Pre-Match Thread HMRC v SUFC - FINAL hearing on 1st March. DISMISSED

[Stan33]

He said Iwas told i know .The thing still stands that we will all find out on march the 1st .So the only question is if the club goes into administation then surly any administrator has to look for offers to buy the club to wich at that point Ron wont have A say Bootsand laces is owned by Ron as is Roots hall .So i take it thoes two peaces of land would be up for purches .So anyone with a ready amount of cash could purches said land .Am i wrong .

Yes

 

[mattytheshrimper]

The clubs money? You mean our club the well known magic money tree?

I also said 'other peoples' money. Good cherry picking though.

 

[LeedsSUFC]

I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s some money arranged by the two MPs/the council.

Not your average person gets 2 MPs involved in a court case… Even if the venue was next to parliament and an easy 10 minute de-tour.

They and the councillors know how much extra funding will come from these new builds via council tax etc.

 

[Carl]

And if the person knocking offered you a fifth of the value, which is what Carl has done for the project, you would slam the door in there face and tell them where to go.

1. You don't know how much we'd raised. Crate doesn't - he only knows how many digits are in that number. That's not a number we've publicly shared for obvious reasons, anyone who has bought a used car knows that they don't shout how many pound notes that they have in their pocket. Let's just say that a 9 digit sum of money is a huge range - from a fifth of this 'value' that someone else on the internet has decided it's worth, to a pound short of double that value.

2. We didn't offer 'the amount' - we invited chats about an acquisition, and then chats about funding more generally. Proof of funds and ability to proceed was offered by us once we got an NDA in place, we didn't even get a response to that, let alone an invitation to start talking and providing that stuff.

3. The door slam we got was a total refusal to even entertain a conversations / further discussions.

Appreciate that the above three points might not have been clear to you, but I'd rather you don't add two and two together and come up with 53, peppered with internet rumours and your guess about what happened.

Posting this without any ill intentions / malice etc, but just to clear up the assumptions that are being jumped to...

 

[tommy tucker]

1. You don't know how much we'd raised. Crate doesn't - he only knows how many digits are in that number. That's not a number we've publicly shared for obvious reasons, anyone who has bought a used car knows that they don't shout how many pound notes that they have in their pocket.

2. We didn't offer 'the amount' - we invited chats about an acquisition, and then chats about funding more generally. Proof of funds and ability to proceed was offered by us once we got an NDA in place, we didn't even get a response to that, let alone an invitation to start talking and providing that stuff.

3. The door slam we got was a total refusal to even entertain a conversations / further discussions.

Appreciate that the above three points might not have been clear to you, but I'd rather you don't add two and two together and come up with 53, peppered with internet rumours and your guess about what happened.

Posting this without any ill intentions / malice etc, but just to clear up the assumptions that are being jumped to...

That seems to be the way of the football fan .rumours pop up and the fans jump on it if its true or not .Me i will still wait and see the outcome .Becuse no matter what it is .Its no good stamping my feet it wont change matters 1 jot .

 

[Carl]

That seems to be the way of the football fan .rumours pop up and the fans jump on it if its true or not .Me i will still wait and see the outcome .Becuse no matter what it is .Its no good stamping my feet it wont change matters 1 jot .

in life, we're all guilty of it - football fan or not - we always tend to fill in blanks. Thing is, we're all passionate about our club so it's completely understandable.

 

[TrueBlue]

And I would be done for slander if I named names! Still my opinion though based on what I've read across the Zone over the past month or so.

Name them

 

[WestStandBlue]

1. You don't know how much we'd raised. Crate doesn't - he only knows how many digits are in that number. That's not a number we've publicly shared for obvious reasons, anyone who has bought a used car knows that they don't shout how many pound notes that they have in their pocket. Let's just say that a 9 digit sum of money is a huge range - from a fifth of this 'value' that someone else on the internet has decided it's worth, to a pound short of double that value.

2. We didn't offer 'the amount' - we invited chats about an acquisition, and then chats about funding more generally. Proof of funds and ability to proceed was offered by us once we got an NDA in place, we didn't even get a response to that, let alone an invitation to start talking and providing that stuff.

3. The door slam we got was a total refusal to even entertain a conversations / further discussions.

Appreciate that the above three points might not have been clear to you, but I'd rather you don't add two and two together and come up with 53, peppered with internet rumours and your guess about what happened.

Posting this without any ill intentions / malice etc, but just to clear up the assumptions that are being jumped to...

you didn’t get a door slam the door wasn’t even open to you

 

[danbowen]

Name them

Blue43 lol

 

[TrueBlue]

Blue43 lol

The scallywag!

 

[TrueBlue]

In all seriousness everybody is entitled to their opinion.

“I may not agree with what you say but I will fight and die for you to have the right to voice it”

 

[danbowen]

In all seriousness everybody is entitled to their opinion.

“I may not agree with what you say but I will fight and die for you to have the right to voice it”

100% agree however it should be balanced at times and not always negative. There are so many rumours going around at the moment that it is stressful for alot of people and coming on and reading the same negative posts by the same posters every can be draining and depressing. We are in a **** situation but, and this goes to the viewers who need to see some optimism, there are options available to us:

1) bridging loan
2) sale of club. Just because its not going to Carl doesnt mean Ron isnt discussing something with other parties.
3) very unlikely but we could get an extension - for the record this is a hugely dangerous risk if Ron goes down this route and he would need some extremely good reasons when in court.
4) could the funds be released sooner for the next phase.

I will admit I am more concerned as the days go by about the future of the club but I still cant see us being liquidated on 1st March at this moment in time. If it comes to a week before and there is nothing sorted I think Ron will accept some form of help as otherwise he will be left with nothing.

 

[tommy tucker]

In all seriousness everybody is entitled to their opinion.

“I may not agree with what you say but I will fight and die for you to have the right to voice it”

Did i say you or anyone have not got a voice .All i said was i myself can not see shouting the odds and stamping you feet will have any impact on the out come in the coming days .

 

[Carl]

100% agree however it should be balanced at times and not always negative. There are so many rumours going around at the moment that it is stressful for alot of people and coming on and reading the same negative posts by the same posters every can be draining and depressing. We are in a **** situation but, and this goes to the viewers who need to see some optimism, there are options available to us:

1) bridging loan
2) sale of club. Just because its not going to Carl doesnt mean Ron isnt discussing something with other parties.
3) very unlikely but we could get an extension - for the record this is a hugely dangerous risk if Ron goes down this route and he would need some extremely good reasons when in court.
4) could the funds be released sooner for the next phase.

I will admit I am more concerned as the days go by about the future of the club but I still cant see us being liquidated on 1st March at this moment in time. If it comes to a week before and there is nothing sorted I think Ron will accept some form of help as otherwise he will be left with nothing.

Number 2 - this. For all we know, the reason he didn't respond more recently might be due to him having an NDA and exclusive conversations with an acquirer - that's not outside the realms of possibility given the state of the club from the outside.

Would have been nice to have a "thanks but no thanks" if that was the case, but I'm not going to get upset over something like that - if this is the case it'd be a wonderful outcome for the club and for Ron, I'm sure.

 

[Blue43]

Your comment regarding construction company's and how they will perceive working for a certain person or organisation linked to that person is totally correct. Sadly some people dont like hearing it but as a retired director of both a construction company and chairman of a construction trade association I can assure the doubters that buisness people do talk and exchange experiences etc as whatever buisness or trade you are involved in no one wants to get their fingers burnt !
So I for one will not believe it until I am actually sitting or standing at FF when ever that may be I just hope we get a new owner soon so we can end the toxicity being demonstrated on here and all just get on with enjoying the experiences associated with supporting the club we all love........

Unfortunately you’ve hit the nail on the head.

Some fans on here just don’t want to believe what they hear. They are so blinkered into believing that their Uncle Ron will finally deliver what he says and won’t believe anything they read to the contrary.

Whatever I post on here comes from people I trust and believe, otherwise I wouldn’t post it. I’ve worked in my industry for a very long time and built up very good relationships with these people and if they tell me something I will believe them as they have never let me down before with information they have told me in the past so wouldn’t imagine them to now.

If certain people don’t want to believe me and and start posting embarrassing comments like accusing certain fans of wanting Ron to fail and then the club goes under and we are left without a club anymore then I find this quite bizarre as I thought this was an open forum where fans can discuss their views, unless I’m mistaken?

Ive never wanted the club to fail. I’ve supported the club for over 40 plus years and would be absolutely heartbroken to see it gone but like it or not the hard truth is there is no future under Ron Martin.

 

[danbowen]

Unfortunately you’ve hit the nail on the head.

Some fans on here just don’t want to believe what they hear. They are so blinkered into believing that their Uncle Ron will finally deliver what he says and won’t believe anything they read to the contrary.

Whatever I post on here comes from people I trust and believe, otherwise I wouldn’t post it. I’ve worked in my industry for a very long time and built up very good relationships with these people and if they tell me something I will believe them as they have never let me down before with information they have told me in the past so wouldn’t imagine them to now.

If certain people don’t want to believe me and and start posting embarrassing comments like accusing certain fans of wanting Ron to fail and then the club goes under and we are left without a club anymore then I find this quite bizarre as I thought this was an open forum where fans can discuss their views, unless I’m mistaken?

Ive never wanted the club to fail. I’ve supported the club for over 40 plus years and would be absolutely heartbroken to see it gone but like it or not the hard truth is there is no future under Ron Martin.

The way it comes across is that you are so desperate for Ron to go you would quite happily see everything around him (including the club) collapse just so he is no longer part of it. That is what people are saying to you. Actions have consequences and if Ron was to decide to just go 'do you know what Blue43 really doesnt want me here so I am gonna go' then there will be literally no club left anyway. Some of the other laughable comments are people thinking that a protest is going to change that in any way whatsoever and saying 'well Scunthorpe achieved it'. That protest had no effect on the sale of Scunthorpe and their situation was/is very different to ours. What is the protest here going to achieve? Everyone already knows Ron has no money so its hardly shining a light on something that has been common knowledge for years now. He has even discussed this on TalkSport etc. As I have commented before you have a number of high profile journalists at places like The Athletic why dont you push for them to do articles on the club rather than a protest that will get no additional attention to people who dont already know the situation and will simply end in bans for fans etc meaning they will miss the good years when we have a new stadium and potentially new owners etc.

 

[tommy tucker]

Unfortunately you’ve hit the nail on the head.

Some fans on here just don’t want to believe what they hear. They are so blinkered into believing that their Uncle Ron will finally deliver what he says and won’t believe anything they read to the contrary.

Whatever I post on here comes from people I trust and believe, otherwise I wouldn’t post it. I’ve worked in my industry for a very long time and built up very good relationships with these people and if they tell me something I will believe them as they have never let me down before with information they have told me in the past so wouldn’t imagine them to now.

If certain people don’t want to believe me and and start posting embarrassing comments like accusing certain fans of wanting Ron to fail and then the club goes under and we are left without a club anymore then I find this quite bizarre as I thought this was an open forum where fans can discuss their views, unless I’m mistaken?

Ive never wanted the club to fail. I’ve supported the club for over 40 plus years and would be absolutely heartbroken to see it gone but like it or not the hard truth is there is no future under Ron Martin.

True there is no future under mr matins tenure but if he is telling anyone who will lhear what he says that when fossetts farm is complet he will stand down and let someone eles take the lead .Proof is in the pudding we will see .

 

[kentblues]

Number 2 - this. For all we know, the reason he didn't respond more recently might be due to him having an NDA and exclusive conversations with an acquirer - that's not outside the realms of possibility given the state of the club from the outside.

Would have been nice to have a "thanks but no thanks" if that was the case, but I'm not going to get upset over something like that - if this is the case it'd be a wonderful outcome for the club and for Ron, I'm sure.

Buying the development was in my opinion always a non starter for reasons given previously. Selling the club is a different proposition with a different challenge around timing I think. Timing in terms of valuation (stadium not yet built etc), contracts in place around the development and the outstanding inter-company loans that I assume would need to be written down/written off.

That all said it's probably not beyond the wit of man to come up with some structure/process that transfers ownership of the club to a schedule, and that begins with an "investor" providing immediate funds phase 1. I suspect RM has had discussions around this at some point but not with anyone sharing with us.

He has got a large land sale hung up due to a planning appeal. He was trying to bring that forward based on a discount to the purchaser (assuming purchaser was confident on getting planning resolved).

PS for those saying he never does any such business remember the VAT case against him where it was erroneously claimed he owed £5m in VAT? (well that would be on a £20m land sale to a developer to generate that value of VAT liability?).

Still favourite has to be the bridging loan but it might not entirely be the only show in town?

 

[Supa Shrimpa]

I see the Trust aren't going to get their £'s back as promised, then ! Quelle surprise (could be a new thread soon)

 

[Cricko]