Labour/SNP coalition

[callan]

Well I never.

Tory MPs 'Wrong' To Claim Gay Marriage Was Not In Manifesto is the headline - so that means that large amounts of Tory MP's voted against a law that was in their own manifesto - classic Cameron!

thanks for posting that up.

I don't suppose it's the first time that has happened and It was a free vote with no whip as already mentioned.

Can't really see the issue.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

No because they will be a much smaller player compared to the Lib Dems and because the UK parliament is not such a big deal to them, they will be focussed on the Scottish Parliament. Apart from a referendum - which Cameron already gave them - their policies are largely the same as the Labour Party anyway. You won't notice they are there.

The party that want to split the Union - they had a vote and lost. Cameron promoted that idea from nowhere and now they are likely to have lots more MPs in the Better Together UK Parliament. Davey Cameron really doesn't think things through does he.[/QUOTE]

He isn't on his own.

If as you say they will be focusing on Scottish Parliament then surely this devalues any representation they may have at Westminster or in the make up of Government.


The path to an in/out vote from the Union was promised by Labour - delivered by the Tories, lets not overlook that.

devaluing parliament is UKIP in the EU Parliament as it is one they don't want to exist. SNP I believe would merely support Labour policy as other than the one they have already had and the one that is off limits their policies will be very similar

a Tory government I would expect to follow their own policies rather than Labour's. There is also a big difference in Scotland to 'would you like to leave a Tory led UK parliament' and 'would you like to leave a Labour led UK parliament' - the no vote would have been much more euphoric and not have led to the panic bargaining.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

I don't suppose it's the first time that has happened and It was a free vote with no whip as already mentioned.

Can't really see the issue.

Only policy of this government that I can think of that I wholeheartedly supported - issue is that their own supporters and MPs didn't support it and party membership plummeted.

 

[callan]

Only policy of this government that I can think of that I wholeheartedly supported - issue is that their own supporters and MPs didn't support it and party membership plummeted.

eh?

There were more tories voted for than against....not suggesting that there wasn't any that didn't support it but then there were labour votes against it as well.

If the vote was on Trident, labour according to Barna's figures would be in the same predicament.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

eh?

There were more tories voted for than against....not suggesting that there wasn't any that didn't support it but then there were labour votes against it as well.

If the vote was on Trident, labour according to Barna's figures would be in the same predicament.

Gay marriage - how MPs voted
Conservative - 127 for, 136 against
Labour 217 for, 22 against

Trident I doubt will be voted on and though the value would be an issue for some I doubt it would end as a vote against party policy. Lots of members are against Trident but it's not an issue that would lead to defections I doubt.

 

[callan]

devaluing parliament is UKIP in the EU Parliament as it is one they don't want to exist. SNP I believe would merely support Labour policy as other than the one they have already had and the one that is off limits their policies will be very similar

a Tory government I would expect to follow their own policies rather than Labour's. There is also a big difference in Scotland to 'would you like to leave a Tory led UK parliament' and 'would you like to leave a Labour led UK parliament' - the no vote would have been much more euphoric and not have led to the panic bargaining.

I think it's plain to see how popular Labour are currently in Scotland.

Panic bargaining is exactly what will happen if labour use the snp to form a government.
If Labour will not offer the people a referendum on Europe how then can they do a deal with the SNP and risk the union.

 

[callan]

Gay marriage - how MPs voted
Conservative - 127 for, 136 against
Labour 217 for, 22 against

Trident I doubt will be voted on and though the value would be an issue for some I doubt it would end as a vote against party policy. Lots of members are against Trident but it's not an issue that would lead to defections I doubt.

Not sure but the budget for Trident may be voted on.
As for defections how many Scottish voters are coming away from labour to support a party that would abolish trident?
I would be careful what you doubt.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

I think it's plain to see how popular Labour are currently in Scotland.

Panic bargaining is exactly what will happen if labour use the snp to form a government.
If Labour will not offer the people a referendum on Europe how then can they do a deal with the SNP and risk the union.

its more that the SNP have become more popular in light of the referendum.

EU and SNP are not connected, the Union was the risk of the current government so the next government won't need to take that chance. I don't know why 50 SNP MPs would be so powerful - I think you have a higher opinion of their power than they do themselves.

 

[callan]

its more that the SNP have become more popular in light of the referendum.

EU and SNP are not connected, the Union was the risk of the current government so the next government won't need to take that chance. I don't know why 50 SNP MPs would be so powerful - I think you have a higher opinion of their power than they do themselves.

In isolation they wouldn't be powerful....however in coalition government they would....you seem to be convinced that they will just turn up to support labour policy when needed without any agenda of their own which is of course an independent Scotland.
The reference to the EU and SNP is entirely connected.
Labour wont support a vote for the people to decide on EU membership as they don't want to split from Europe, so how can they work with people who want to split the union?

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

In isolation they wouldn't be powerful....however in coalition government they would....you seem to be convinced that they will just turn up to support labour policy when needed without any agenda of their own which is of course an independent Scotland.
The reference to the EU and SNP is entirely connected.
Labour wont support a vote for the people to decide on EU membership as they don't want to split from Europe, so how can they work with people who want to split the union?

Because they have just had a referendum and lost - and because they are a left wing Scottish party so will support a left wing UK party - if they don't they will get a right wing UK party and therefore lose a lot of their voters at the next election for leading the UK to a Tory government.

The he same way that pro Europe Cameron (he has always stated he intends to renegotiate and stay in) would work with UKIP - to prevent the other main party taking control. I genuinely think SNP and UKIP will make up the numbers if called apon to do so for the sake of their general politics if not their specific politics.

 

[callan]

Because they have just had a referendum and lost - and because they are a left wing Scottish party so will support a left wing UK party - if they don't they will get a right wing UK party and therefore lose a lot of their voters at the next election for leading the UK to a Tory government.

The he same way that pro Europe Cameron (he has always stated he intends to renegotiate and stay in) would work with UKIP - to prevent the other main party taking control. I genuinely think SNP and UKIP will make up the numbers if called apon to do so for the sake of their general politics if not their specific politics.

Pro Europe Cameron is offering a referendum regardless of how successful he is in renegotiating.
Pro Europe Milliband offers nothing but will work a separatist party, the fact that the SNP lost a referendum wont put them off going for the main issue that they campaign on.

I think the one thing that we can agree on is that there will be a mad scramble for power come May.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Pro Europe Cameron is offering a referendum regardless of how successful he is in renegotiating.
Pro Europe Milliband offers nothing but will work a separatist party, the fact that the SNP lost a referendum wont put them off going for the main issue that they campaign on.

I think the one thing that we can agree on is that there will be a mad scramble for power come May.

They are both likely to be working with separatist parties. Not offering a referendum is justified because of the fragile nature of the economic recovery - markets like continuity.

Sure will - May will go mental.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

So they have a policy but they don't agree with it.

Astounding.

I think you'll find that Labour's new intake of MP's in May will be the most radical for a generation.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Oh yes, how could I forget you being such a patriot. Come on then genius, what replaces austerity to rebuild the economy and lead us all to the promised land.

I'm afraid you'll just have to wait for Labour's manifesto to come out at the end of March,which bty,is when the official election campaign begins.

I dunno about giving them Trident, I wouldn't trust them with a pea-shooter. I fail to see how going into coalition with a party that wants to split the union can possibly be seen as a good thing. Granted, Cameron showed absolutely no back bone with giving them a referendum but I'll have a gentleman's bet with you right now that one of the conditions for coalition will be another vote for independence and bigger budgets for Scotland at the rest of the UK's expense.

There won't, of course,be a formal coalition between Labour and the SNP after the election.

More likely to be a "confidence and supply" agreement.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Alastair Campbell:

@campbellclaret: Can someone remind the ludicrous @david_cameron of the Tory/SNP confidence and supply coalition at Holyrood 2011 (with Panto Boy's backing)?

 

[londonblue]

I don't suppose it's the first time that has happened and It was a free vote with no whip as already mentioned.

Can't really see the issue.

I wouldn't be surprised by bunch of MPs being given a free vote, and not voting with their party. However, I am surprised that it was allowed to happen on an issue on which they were voted in. Usually these things come with a 3 line whip.

As *** said, classic Camerscum. Could this therefore be added to his list of lies, or would that be a bit unfair?

 

[Uncle Leo]

I wouldn't be surprised by bunch of MPs being given a free vote, and not voting with their party. However, I am surprised that it was allowed to happen on an issue on which they were voted in. Usually these things come with a 3 line whip.

As *** said, classic Camerscum. Could this therefore be added to his list of lies, or would that be a bit unfair?

Gay marriage is now legal. The overall sum of happiness in the country is higher as a result. This is a good thing.

Anything else is on the matter is just political point scoring bollocks.

 

[callan]

I wouldn't be surprised by bunch of MPs being given a free vote, and not voting with their party. However, I am surprised that it was allowed to happen on an issue on which they were voted in. Usually these things come with a 3 line whip.

As *** said, classic Camerscum. Could this therefore be added to his list of lies, or would that be a bit unfair?

Unfair...not sure.
I suspect the answer lies in whether you want those who represent you to vote on their own values of morality, or follow a party line.
Cameron allowed his MP's to do this....ultimately I don't think the result in this instance was ever in doubt.

 

[superblue24]

I think the bottom line is that Milliband needs to dispel these rumours of an SNP/Labour coalition and move to reassure voters, otherwise he (and Labour) wont even be a concern for Cameron come May.

The referendum has caused a lot of ill feeling between Scotland and England, so I think people will not want to risk the SNP getting a significant foothold in our government.

Not to mention the unrealistic demands of a £180 Billion spending spree, which would almost certainly see us go the way of Greece.

 

[callan]

I think the bottom line is that Milliband needs to dispel these rumours of an SNP/Labour coalition and move to reassure voters, otherwise he (and Labour) wont even be a concern for Cameron come May.

The referendum has caused a lot of ill feeling between Scotland and England, so I think people will not want to risk the SNP getting a significant foothold in our government.

Not to mention the unrealistic demands of a £180 Billion spending spree, which would almost certainly see us go the way of Greece.

I don't understand Labour on this one, any deal with the SNP could cost them votes in England.
They have already lost Scotland, do they not see that England and Wales may follow if they can't distance themselves from Sturgeon and her cronies?