Brexit negotiations thread

[Tangled up in Blue]

The rights of EU nationals living over here is already pretty damn good, arguably better than for our (far fewer) nationals that reside within the EU empire.

No.Actually they're currently the same.Which is what all the fuss is about post Brexit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-could-fail-after-johnsons-go-whistle-remarks

The (European) parliament is demanding that the UK match existing rights enjoyed by EU citizens living in Britain and say its alternative suggestion of a new “settled status” system would be bureaucratic and unsettling.

“We find that the proposal by the UK is absolutely not what we need,” Verhofstadt told the parliament’s committee on constitutional affairs. “It falls short in respecting the rights that EU nationals have on family reunification, rights to participate in local elections and falls short on simplicity … it creates second-class citizenship for EU nationals.”

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

Negociations proving a bit one-sided at the moment. There again, if there's only one side who know what they are negociating about, it doesn't really come as a big surprise. Utter shambles at the moment from the UK point of view. Of course that's my point of view, I'm sure there are many on here who are convinced the UK approach is to confuse, bemuse and bamboozle the EU into submission. Next thing is, we'll send in Noel Edmunds for a round of 'deal or no deal.' :smile: Well, he surely couldn't do worse than the present team.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Negociations proving a bit one-sided at the moment. There again, if there's only one side who know what they are negociating about, it doesn't really come as a big surprise. Utter shambles at the moment from the UK point of view. Of course that's my point of view, I'm sure there are many on here who are convinced the UK approach is to confuse, bemuse and bamboozle the EU into submission. Next thing is, we'll send in Noel Edmunds for a round of 'deal or no deal.' :smile: Well, he surely couldn't do worse than the present team.

Personally,I think the problem is that the UK thinks it's in a position to dictate the terms of Brexit to the rest of the EU.It's not.QED.

 

[callan]

Negociations proving a bit one-sided at the moment. There again, if there's only one side who know what they are negociating about, it doesn't really come as a big surprise. Utter shambles at the moment from the UK point of view. Of course that's my point of view, I'm sure there are many on here who are convinced the UK approach is to confuse, bemuse and bamboozle the EU into submission. Next thing is, we'll send in Noel Edmunds for a round of 'deal or no deal.' :smile: Well, he surely couldn't do worse than the present team.

They could be considered one sided, if anything had been agreed yet that either side had compromised on.

What is apparent, is that the EU are clear in their own objectives whilst the UK are sandwiched in delivering an exit that needs to meet the expectations of leavers and deferring to the concerns of the remain side.....which is a difficult balancing act.

Mays incompetence in the GE has further weakened the UK's position, in as much that she said let's make this about Brexit then hid away without mentioning it.

Her Lancaster house speech pretty much lies in tatters, and I would now expect to see a lot of on the hoof decision making.

The uk team have probably got until the German elections to sort themselves out.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

They could be considered one sided, if anything had been agreed yet that either side had compromised on.

What is apparent, is that the EU are clear in their own objectives whilst the UK are sandwiched in delivering an exit that needs to meet the expectations of leavers and deferring to the concerns of the remain side.....which is a difficult balancing act.

Mays incompetence in the GE has further weakened the UK's position, in as much that she said let's make this about Brexit then hid away without mentioning it.

Her Lancaster house speech pretty much lies in tatters, and I would now expect to see a lot of on the hoof decision making.

The uk team have probably got until the German elections to sort themselves out.

Even the Express looks as though they accept we will have to give up on this one.................it's Boris who looks as though he's whistling in the dark. :smile:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/82...nson-michel-barnier-negotiations-joyce-anelay

This is surely not the way it was supposed to be? Weren't we the one's, last year, who were going to lead negociations (the German's wouldn't want to hinder car sales to the UK) and obtain the dream deal all the Brexiter's hoped for.............all gain and no pain. Even the government isn't singing from the same hymn sheet (rebels sharpening their knives) and look as though they are going to have enormous problems getting their Great Repeal Bill through. The only reason May is still PM is because no one wants to replace her and take the wrath of the public for what will unfold over the coming years. If it's any comfort to May, I don't hold her to blame. No, the responsible one for getting us into this total mess is Cameron, who buggered off as soon as he saw the error he had made. Yes of course, somewhere down the line, things will recover and some kind of normality will be restored. Yet, at that time, looking back, I wonder how many people will believe the long, arduous and probably painful journey was actually worth it?

 

[callan]

Even the Express looks as though they accept we will have to give up on this one.................it's Boris who looks as though he's whistling in the dark. :smile:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/82...nson-michel-barnier-negotiations-joyce-anelay

This is surely not the way it was supposed to be? Weren't we the one's, last year, who were going to lead negociations (the German's wouldn't want to hinder car sales to the UK) and obtain the dream deal all the Brexiter's hoped for.............all gain and no pain. Even the government isn't singing from the same hymn sheet (rebels sharpening their knives) and look as though they are going to have enormous problems getting their Great Repeal Bill through. The only reason May is still PM is because no one wants to replace her and take the wrath of the public for what will unfold over the coming years. If it's any comfort to May, I don't hold her to blame. No, the responsible one for getting us into this total mess is Cameron, who buggered off as soon as he saw the error he had made. Yes of course, somewhere down the line, things will recover and some kind of normality will be restored. Yet, at that time, looking back, I wonder how many people will believe the long, arduous and probably painful journey was actually worth it?

The EU is a political project beyond reform, with its own flag, anthem, and currency in addition to aspirations for its own army....that's before we get to the democratic deficit and corruption.

It had the opportunity to meet Camerons pre referendum objectives....yet failed to do so.

By remaining a member there was every chance that the UK would have been swallowed up by this federalist super state that is being created.

I have always said that we need to look at where we are by 2030, and I don't believe that there will be many of us who will regret leaving.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

The EU is a political project beyond reform, with its own flag, anthem, and currency in addition to aspirations for its own army....that's before we get to the democratic deficit and corruption.

It had the opportunity to meet Camerons pre referendum objectives....yet failed to do so.

By remaining a member there was every chance that the UK would have been swallowed up by this federalist super state that is being created.

I have always said that we need to look at where we are by 2030, and I don't believe that there will be many of us who will regret leaving.

WE shall see......................if I'm still around! :smile:

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

They could be considered one sided, if anything had been agreed yet that either side had compromised on.

What is apparent, is that the EU are clear in their own objectives whilst the UK are sandwiched in delivering an exit that needs to meet the expectations of leavers and deferring to the concerns of the remain side.....which is a difficult balancing act.

Mays incompetence in the GE has further weakened the UK's position, in as much that she said let's make this about Brexit then hid away without mentioning it.

Her Lancaster house speech pretty much lies in tatters, and I would now expect to see a lot of on the hoof decision making.

The uk team have probably got until the German elections to sort themselves out.

I don't see the German elections as significant.

This is a negotiation with the EU and not Germany. The EU has already received it's negotiating mandate and is waiting for the UK to work out what it's actual position is (assuming it's position is not the nonsense coming from Boris, David Davis and Digby Jones).

Of course's May's negotiations are primarily with the tabloids (and the Telegraph which is essentially a tabloid these days) and not the EU. She needs to find a way of backtracking that she can sell to them. It's only once that is resolved that the discussions will really move forward.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I don't see the German elections as significant.

This is a negotiation with the EU and not Germany. The EU has already received it's negotiating mandate and is waiting for the UK to work out what it's actual position is (assuming it's position is not the nonsense coming from Boris, David Davis and Digby Jones).

Of course's May's negotiations are primarily with the tabloids (and the Telegraph which is essentially a tabloid these days) and not the EU. She needs to find a way of backtracking that she can sell to them. It's only once that is resolved that the discussions will really move forward.

Wasn't aware that Digby Jones had any formal role in the negotiations.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-40627328

Round two starts today.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Wasn't aware that Digby Jones had any formal role in the negotiations.

He hasn't. He's just a prominent Leaver whose case for leaving is seemingly built on not understanding how things work. If the government adopt his position we'll be in as much trouble as the students who are relying on you to understand business English.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

He hasn't. He's just a prominent Leaver whose case for leaving is seemingly built on not understanding how things work. If the government adopt his position we'll be in as much trouble as the students who are relying on you to understand business English.

Ha! I'm not a great fan of the former head of the CBI but he's usually a moderately entertaining commentator on political affairs,who rather likes the sound of his own voice.Sound familiar? :tease:

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I don't see the German elections as significant.

This is a negotiation with the EU and not Germany. The EU has already received it's negotiating mandate and is waiting for the UK to work out what it's actual position is (assuming it's position is not the nonsense coming from Boris, David Davis and Digby Jones).

Of course's May's negotiations are primarily with the tabloids (and the Telegraph which is essentially a tabloid these days) and not the EU. She needs to find a way of backtracking that she can sell to them. It's only once that is resolved that the discussions will really move forward.

I may have been hasty in posting this.

The substance remains the same, but if I'd waited I could have added to the list of Leavers spouting nonsense Owen Paterson who today said "If you want to pay for access to a market, you pay a tariff. Now for us actually, we would raise far more in tariffs than the Europeans would raise with us because of this massive surplus the European Union has with us"

 

[Lord Football]

I sat next to a bloke on the Brussels Eurostar last week. He was either working for Conservative Central Office or for some right wing consultancy company. He was typing some trigger notes on a laptop, which essentially were a list of concerns. (and course I read them, as you do)


Top of that list was that the EU know their negotiating mandate, the UK only sends mixed and contradictory messages. This is likely to result in "no deal".


Second was that at some point we are going to have to tell the people we can't deliver a lot of what we told them we could and we need to be careful how this is handled.

It also (which is why I guess at the guy's profession) commented on potential for there to be no leadership challenge until the negotiations are over and that May will simply be the sacrificial lamb as the Tories attempt to rebuild some credibility before a 2020 election.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I sat next to a bloke on the Brussels Eurostar last week. He was either working for Conservative Central Office or for some right wing consultancy company. He was typing some trigger notes on a laptop, which essentially were a list of concerns. (and course I read them, as you do)


Top of that list was that the EU know their negotiating mandate, the UK only sends mixed and contradictory messages. This is likely to result in "no deal".


Second was that at some point we are going to have to tell the people we can't deliver a lot of what we told them we could and we need to be careful how this is handled.

It also (which is why I guess at the guy's profession) commented on potential for there to be no leadership challenge until the negotiations are over and that May will simply be the sacrificial lamb as the Tories attempt to rebuild some credibility before a 2020 election.

If anyone else wants to pay someone to go to Brussels to be told the obvious I am available.

 

[Lord Football]

If anyone else wants to pay someone to go to Brussels to be told the obvious I am available.

You wouldn't like it. Its a horrible city.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

You wouldn't like it. Its a horrible city.

I like it for a long weekend!

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

You wouldn't like it. Its a horrible city.

On the contrary.I have a Catalan friend who works there for the EU.It's a wonderful place.

 

[Lord Football]

On the contrary.I have a Catalan friend who works there for the EU.It's a wonderful place.

All opinion. I work there quite a lot, and I really don't like it.

 

[Benfleet A1]

All opinion. I work there quite a lot, and I really don't like it.

Had to drive through several times. I'm with you, horrible place.