Brexit negotiations thread

[Tangled up in Blue]

Your a desperate man Barnas,it's over,suck it up.

Ha! I'm well aware that this won't change the referendum result,thanks.As long as Banks is found guilty of breaking British electoral law I'll be quite happy.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Ha! I'm well aware that this won't change the referendum result,thanks.As long as Banks is found guilty of breaking British electoral law I'll be quite happy.

Opening yourself up to a whole world of pain there from anyone with some time to spare on a little research. Sometimes it's just best not to say anything

 

[Bielzibubz]

And within 10 seconds........

Those in Glass Houses etc

 

[MK Shrimper]

Remind me, what did Momentum do to influence the Brexit vote BB?

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Your a desperate man Barnas,it's over,suck it up.

I think we all wish it was over but with 5 months to go still no deal.
When she finally admits she has made Brexit unworkable May will have created a lot of ex Tory voters.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Sorry A S S (spaces to get around the swear filter) who's to say it's unworkable? You don't know that. Think it yes, know it, no.

For every one that say's it isn't I can find someone that say's it is. No one knows at this stage.

All we do know is that what we've seen so far from all sides is political posturing and sabre rattling.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Remind me, what did Momentum do to influence the Brexit vote BB?

MK, me thinks you do misunderstand. I didn't post it with a reference to Brexit, more in reference to the fact that with Barna being so quick to want Banks tried and convicted of electoral fraud (if he's guilty) it's best not to shout too loud when in fact his beloved Labour aren't so squeaky clean (allegedly) themselves.

 

[MK Shrimper]

MK, me thinks you do misunderstand. I didn't post it with a reference to Brexit, more in reference to the fact that with Barna being so quick to want Banks tried and convicted of electoral fraud (if he's guilty) it's best not to shout too loud when in fact his beloved Labour aren't so squeaky clean (allegedly) themselves.

This is the Brexit thread. I thought we discussed all things Brexit rather than an unrelated Labour party issue?

(Allegedly) Banks has given substantial amounts of foreign (Russian?) money to pro-Leave groups who, in the run up to the referendum, advertised a multitude of false information, scare-mongering, paranoia and outright lies.

Banks' spend of £8M puts Momentum's £60K into a cocked hat, no? Yes, maybe Momentum broke a law, but Banks smashed it into tiny pieces, dug a hole in the Mariana Trench and buried it.

 

[Bielzibubz]

This is the Brexit thread. (Allegedly) Banks has given substantial amounts of foreign (Russian?) money to pro-Leave groups who, in the run up to the referendum, advertised a multitude of false information, scare-mongering, paranoia and outright lies.

Banks' spend of £8M puts Momentum's £60K into a ****ed hat, no? Yes, maybe Momentum broke a law, but Banks smashed it into tiny pieces, dug a hole in the Mariana Trench and buried it.

Law is a law, degree of breakage is neither here nor there if you want someone convicted of it and Banks hasn't actually been convicted of anything as yet but you clearly state he has, twice in fact. Know something we and the authorities don't MK? No, didn't think so.

Yes, off topic I know but Barna really is such an easy target when he types. Apologies for the highjack. As you were

 

[MK Shrimper]

Law is a law, degree of breakage is neither here nor there if you want someone convicted of it and Banks hasn't actually been convicted of anything as yet but you clearly state he has, twice in fact. Know something we and the authorities don't MK? No, didn't think so.

Yes, off topic I know but Barna really is such an easy target when he types. Apologies for the highjack. As you were

Not at all. I ensured I started my post with "Allegedly". Perhaps your devotion to Brexit is blinding you BB.

 

[pottster]

Its interesting in that everyone including the media have founds banks guilty already. What if he accounts where the money came from and it is legitimate.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Not at all. I ensured I started my post with "Allegedly". Perhaps your devotion to Brexit is blinding you BB.

Didn't see that. Accusation retracted

I'd hardly call it devotion. I have my doubts. I have things about it that trouble me. I have concerns for the future but I still believe I made the right choice in 2016. My decision back in 2016 was based on not what I was told by any particular media outlet or any particular political party or campaign. i based my decision on my own knowledge of the EU gained through having grown up being a part of it and seeing it for what it has grown into and also having a very keen interest in geo-politics and how the EU has got itself into the unholy mess it now finds itself.

For anyone that also has an interest in why we are where we are now both politically and socially with regards to the EU I can highly recommend 'The Strange Death of Europe' by Douglas Murray on audio book. It's a tough listen but it's extremely well researched, full of facts that should and will make you angry and would make even the most ardent pro EU campaigner stop and think. Narrated with aplomb by Robert Davies it's an in depth analysis of why Europe and the idea of a federalist, integrated and multicultural superstate has failed and failed so miserably.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Sorry A S S (spaces to get around the swear filter) who's to say it's unworkable? You don't know that. Think it yes, know it, no.

For every one that say's it isn't I can find someone that say's it is. No one knows at this stage.

All we do know is that what we've seen so far from all sides is political posturing and sabre rattling.

I thought it was obvious I was stating opinion not fact (99% of this site is opinion) and yes she has till March to make it workable but she has to find a deal acceptable to EU, DUP, ERG and the Tory Remainers before she even gets to the point where she will need to appeal to non Tory MPs.

The moment Labour racked up 40% in the early election and her reaction to that being to go to the DUP - that was when she made Brexit success extremely difficult.

If and when she admits she can't deliver Brexit I predict hundreds of thousands of Tory voters becoming non voters and others giving UKIP a fruitless mini revival.

Between now and March is a very interesting time for UK politics and I'd be very surprised if it ends well for May or the Tories. All in her hands though.

 

[blues exile]

Didn't see that. Accusation retracted

I'd hardly call it devotion. I have my doubts. I have things about it that trouble me. I have concerns for the future but I still believe I made the right choice in 2016. My decision back in 2016 was based on not what I was told by any particular media outlet or any particular political party or campaign. i based my decision on my own knowledge of the EU gained through having grown up being a part of it and seeing it for what it has grown into and also having a very keen interest in geo-politics and how the EU has got itself into the unholy mess it now finds itself.

For anyone that also has an interest in why we are where we are now both politically and socially with regards to the EU I can highly recommend 'The Strange Death of Europe' by Douglas Murray on audio book. It's a tough listen but it's extremely well researched, full of facts that should and will make you angry and would make even the most ardent pro EU campaigner stop and think. Narrated with aplomb by Robert Davies it's an in depth analysis of why Europe and the idea of a federalist, integrated and multicultural superstate has failed and failed so miserably.

Douglas Murray, associate director of the Henry Jackson Society and arch neocon whose views have undoubtedly coarsened and debased public discourse over the decades and prepared the ground for repellent rightwing popularists around the world. Anyone that has to enlist his idealogy in suport of their arguments reveals much about themselves.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Douglas Murray, associate director of the Henry Jackson Society and arch neocon whose views have undoubtedly coarsened and debased public discourse over the decades and prepared the ground for repellent rightwing popularists around the world. Anyone that has to enlist his idealogy in suport of their arguments reveals much about themselves.

Ahh, you haven't read or listened to it then or the facts it quotes and reasosns throughout the book.

Back to your Marxist cave my friend, toodle pip.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Its interesting in that everyone including the media have founds banks guilty already. What if he accounts where the money came from and it is legitimate.

According to what I've read, the money came from offshore accounts on the Isle of Man.
If true and proven,that is precisely what makes these payments illegal and breaks UK electoral law.I sincerely hope Banks is found guilty and has to pay a hefty fine.He's an odious,self-righteouss buffoon, who has had far too much (unelected) influence on UK politics in recent years.Not only that, he didn't have the courage to stand for UKIP candidate in Clacton,to replace Carswell in the 2017 GE,after initially saying he would.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...cy-over-suspected-offences-in-brexit-campaign

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Daily Mail are reporting that Theresa May refused security services requests to investigate Aaron Banks back in 2016.

 

[blues exile]

Ahh, you haven't read or listened to it then or the facts it quotes and reasosns throughout the book.

Back to your Marxist cave my friend, toodle pip.

I have read it and the main thrust of the book is paranoid fear of Islam, something which Murray, a staunch suporter of 'Tommy Robinson' is obsessed with.

 

[Bielzibubz]

I have read it and the main thrust of the book is paranoid fear of Islam, something which Murray, a staunch suporter of 'Tommy Robinson' is obsessed with.

Oh you have huh, mmmm OK

So the facts that he quotes time after time throughout the book, and which are all available to fact check, are all fiction are they?

If you can't, or won't, see the multitude of problems that unfettered and uncontrolled migration into Europe has caused these past sixty odd years, and especially the last 15, then you are just as much a part of the problem as those that have caused it and allowed it to happen in the first place.

 

[blues exile]

Oh you have huh, mmmm OK

So the facts that he quotes time after time throughout the book, and which are all available to fact check, are all fiction are they?

If you can't, or won't, see the multitude of problems that unfettered and uncontrolled migration into Europe has caused these past sixty odd years, and especially the last 15, then you are just as much a part of the problem as those that have caused it and allowed it to happen in the first place.

Much like Enoch Powell, Murray's arguments and conclusions seem persuasive, the only problem being that they are based on false premises, which renders them nonsensical. For example, the emotive and entirely bogus claim of 'unfettered immigration' you yourself use is transparently manipulative.