Post-Match Thread and Ratings Spain v England UEFA Euro 2024 Final. 20:00hrs 14th July 2024

[Target man]

That's the problem. People forget how bad things have been in the past. When you put it in perspective GS has done an amazing job.

The issue is really that he prefers a conservative style of football and people don't like it. It's been pretty effective though.

It has, but I dont think he'll continue tbh. If we're a going to change then some things need to continue, like the pathway he has created through the u 18s, 21s, etc.

A reasonable shout by some for the likes of Carsley, Cooper, etc to continue that delivery. Personally a combo of Cooper and Howe might work, though we just need a shift of mentality at the vital stage. Maybe bring back Eileen Drury!

 

[sufc4life21]

Southgate is lucky manager. The last 4 tournaments England have had easy draws which 95% of the English public would expect us to win. When we play decent side we lose..... why that, well the manager sets up in negativity way which invites pressure which ultimately leads us to fold like deck of cards. Why the sodding hell we sitting on the edge of our own box with the attacking players at our disposal, its criminal! We have some of the best talent playing for England who won premier leagues and champions leagues but yet we struggle against Slovenia and Slovakia its crazy. For us to go forward we need an attack minded manager who can get the best out of the talent we have. Our attack is our strongest area so bloudy attack.

 

[Target man]

Southgate is lucky manager. The last 4 tournaments England have had easy draws which 95% of the English public would expect us to win. When we play decent side we lose..... why that, well the manager sets up in negativity way which invites pressure which ultimately leads us to fold like deck of cards. Why the sodding hell we sitting on the edge of our own box with the attacking players at our disposal, its criminal! We have some of the best talent playing for England who won premier leagues and champions leagues but yet we struggle against Slovenia and Slovakia its crazy. For us to go forward we need an atack minded manager who can get the best out of the talent we have. Our attack is our strongest area so bloudy attack.

I fully agree, but:
1 - who is that man?
2 - will the FA appoint him?

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

It has, but I dont think he'll continue tbh. If we're a going to change then some things need to continue, like the pathway he has created through the u 18s, 21s, etc.

A reasonable shout by some for the likes of Carsley, Cooper, etc to continue that delivery. Personally a combo of Cooper and Howe might work, though we just need a shift of mentality at the vital stage. Maybe bring back Eileen Drury!

Not sure mentality is the issue with this current squad. Maybe Kane. But there was no sign of pressure getting to Watkins, Toney, Palmer, Mainoo etc. .. I think they're a confident bunch.

I think the problem against Spain was having equalised and grabbed the initiative, we then visibly backed off and started playing more cautiously. If Gareth was a tad braver and less risk averse he might've switched things at HT, as de la Fuente did so effectively - he could see Walker was a weak link and changed the way they played. Kane was struggling, as was Walker and Bellingham, you could argue Rice another possible one to be subbed off as he was giving the ball away at will. Gordon and Eze other options we didn't use.

Southgate had Gallagher and Trippier poised to come on until Spain scored the 2nd, which may suggest he was happy with the 1-1 and take it to pens. .. pure suicide trying to hold out for a draw against a team as savvy as Spain.

Having said all that Southgate HAS taken the team up a level where they are at least reaching semi finals and finals. Now perhaps needs someone to take the reins and progress the team further. But it has to be the right decision, not just a rash one. GS has fostered a good team spirit and made players want to play for England again.

 

[Target man]

Not sure mentality is the issue with this current squad. Maybe Kane. But there was no sign of pressure getting to Watkins, Toney, Palmer, Mainoo etc. .. I think they're a confident bunch.

I think the problem against Spain was having equalised and grabbed the initiative, we then visibly backed off and started playing more cautiously. If Gareth was a tad braver and less risk averse he might've switched things at HT, as de la Fuente did so effectively - he could see Walker was a weak link and changed the way they played. Kane was struggling, as was Walker and Bellingham, you could argue Rice for Gallagher another possible switch as Rice was giving the ball away at will. Gordon and Eze other options we didn't use.

Southgate had Gallagher and Trippier poised to come on until Spain scored the 2nd, which may suggest he was happy with the 1-1 and take it to pens. .. pure suicide trying to hold out for a draw against a team as savvy as Spain.

Having said all that Southgate HAS taken the team up a level where they are at least reaching semi finals and finals. Now perhaps needs someone to take the reins and progress the team further. But it has to be the right decision, not just a rash one. GS has fostered a good team spirit and made players want to play for England again.

I would have kept Mainoo on and taken off Rice ....who had an absolute shocker.
Walker also was exposed twice so maybe Trippier should of come on.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

I would have kept Mainoo on and taken off Rice ....who had an absolute shocker.
Walker also was exposed twice so maybe Trippier should of come on.

Or Trent .... he can't have defended any worse than Walker and would've provided more attacking threat.

 

[Target man]

Or Trent .... he can't have defended any worse than Walker and would've provided more attacking threat.

Yes he could and yes he would have

 

[londonblue]

It has, but I dont think he'll continue tbh. If we're a going to change then some things need to continue, like the pathway he has created through the u 18s, 21s, etc.

A reasonable shout by some for the likes of Carsley, Cooper, etc to continue that delivery. Personally a combo of Cooper and Howe might work, though we just need a shift of mentality at the vital stage. Maybe bring back Eileen Drury!

Agreed on the 1st paragraph. I suspect he'll step down. I believe he wanted to some time ago but was persuaded by the FA to stay on.

As for the 2nd, I really don't know who would be the best option. I like the idea of Klopp, but he has recently turned down the USA because he said he needs a rest. Whether that was really the case, or he just didn't want the job, who knows. I also like the idea of Eddy Howe, and maybe even Frank Lampard, but I really don't know.

One thing I do know is that whoever takes over (assuming GS does leave), it won't be long before some armchair experts will be telling us he was a bad choice because his tactics are wrong, and he doesn't have a plan B etc. etc.

Here's a left field suggestion, how about Sarina Wiegman? She's an exceptional coach/manager, but it would be arrogant and sexist to see taking over the men's team as a career progression.

 

[sufc4life21]

I fully agree, but:
1 - who is that man?
2 - will the FA appoint him?

I would love klopp but that won't happen. Howe would be decent but can't see him leaving Newcastle. It's true that there's real lack of English managers out there so whoever comes in would be bit of punt i guess. This would be bit left field appointment but I would be tempted to go down the foreign route and go for someone like ralf rangnick of Austria, his teams play high press attacking football which would suit the players which England have. Ultimately we need pro active attack minded manager, if that is foreign coach then so be it.

 

[stewart]

gosh i think the most attack minded manager in English football is the Aussie at Tottenham .
But that will never happen hes not a yes man to begin with. But a good manager he is.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

The crucial stage for me for me was when Nico Williams (a player I've always liked) scored early in the 2nd half..Never doubted Spain would win after that.

Williams was given loads of space, folks are blaming Walker but the system change from a back 4 (which would have placed Walker with the responsibility) to a back 3 and wing backs meant Saka should have been covering BUT he was no where close, as, imo, he should have been.
That was a tactical faux pas caused by mid tournament switch; Shearer kept saying we were playing as back 4 so some confusion?
Maybe the GS team talk had been all front foot stuff and a plan to get at Spain from start of 2nd half, which, obviously went tits up pdq.
#shearercraptalks

 

[TrueBlue]

For those still backing Southgate here are a few stas and facts…

Kane 1 touch in the opposition box in the last 2 games

England tournament XG worse than Croatia who went out in group stages.

Italy in the final on the ropes we let them win

Spain in the final on the ropes we let them win

We only won 2 out of 7 games in 90 mins

I could go on but the fact is with the players we have it’s just not good enough.

Southgate has been a good servant, no question on that but time to go.

 

[TrueBlue]

Not sure mentality is the issue with this current squad. Maybe Kane. But there was no sign of pressure getting to Watkins, Toney, Palmer, Mainoo etc. .. I think they're a confident bunch.

I think the problem against Spain was having equalised and grabbed the initiative, we then visibly backed off and started playing more cautiously. If Gareth was a tad braver and less risk averse he might've switched things at HT, as de la Fuente did so effectively - he could see Walker was a weak link and changed the way they played. Kane was struggling, as was Walker and Bellingham, you could argue Rice another possible one to be subbed off as he was giving the ball away at will. Gordon and Eze other options we didn't use.

Southgate had Gallagher and Trippier poised to come on until Spain scored the 2nd, which may suggest he was happy with the 1-1 and take it to pens. .. pure suicide trying to hold out for a draw against a team as savvy as Spain.

Having said all that Southgate HAS taken the team up a level where they are at least reaching semi finals and finals. Now perhaps needs someone to take the reins and progress the team further. But it has to be the right decision, not just a rash one. GS has fostered a good team spirit and made players want to play for England again.

Agreed we just don’t go in for the kill!!

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Williams was given loads of space, folks are blaming Walker but the system change from a back 4 (which would have placed Walker with the responsibility) to a back 3 and wing backs meant Saka should have been covering BUT he was no where close, as, imo, he should have been.
That was a tactical faux pas caused by mid tournament switch; Shearer kept saying we were playing as back 4 so some confusion?
Maybe the GS team talk had been all front foot stuff and a plan to get at Spain from start of 2nd half, which, obviously went tits up pdq.
#shearercraptalks

Funny I thought Walker and his much vaunted pace was ar fault too but ir was a good goal,IMO.

 

[Sandbach Shrimper]

For those still backing Southgate here are a few stas and facts…

Kane 1 touch in the opposition box in the last 2 games

England tournament XG worse than Croatia who went out in group stages.

Italy in the final on the ropes we let them win

Spain in the final on the ropes we let them win

We only won 2 out of 7 games in 90 mins

I could go on but the fact is with the players we have it’s just not good enough.

Southgate has been a good servant, no question on that but time to go.

...and let's not forget we were two minutes away from being knocked out by Slovakia in the round of 16. Yes we improved after that but we relied on individual moments of brilliance in this tournament.

 

[londonblue]

Williams was given loads of space, folks are blaming Walker but the system change from a back 4 (which would have placed Walker with the responsibility) to a back 3 and wing backs meant Saka should have been covering BUT he was no where close, as, imo, he should have been.
That was a tactical faux pas caused by mid tournament switch; Shearer kept saying we were playing as back 4 so some confusion?
Maybe the GS team talk had been all front foot stuff and a plan to get at Spain from start of 2nd half, which, obviously went tits up pdq.
#shearercraptalks

This is worth a watch:

 

[Rob Noxious]

This is worth a watch:

Interesting analysis and another hats off to the Spanish switch at HT.

 

[londonblue]

Interesting analysis and another hats off to the Spanish switch at HT.

Yep. Not only did they make a change, they had the players to expoit it before we could re-organise. You could argue that Saka should have seen what was happening, but that would also be unfair.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

Yep. Not only did they make a change, they had the players to expoit it before we could re-organise. You could argue that Saka should have seen what was happening, but that would also be unfair.

I agree, it is a team game and there were not, imo, any duffers on the field or squad.
Hindsight is perfect vision.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

And finally, and it is no surprise, break fast, move ball fast, move it forward fast, take the shot on fast; adds up to scoring goals and winning games on a lot of occasions.
Possession is vital although the OG statistics may suggest otherwise.