe to do so and with the same teams. Otherwise EFL would be making up rules as they go along if promotions/relegations are awarded arbitrarily on the basis of some artificial criteria.

As for the Premier League, I find their ‘project restart’ plans bemusing, as if the nation’s morale will be boosted by watching matches like Burnley v Watford in an empty stadium! I hope their fanciful plans fail.

 

[Shrimpergonzo]

You only needed to read my original introduction to this thread carefully mate.

Apologies, you have it there in a nutshell (other than I said top 2 up from the National League and only 2 up from League 2).

I could have done well to quote your opening paragraph too which said:

“I know this has been discussed to some extent on earlier threads but I haven’t managed to trace back to read all the views expressed,so apologies if this constitutes too much repetition.”

Like you, I don’t always go back and read everything previously posted either!

 

[Mad Cyril]

My thoughts on this is that Liverpool should be awarded the premiership title , and from each division it should be 2 up and 2 down ,yes that would relegate us ,but we deserve to be relegated being 16 points from safety.

I completely disagree. They didn't play a full season and neither did any of the clubs in relegation positions.

Almost every season some team chokes or pulls of an amazing run to stay up.

 

[Mad Cyril]

I wonder how much pressure gambling firms are exerting.

This must be killing them.

 

[Ricey]

I really think that is the best and fairest option - really hope your info proves correct.

Totally agree.

I got some **** on Twitter for saying it was the fairest option. This was pretty early on into lockdown funny how most of those people have now changed their opinions on it.

 

[kentblues]

It’s an important point that I think the league is decided over a full season- everyone playing each other home and away. There is no provision for the league to be decided at an earlier point hence voiding may be therefore in line the leagues rules and regulations

 

[Mick]

I wonder how much pressure gambling firms are exerting.

This must be killing them.

Every cloud .....