Hard or Soft Brexit?

[Tangled up in Blue]

No it hasn't.

People will still be able to work and live in Europe just like they always have. Perhaps you would like to explain how easy it was even before Spain joined the EU

FYI,only about 2.5% to 3% of any EU country's citizens choose to live work abroad in another EU country.

I can certainly affirm that it was much more difficult to work in Spain before it entered the EU.

For example, despite having a valid work contract, ( approved and stamped by the Spanish Embassy in London,off Sloane Sqare) in 1978/9 and 79/80,I have no pension entitlement for these years.
Whereas, all the years I've worked here since Spain joined the EU have counted automatically to my retirement pension.

Talking with young teachers recently,getting a NIE (Spanish fiscal number) seems to be as difficult as it's always been.That situation clearly won't improve when the UK finally leaves the EU.

 

[rigsby]

FYI,only about 2.5% to 3% of any EU country's citizens choose to live work abroad in another EU country.

I can certainly affirm that it was much more difficult to work in Spain before it entered the EU.
For example. despite having a valid work contract, ( approved and stamped by the Spanish Embassy in Earls Court) in 1978/9 and 79/80,I have no pension entitlement for these years.Whereas, all the years I've worked here since Spain joined the EU have counted automatically to my retirement pension.

Talking with young teachers recently,getting a NIE (Spanish fiscal number) seems to be as difficult as it's always been.That situation clearly won't improve when the UK leaves the EU.

So you were able to live and work in Spain long before they ever joined the EU. It would appear that they could have refused you, say for example you had been convicted of rape or had no job to go to.

Now that sounds like a good idea, we will take people from Europe but only those that are of benefit to us. Just like any business in the world operates when recruiting. Its so simple you would think someone else would adopt that idea......Oh yes 18 million people have

 

[Bielzibubz]

They are the future of the UK and they've just been denied the right to live,work (and possibly)) study in 27 other European countries.

For the last 40 years that's been an automatic right,which will in the future, almost certainly, be taken away from them.

It was the older generation who voted overwhemingly for Brexit not the kids.

No they haven't, and never will.

(Highlighted) Oh, and perhaps you ought to do a little research before going off half cocked like you do. The free movement and right of work for every EU citizen didn't come into effect until the signing of Article 3 of the Treaty on European Union.........Specifically..............Directive 2004/38/EC on the right of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States; Regulation (EU) No 492/2011 on freedom of movement for workers within the Union; Regulation (EC) No 883/2004 on the coordination of social security systems and its implementing Regulation (EC) No 987/2009.

 

[callan]

They are the future of the UK and they've just been denied the right to live,work (and possibly)) study in 27 other European countries.

For the last 40 years that's been an automatic right,which will in the future, almost certainly, be taken away from them.

It was the older generation who voted overwhemingly for Brexit not the kids.

I would say to try posting this again minus the errors but there would be nothing left to post would there?

 

[londonblue]

No they haven't, and never will.

(Highlighted) Oh, and perhaps you ought to do a little research before going off half cocked like you do. The free movement and right of work for every EU citizen didn't come into effect until the signing of Article 3 of the Treaty on European Union.........Specifically..............Directive 2004/38/EC on the right of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States; Regulation (EU) No 492/2011 on freedom of movement for workers within the Union; Regulation (EC) No 883/2004 on the coordination of social security systems and its implementing Regulation (EC) No 987/2009.

Funny, I studied EU law as part of my degree. I could have sworn it was mentioned in sections 30-36 of the 1953 Treaty of Rome. I guess my lecturer needs to go back to school.

It's even mentioned in the 1957 version as article 48...page 21 in the link below:

Treaty of Rome

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

FYI,only about 2.5% to 3% of any EU country's citizens choose to live work abroad in another EU country.

I can certainly affirm that it was much more difficult to work in Spain before it entered the EU.

For example, despite having a valid work contract, ( approved and stamped by the Spanish Embassy in London,off Sloane Sqare) in 1978/9 and 79/80,I have no pension entitlement for these years.
Whereas, all the years I've worked here since Spain joined the EU have counted automatically to my retirement pension.

Talking with young teachers recently,getting a NIE (Spanish fiscal number) seems to be as difficult as it's always been.That situation clearly won't improve when the UK finally leaves the EU.

I would say to try posting this again minus the errors but there would be nothing left to post would there?

I've corrected the only factual mistake in my post above.The Spanish Embassy in London is off Sloane Square and not in Earls Court.

 

[rigsby]

I've corrected the only factual mistake in my post above.The Spanish Embassy in London is off Sloane Square and not in Earls Court.

You fraud. You have quoted Callan to the wrong post. You could work for the tabloids.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

You fraud. You have quoted Callan to the wrong post. You could work for the tabloids.

It was an honest mistake.

Though I'd imagine he'd still object to my post above, which was prompted by your invitation to comment on the difficulties (or not) of working in Spain before that country entered the EU.

Which reminds me, it was also very difficult to get full health cover before Spain became an EU country.Reciprocal heathcare and pension rights are just two of the problems to be negotiated with the other 27 EU member states when the UK opens Pandora's box next year.

 

[rigsby]

It was an honest mistake.

Though I'd imagine he'd still object to my post above, which was prompted by your invitation to comment on the difficulties (or not) of working in Spain before that country entered the EU.

Which reminds me, it was also very difficult to get full health cover before Spain became an EU country.Reciprocal heathcare and pension rights are just two of the problems to be negotiated with the other 27 EU member states when the UK opens Pandora's box next year.

A bit like your tax returns no doubt :winking:

 

[Bielzibubz]

Funny, I studied EU law as part of my degree. I could have sworn it was mentioned in sections 30-36 of the 1953 Treaty of Rome. I guess my lecturer needs to go back to school.

It's even mentioned in the 1957 version as article 48...page 21 in the link below:

Treaty of Rome

Mentioned as part of the concept of the EU in 53 and in the Treaty of Rome ut not ratified in to law until 2004 I believe.

Which was what TUIB clearly meant.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

A bit like your tax returns no doubt :winking:

My tax returns are fully in order thanks.I even went to have them checked out by a gestor (Spanish accountant) the other week, (as the tax year runs from January to December here) and he signed them off.

 

[callan]

It was an honest mistake.

Though I'd imagine he'd still object to my post above, which was prompted by your invitation to comment on the difficulties (or not) of working in Spain before that country entered the EU.

Which reminds me, it was also very difficult to get full health cover before Spain became an EU country.Reciprocal heathcare and pension rights are just two of the problems to be negotiated with the other 27 EU member states when the UK opens Pandora's box next year.

In fairness most of your posts contain errors so I can forgive you for picking the wrong one.

 

[rigsby]

My tax returns are fully in order thanks.I even went to have them checked out by a gestor (Spanish accountant) the other week, (as the tax year runs from January to December here) and he signed them off.

I always use a good accountant and I'm always pleased how little I have to pay after he has had a gestor at my tax return.

 

[londonblue]

Mentioned as part of the concept of the EU in 53 and in the Treaty of Rome ut not ratified in to law until 2004 I believe.

Which was what TUIB clearly meant.

What a load of rubbish:

Treaty of Accession

The treaty was ratified by the Denmark, Ireland and the United Kingdom who became EC member states on 1 January 1973 when the treaty entered into force. The treaty remains an integral part of the constitutional basis of the European Union.

 

[Bielzibubz]

What a load of rubbish:

Treaty of Accession

Then I apologise for my post. That's not how I understood the article I read. When I'm wrong, I'm wrong and not afraid to admit it :winking:

Edit: well, not a full apology but a partial one as if you read the full story of how, why and when free movement of peoples throughout Europe started, came about and continues this is a good read.

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/free-movement-europe-past-and-present

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/25/uk-banks-financial-firms-moving-ireland

Merry Xmas and A Happy New Year Ireland.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

http://news.sky.com/story/donald-trump-aide-wilbur-ross-use-brexit-to-steal-uk-trade-10707632

........and as for friends with whom we have a 'special relationship', like the incoming Trump administration, who needs enemies? :smile:

 

[Gremlin]

Brexit is a success even before it's happened.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/brexit-is-a-success-even-before-its-happened-tchftxp32

 

[rigsby]

Brexit is a success even before it's happened.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/brexit-is-a-success-even-before-its-happened-tchftxp32

Don't you know the forum rules about Brexit.....Only official Guardian links are allowed.

I mean why would anyone in their right mind want to think different from Guardian opinion in the first place.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

http://www.private-eye.co.uk/current-issue

Love the cover of the current Private Eye.Happy Brexmas all.

Adoration of the May,indeed.:smile: