Pre-Match Thread HMRC v SUFC - FINAL hearing on 1st March. DISMISSED

[Shrimpet steve]

It made zero sense for me not to pay my rent during covid, but when the money doesn't exist, there is nothing we can do.

Ron isn't playing some long game, he's skint AF and has to rely on loans and borrowing against assets to keep the club afloat.
I have lost all faith in him being in control now, Plan A not working ... fair enough Plan B ... things happen. But Ron is so far down the rabbit hole now, I don't think we will be seeing daylight for a long time while he's in charge.

Ron is NOT in control of the situation.

He always pays! This is nothing new is it? He always comes through! How much do u want to bet we don't get wound up and the tax bill is paid? It's like a merry go round it happens every year! Don't get so worried about it! In all honesty the reason why I'm not worried even if ron can't pay is the fact we will have loads of interest in the club from potential buyers local and foreign! We are a club with massive potential in a great catchment area.

 

[flangejackrabbit]

There won't be administration, it will be liquidation of the club, basically we won't exist by the end of March if we get wound up

Ron would be mad not to place the club into administration if this did look genuinely on the cards (though from the comments from ITKs it sounds like the bridging loan is pretty close). Administration usually puts winding-up proceedings on hold.

However I firmly believe he’s run out of companies to turn to for money and is struggling to secure the loan.

The FF development was a lot more profitable 2-3 years ago, but with a huge rise in building materials, property prices dropping and interest rates rising the end profit will be significantly less now than originally forecast.

I'm guessing the bridging loan would probably be securitised against a future contractual payment relating to the development rather than the property itself - believe the property already has charges on it.

That's it for me.

Bottom line is our very existence, all 117 years of it is now resting on a huge loan landing from somewhere, within 40 days.

This is not normal and not acceptable practice from the custodian of our club. Any club.

And the thing is, it was entirely avoidable. Another in a long list of **** poor decisions made, that are unforgivable.

It's **** poor but surprisingly common. How close did we come in the end under Jobson, 2 days was it?

Ron would have saved everyone a lot of grief if he sold off a small slice of the project.
He could have released a small piece of the project earlier, but not Ron , it’s just pure greed.

I believe a substantial chunk is already sold off to the Dellal brothers but things like this aren't paid for fully upfront. I'm guessing this is where the next tranche of funding (to clear the bridging loan + progress the development) is coming from once the training pitches are ready to use.

Ron doesn't owe HMRC tax (as far as I know anyway), Southend United owes tax. Ron might own us but we're a limited company and the whole point of limited companies is that their taxes are separate from the owner. Unless he's done something like using his personal property as collateral for loans (which wouldn't surprise me, I can't see who would loan us money at the moment without that) Southend can go bust and his personal finances won't be affected.

If the club was wound up, that would as far as I can see impact the planning permission, which would impact the value of the development, which I expect would have a significant impact on his personal finances - would assume he has leveraged his personal finances already to keep this project alive given it's been going on so long.

 

[Shrimpet steve]

Ron,what a guy!

 

[Supa Shrimpa]

He always pays! This is nothing new is it? He always comes through! How much do u want to bet we don't get wound up and the tax bill is paid? It's like a merry go round it happens every year! Don't get so worried about it! In all honesty the reason why I'm not worried even if ron can't pay is the fact we will have loads of interest in the club from potential buyers local and foreign! We are a club with massive potential in a great catchment area.

But, he doesn't always pay. He didn't have the money at the hearing, so had to get local MP's to plead our case, I don't want to win a bet with you, because I don't want us to go broke. But at what point are you going to realise that at some point he may run out of options and we could go to the wall ? The judge has said we have until 1st March, or that's it. Final warning! It doesn't matter if we do have "loads of interest in the club"....Ron refuses to sell. That's why people are protesting. To request that he sells to someone that has the funds to put us back on track.

 

[danbowen]

He always pays! This is nothing new is it? He always comes through! How much do u want to bet we don't get wound up and the tax bill is paid? It's like a merry go round it happens every year! Don't get so worried about it! In all honesty the reason why I'm not worried even if ron can't pay is the fact we will have loads of interest in the club from potential buyers local and foreign! We are a club with massive potential in a great catchment area.

Not sure the last 3 lines are factually correct. If we get shut down in 39 days time there wont be time for a sale. We wont play any further games, we will be kicked out the league and a new club will need to be formed possibly in the Isthmian League.

I think Ron will get this sorted but this is the first time I am genuinely worried for the club as the 'FINAL' marked on the case means no more lives. Ron needs to clear this debt asap and confirm to us once done. No point him making a statement until then as no one will believe a word of it anyway.

 

[meerkat54]

As many posters think Ron will come up with the so called bridging loan. I’m personally sceptical, my personal view is it’s time up.
If he is delaying the loan until the 1st March, shows total lack of respect towards the staff over the wages he owes them.
The bloke deserves the heavy’s knocking on his door. Ron is a total arse wipe.
Talk about a fit and proper person to run the club, he is not even a fit and proper human being.

 

[GBJ]

Don’t have to do anything legally to force him to sell but getting media attention nationally (or at least regionally or within football community) to keep highlighting the damage he is doing to the football club and its employees could help his continued ownership untenable if the message is sustained!

I’d argue that his ownership has been untenable for over a decade and his name and ownership is already mud, not only within footballing circles but the wider community too. I’m not sure how worse his reputation could get tbh.

I have known of several attempts to take control of the club in the (recent) past, but Ron inevitably isn’t interested.

I’ve been to the protests in the past. I’ve even tried the less favourable action of boycotting. What it taught me was, trying to remove Martin via these methods is a bit like riding a rocking horse. It’ll give you something to do, but it won’t get you anywhere.

I know that’s apathetic and defeatist - I might even be classed as a Ron apologist/supporter for it - but it’s just the way the situation has been engineered and I can’t think of any way we can break it.

 

[TrevorFitzpatrickHattrick]

The club and Ron are inextricably linked. He has no intention of watering down his potential returns from FF and has never been closer to reaping the rewards of the project. My personal take is that the Southend United were always a vehicle to get Ron to a better place and he just happened to become partial to the club. He enjoyed the adulation during the good times; the League One championship, the win against United, the MilStad and Wembley visits. He chucked more resource at the club than he could afford and in the process (by his own admission) made some frankly catastrophic decisions.

The reality is that we are, and always have been, in bed with a terrible property developer who's never (to my knowledge) actually developed anything. By hook or by crook, he's very near to that elusive pot of gold, which leads me to believe that he'll pull the proverbial rabbit out of the hat, pay the tax bill and we'll just about still have our football club.

 

[dusterman]

They'd look for suitable buyers first, of which there would be a number

Is that just conjecture? I don’t sense that’ll be an option

 

[Shrimper]

Is that just conjecture? I don’t sense that’ll be an option

A club like ours would have a number of suitors

 

[dusterman]

A club like ours would have a number of suitors

Apologies I didn’t mean we wouldn’t have suitors just that we’d be liquidated and not given the chance to sell?

 

[Shrimper]

Apologies I didn’t mean we wouldn’t have suitors just that we’d be liquidated and not given the chance to sell?

You don't get liquidated straight away. There would be a window for interested parties to come forward

 

[Whispering Bob]

Twelve years ago, but oh so familiar ;

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmcumeds/792/792vw34.htm

 

[dusterman]

You don't get liquidated straight away. There would be a window for interested parties to come forward

Oh right. Did that happen to Macclesfield?

 

[Shrimper]

Oh right. Did that happen to Macclesfield?

There were interested parties, so yes.

 

[lombard]

What does the Sh*** head Martin really care ? He hived off Roots Hall and the training ground to his companies.Leaving the football club with very few assets.HMRC will
not have much to pick on. As for putting millions of pounds over the years, is total tosh.
income stream from the football club is varied.Football league,Premier league,Pools,
season tickets, attendance money, transfer fees, sponsorship money, all contribute.Yes,
he then charges the club rent for Roots Hall and the training ground, without withdrawing
funds from the club.The pathetic share scheme at seven pounds a share, totally badly
priced, and not much raised and too many shares offered.Unsold shares reverted to the club,Ron{the Club}. This man is not capable of running a corner shop.Hopefully some
members of the council can see through his stadium scheme.If the club goes pop, hopefully,the council will try to limit the potential housing he will probably try to increase.
Its dark times for Sufc.Lets hope the club survives in the next thirty nine days, but I can
only fore see stormy waters.There are a number of Ron apologists on this web site,how
they can justify continued support is beyond me.

 

[WestyReturns]

We will only go into administration if Ron starts those proceedings before the next hearing, if he hasn't and also hasn't paid the bill the club will cease to exist

This was my worry months ago. It's now in his interest to let the club get wound up rather than go into admin as they would investigate his other companies and investments with admin. The whole pack of cards (Rons companies) would come down. The housing project is progressing so the need for SUFC to exist is less important to him. I believe he personally stands to lose more with administration.

 

[rootshall rambler]

What does the Sh*** head Martin really care ? He hived off Roots Hall and the training ground to his companies.Leaving the football club with very few assets.HMRC will
not have much to pick on. As for putting millions of pounds over the years, is total tosh.
income stream from the football club is varied.Football league,Premier league,Pools,
season tickets, attendance money, transfer fees, sponsorship money, all contribute.Yes,
he then charges the club rent for Roots Hall and the training ground, without withdrawing
funds from the club.The pathetic share scheme at seven pounds a share, totally badly
priced, and not much raised and too many shares offered.Unsold shares reverted to the club,Ron{the Club}. This man is not capable of running a corner shop.Hopefully some
members of the council can see through his stadium scheme.If the club goes pop, hopefully,the council will try to limit the potential housing he will probably try to increase.
Its dark times for Sufc.Lets hope the club survives in the next thirty nine days, but I can
only fore see stormy waters.There are a number of Ron apologists on this web site,how
they can justify continued support is beyond me.

good post. "apologists"...... is about right, and they seem to be orchestrated as well. more like stooges and plants.......perhaps the arch destroyer of SUFC is on here under different names. ??

quite sickening

 

[geoffmundo]

good post. "apologists"...... is about right, and they seem to be orchestrated as well. more like stooges and plants.......perhaps the arch destroyer of SUFC is on here under different names. ??

quite sickening

Yeah, but thankfully they are so easy to spot!

 

[SeldomSeenShrimper]

He always pays! This is nothing new is it? He always comes through! How much do u want to bet we don't get wound up and the tax bill is paid? It's like a merry go round it happens every year! Don't get so worried about it! In all honesty the reason why I'm not worried even if ron can't pay is the fact we will have loads of interest in the club from potential buyers local and foreign! We are a club with massive potential in a great catchment area.

Hi Ron.