Jeremy Corbyn's Labour

[londonblue]

Go on Jez! That 19% target is well in view now!

I'm surprised Smith is below Kinnock, although I suppose he wasn't really around long enough to affect things.

Back on topic, Jezza is really going for it! As I said apparently he's the worst performing leader of the opposition ever, and this just backs that up.

 

[Uncle Leo]

I'm surprised Smith is below Kinnock, although I suppose he wasn't really around long enough to affect things.

Back on topic, Jezza is really going for it! As I said apparently he's the worst performing leader of the opposition ever, and this just backs that up.

Yeah, Smith's ratings surprised me a little too - by the time he passed away in 1994, Major's Tories were looking really beleaguered.

Also, didn't realise that the BBC's Scotland editor, Sarah Smith, is his daughter.

 

[Firestorm]

Went to a local Labour party gathering at the weekend , not officially a meeting as the feelings in the party a running so high they have been put on hold during the leadership election.

The opinions were split, between those who support Corbyn , solely because of his political beliefs and ideals , and his unwavering dedication to them.
And those who support Corbyn , because of his political beliefs and ideals , and his unwavering dedication to them, but can see that his leadership abilities are poor and , as a public face, he is both uninterested and unviable .

The concern is , that last time the Labour party got a leader in who was eminently electable in the public eye, he turned out to be the biggest disaster going, once he got in and started to actually do things and it destroyed any popularity the party had

IMHO it really needs for Labour to reconfigure their "management" team and basically have a PR savvy , media friendly, "leader" who actually defers decision making to a small select group of policy makers. That way, I believe , they will get the best of both the political ideas and of the "politics of Politics".

The problem appears to be that the best socially political minds never want to play the games involved in politics and get hung out to dry on the most absurd of issues totally unrelated to anything to do with policy

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

Went to a local Labour party gathering at the weekend , not officially a meeting as the feelings in the party a running so high they have been put on hold during the leadership election.

The opinions were split, between those who support Corbyn , solely because of his political beliefs and ideals , and his unwavering dedication to them.
And those who support Corbyn , because of his political beliefs and ideals , and his unwavering dedication to them, but can see that his leadership abilities are poor and , as a public face, he is both uninterested and unviable .

The concern is , that last time the Labour party got a leader in who was eminently electable in the public eye, he turned out to be the biggest disaster going, once he got in and started to actually do things and it destroyed any popularity the party had

IMHO it really needs for Labour to reconfigure their "management" team and basically have a PR savvy , media friendly, "leader" who actually defers decision making to a small select group of policy makers. That way, I believe , they will get the best of both the political ideas and of the "politics of Politics".

The problem appears to be that the best socially political minds never want to play the games involved in politics and get hung out to dry on the most absurd of issues totally unrelated to anything to do with policy

So Tony Blair destroyed any popularity that the Labour party had? Read that back to yourself and have a look at the graph earlier in the thread. It's plainly bollocks on stilts.

 

[londonblue]

So Tony Blair destroyed any popularity that the Labour party had? Read that back to yourself and have a look at the graph earlier in the thread. It's plainly bollocks on stilts.

He must have been awfully unpopular to win three elections. Whether you like the man or not, his centre left politics is more likely to succeed than Corduroy's far left. I know you won't agree with this bit, but from a left wing point of view I believe that a centre left Labour party that can actually be elected is better than a far left one that can't. OK, a centre left party may not be able to help everybody, but it's a darn sight better than a tory party that only looks after its own.

 

[Firestorm]

So Tony Blair destroyed any popularity that the Labour party had? Read that back to yourself and have a look at the graph earlier in the thread. It's plainly bollocks on stilts.

Sorry, I must have missed you and your delightful turns of phrase , on Saturday when this was being discussed.

 

[Gremlin]

Got a mate working there atm for the British Council.

He's no wild eyed lefty but a solid Labour man from Newcastle.He reckons the reports in the Western media about shortages etc have been wildly exagerated.

Then I bet the Grauniad wish their recent set of financial figures were similarly exaggerated.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...s-border-to-colombia-to-buy-food-and-medicine

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/05/venezuelans-storm-colombia-border-food

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

He must have been awfully unpopular to win three elections. Whether you like the man or not, his centre left politics is more likely to succeed than Corduroy's far left. I know you won't agree with this bit, but from a left wing point of view I believe that a centre left Labour party that can actually be elected is better than a far left one that can't. OK, a centre left party may not be able to help everybody, but it's a darn sight better than a tory party that only looks after its own.

I do agree with you to a degree. I would prefer a true party of the hard left if there was also a truly right wing party, but that is sadly not the case. If the Tories are going to continue to be so wishy washy then I would prefer a centrist Labour party that is electable, will not plunge the country into socialist ruin and can keep the Tories on their toes. So much so, that I indeed voted for Blair in 1997. I have actually voted for Labour more recently than I have voted Conservative.

 

[londonblue]

I do agree with you to a degree. I would prefer a true party of the hard left if there was also a truly right wing party, but that is sadly not the case. If the Tories are going to continue to be so wishy washy then I would prefer a centrist Labour party that is electable, will not plunge the country into socialist ruin and can keep the Tories on their toes. So much so, that I indeed voted for Blair in 1997. I have actually voted for Labour more recently than I have voted Conservative.

I guess it all comes down to a normal distribution of the electorate! Centrist parties are always going to gain more votes, be they left or right.

Oh, and I refuse to believe you have ever voted Labour. You've just lost loads of right wing street cred points!

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

In his own words

https://www.theguardian.com/international

Excellent Owen Jones interview with Jeremy Corbyn above.

Essential viewing for all those on the left.Keep the faith.

 

[Bielzibubz]

What? Faith in the fact that no matter how popular he is with the PLP and grass roots Labour socialists, with him and his wishy washy leadership skill set steering the ship the Labour party has absolutely no chance of ever coming to power.

But that's not his intention is it, actually getting in to No10. He always has been and always will be about making a statement and having an opinion rather than actually doing something about something from a position of power.

 

[rigsby]

Went to a local Labour party gathering at the weekend , not officially a meeting as the feelings in the party a running so high they have been put on hold during the leadership election.

The opinions were split, between those who support Corbyn , solely because of his political beliefs and ideals , and his unwavering dedication to them.
And those who support Corbyn , because of his political beliefs and ideals , and his unwavering dedication to them, but can see that his leadership abilities are poor and , as a public face, he is both uninterested and unviable .

The concern is , that last time the Labour party got a leader in who was eminently electable in the public eye, he turned out to be the biggest disaster going, once he got in and started to actually do things and it destroyed any popularity the party had

IMHO it really needs for Labour to reconfigure their "management" team and basically have a PR savvy , media friendly, "leader" who actually defers decision making to a small select group of policy makers. That way, I believe , they will get the best of both the political ideas and of the "politics of Politics".

The problem appears to be that the best socially political minds never want to play the games involved in politics and get hung out to dry on the most absurd of issues totally unrelated to anything to do with policy

Apart from the biggest political decision of his life that is. That's the problem with North London dinner party socialism. When they all had a chance to really stand up for the workers, they backed remain.

With a threat of house prices dropping in London and the loss of a big pay day in Brussels its easy to see why the people like Corbyn have proved all their believes and ideals are just a sham.

Still he has had a nice 40 year career sneering from the East Stand but now he's finally been invited down on the bench and allowed some input. We can all see it would be best left to someone who has half a clue.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

What? Faith in the fact that no matter how popular he is with the PLP and grass roots Labour socialists, with him and his wishy washy leadership skill set steering the ship the Labour party has absolutely no chance of ever coming to power.

But that's not his intention is it, actually getting in to No10. He always has been and always will be about making a statement and having an opinion rather than actually doing something about something from a position of power.

Apart from the biggest political decision of his life that is. That's the problem with North London dinner party socialism. When they all had a chance to really stand up for the workers, they backed remain.

With a threat of house prices dropping in London and the loss of a big pay day in Brussels its easy to see why the people like Corbyn have proved all their believes and ideals are just a sham.

Still he has had a nice 40 year career sneering from the East Stand but now he's finally been invited down on the bench and allowed some input. We can all see it would be best left to someone who has half a clue.

300,000 new Labour members in less than a year isn't bad going.

 

[rigsby]

300,000 new Labour members in less than a year isn't bad going.

For every new member you sign 3 desert to UKIP. But of course Labour are 'listening' to the people. :hilarious:

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

For every new member you sign 3 desert to UKIP. But of course Labour are 'listening' to the people. :hilarious:

We haven't seen any proof of this in the 4 by-elections JC has won since he became leader ((3 of them with an increased majority).

I suspect a huge number of the white working class, former Labour voters, especially in the North -who you're indirectly referring to here-will turn back to the Labour party from UKIP when they realise they've been had over the result Of Brexit negotiations.

 

[rigsby]

We haven't seen any proof of this in the 4 by-elections JC has won since he became leader ((3 of them with an increased majority).

I suspect a huge number of the white working class, former Labour voters, especially in the North -who you're indirectly referring to here-will turn back to the Labour party from UKIP when they realise they've been had over the result Of Brexit negotiations.

By-elections are like pre-season friendlies.....The result doesn't matter, unless of course your stupid enough to think that beating Great Wakering 7-0 means you'll win L1.

Those of us who live in Britain and are in touch with those dreadful working class Northerners, can tell you the watered down Brexit you so cling to will only make them even more determined for political change. Unlike you their principles and core believes don't sway with what is cool at the time with the London political elite.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

By-elections are like pre-season friendlies.....The result doesn't matter, unless of course your stupid enough to think that beating Great Wakering 7-0 means you'll win L1.

Those of us who live in Britain and are in touch with those dreadful working class Northerners, can tell you the watered down Brexit you so cling to will only make them even more determined for political change. Unlike you their principles and core believes don't sway with what is cool at the time with the London political elite.

We'll have to wait and see about UKIP voters in the North.

If there's a G/E in the next couple of years, UKIP might pick up a couple of seats.If they have to wait until 2020,that's less likely.

Actually,the present day Labour party is one I'd be happy to join if I were still living in the UK,unlike the one I was glad to leave in the mid-seventies.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

For every new member you sign 3 desert to UKIP. But of course Labour are 'listening' to the people. :hilarious:

that would mean the membership would be in negative figures rather than over half a million people. Everything else you have written here is outlandish opinion that I can't be arsed to unpick but this is straight forward nonsense maths - so we can use that as a yardstick for your other posts.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

I'm surprised Smith is below Kinnock, although I suppose he wasn't really around long enough to affect things.

Back on topic, Jezza is really going for it! As I said apparently he's the worst performing leader of the opposition ever, and this just backs that up.

First Labour leadership debate this evening - what were your thoughts on the performance of the two candidates?

 

[callan]

Last nights debate epitomised to me what is wrong with the Labour Party.

Is it Corbyns Labour people want ? which undoubtedly has appeal if membership numbers are anything to go by, however whether the electorate is buying into it is another matter entirely, and 172 Labour Mp's certainly aren't....and those Mp's were appointed by the public not by a membership.

Smith on the other hand is clearly in agreement with most of what Corbyns says even though as he pointed out, Labour were for a long time since the GE bereft of policies, indeed it seems to me as though it is only now that the Labour party seem to be waking up.

As for the debate itself for me Corbyn edged it, not because he came out with anything particularly brilliant, but stuck to his script far better than Smith, but both were lacklustre and offered little hope to those that they seek to represent....the sound bytes were there certainly.... but for me that's all it was.