Dale farm evictions "may breach human rights"

[Shrimper]

I can never understand why people like Osy and Barna want to stick up for and defend these law breaking pikeys. Barna isnt a UK tax payer so it probably doesnt bother him, and presumably Osy is unemployed and still poncing off the state so see's the pikeys as sort of comrades in arms.
Strange.

The only reason they back them is because they've been taken in by the PC brigade and aren't affected by them. If they were then they'd soon change their tune!

 

[osymandus]

They broke the law, the council didn't. There is no interpretation of the law there nor are there any mitigating circumstances. No matter which way you choose to defend them and their 'rights' the facts are the facts, simples.

Oh, and just for the record it's this bit i was refering to when I asked what the **** you were on about. "Be like me using the Health and saftey laws (regarding the keeping of fresh fish for public consumption)to remove a child's plush goldfish"


Now pluck my banjo and call me Cletus but no matter how hard I tried it came back as complete bollocks every time i read it. Sorry

My GOD you really are dense arnt you . The council would have broken the law had they not been stopped . The travellers have always broken the law , I've said that all along WHAT PART OF THIS DO YOU NOT GET . The last point I made was the it is ridiculous in the assumption that one law can be used in place of another BECAUSE IT CONTAINS A VAGUE REFERNCE TO IT .

Are you actually aware that my point is not that the travellers haven't broken the law but Basildon council have bent , dented and generally screwed up what should have been a rather simple implementation of exisiting law's. If some one has an understanding of an action or why its performed it does not mean they condone it . Nor does it mean you unquestionably obey a solution to a problem that in itself is flawed .

 

[osymandus]

The only reason they back them is because they've been taken in by the PC brigade and aren't affected by them. If they were then they'd soon change their tune!

I've noted people like you , Steveo and Bielzibubz are incapable of reading or processing information that divinates from your world views . This is both sad and frighting . Maybe it's time you all realised its not a simple world of right and wrong black or white . No matter what you were brought up with .

 

[steveo]

I've noted people like you , Steveo and Bielzibubz are incapable of reading or processing information that divinates from your world views . This is both sad and frighting . Maybe it's time you all realised its not a simple world of right and wrong black or white . No matter what you were brought up with .

And has it not occurred to you that if so many people are apparently incapable of processing the "information" you spout on an almost daily basis, that you are in fact talking bollocks?

No doubt about it Osy, you see yourself as some sort of clever bloke but lets face it, from the replies you receive and the PM's I get about you, it is obviously apparent that most normal people regard you as a total ****head who lives his life from an ideal world that he may have read about in a book written 5000 years ago. Wake up and get a grip on what's happening in the real world and you might find people will take some notice of you. But keep living in fantasy land and I expect the next 4846 posts will be the same old crap as we've already heard.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Osy, lets get this straight shall we. I'm sure in your head everything you say comes across as perfectly normal when you type it. Unfortunately not a lot of people see it the same way pnce your fingers have stopped. We all can't be wrong.............can we?

I'm sure given time I too could be as clever as you and have the ability to quickly scan Wikipedia, Ask.com and Google and then take snippets of the information gained, whirl them all around in my head until the bits I've chosen make sense, and then post the results on here in reply to something. Is it a natural talent you have or one gained through many years of personal training?

If your not defending the pykies of Dale farm and think they should be evicted then just come out and say it. If on the other hand you think they shouldn't then please explain, IN PLAIN ENGLISH we can all understand, the reasons why. And for us simple, backward folk please keep it as simple as you can. Ta.

 

[Bielzibubz]

If some one has an understanding of an action or why its performed it does not mean they condone it . Nor does it mean you unquestionably obey a solution to a problem that in itself is flawed .

My God we agree on something at last.

They broke the law, the council nearly did. They still deserve to be evicted.

Cool, argument over. :winking:

 

[pickledseal]

The longer it drags on, I feel the less likely it is to happen.

Either way, would be nice to loose the 50mph restriction so I don't have to break the law too ;)

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

The longer it drags on, I feel the less likely it is to happen.

Either way, would be nice to loose the 50mph restriction so I don't have to break the law too ;)

Thats a good point youg Andrew but no one is forced to break the law most people choose to break it,like buidling ilegaly,or driving over the speed limit or breaking into some ones house and getting stabbed to death,your god gave you choice,use it wisely.

 

[osymandus]

Osy, lets get this straight shall we. I'm sure in your head everything you say comes across as perfectly normal when you type it. Unfortunately not a lot of people see it the same way pnce your fingers have stopped. We all can't be wrong.............can we?

I'm sure given time I too could be as clever as you and have the ability to quickly scan Wikipedia, Ask.com and Google and then take snippets of the information gained, whirl them all around in my head until the bits I've chosen make sense, and then post the results on here in reply to something. Is it a natural talent you have or one gained through many years of personal training?

If your not defending the pykies of Dale farm and think they should be evicted then just come out and say it. If on the other hand you think they shouldn't then please explain, IN PLAIN ENGLISH we can all understand, the reasons why. And for us simple, backward folk please keep it as simple as you can. Ta.

Quite simply no, keeping it simple for your kind of folk is what has caused much of this mess . Churlish responses like this just prove the point . Do you say to someone in a race "I cant keep up slow down " or train to complete ?
Also any source of information and knowledge is a reference which should be sensible compared to others , so it says a great deal about the culture you grew up in to automatically dismiss any of them.

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

You foregot the BAZINGA.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Quite simply no, keeping it simple for your kind of folk is what has caused much of this mess . Churlish responses like this just prove the point . Do you say to someone in a race "I cant keep up slow down " or train to complete ?
Also any source of information and knowledge is a reference which should be sensible compared to others , so it says a great deal about the culture you grew up in to automatically dismiss any of them.

:hilarious: You really are in your own little world. You are one hell of a sanctimonious and condescending little man aren't you. Oh well, takes all sorts I suppose. So if, and it's a big if, I understand you correctly, you don't think they should be evicted? or did you mean you won't keep your answers plain for us simple folk.

This is like short mans syndrome but on a much more intellectual level :dim:

 

[steveo]

What he tends to do is completely ignore any questions he doesn't like the answers too

 

[davewebbsbrain]

You foregot the BAZINGA.

But only in a ball pool

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

But only in a ball pool

I think not young phillip,osys i mean sheldon says bazinga after every joke he pulls.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

I think not young phillip,osys i mean sheldon says bazinga after every joke he pulls.

They are hardly jokes tho, unless you are an intellectual genius :smile:

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

They are hardly jokes tho, unless you are an intellectual genius :smile:

Which is what makes them and osys funny in my book,as for genius alas im more racist gypo hater then genius,but at least i know what i am.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Which is what makes them and osys funny in my book,as for genius alas im more racist gypo hater then genius,but at least i know what i am.

I wanna know how Leonard got so clever...he was rather dim in Roseanne :winking:

 

[applelover]

I definitely don't think they should be evicted. Complete waste of money and they will only move somewhere else which will result in another legal battle. Have an amnesty on the site, survey every building and come down like a ton of bricks if any other structures appear. Also compensate any loss of property value for the surrounding residents which has resulted from the site. That's my practical point made.

People say they've broken the law, this is true. However the planning laws are an arse and everybody accepts they need to be changed. So I don't give a **** **** about them building on this land. I was much more concerned with the proposed 2000 new homes on green belt land on Jotmans farm. If you're from benfleet this seems to be the issue that should have angered you and not a few caravans.

From a personal point of view I'd go as far as saying i'm 'Team Gypsy' and can't help smiling everytime I see/hear/read angry reactionary racists getting wound up by each delay in the process. I work with travellers on a regular basis and for the most part find them easy to work with and extremely entertaining. Some of them don't pay tax but I hate tax so sort of admire them for doing so. Are there any self-employed people on these boards that can say that they've always been honest to the tax man?

 

[applelover]

Liberty to me is a key component of happiness and the following freedoms are key to liberty

- freedom of citizens from over-taxation
- freedom from excessive government interference into private lives of citizens (this includes our private property eg land)

Any liberal conservative who champions a small state must support these statements and yet I read several posters who champion these ideals lambasting gypsies for asserting these very freedoms. There is no logic in such contradictory arguments. Why attack those, using the do-as-you-likey argument, who are defying the very laws that you despise.

I'm not a supporter of classical liberalism or laissez faire capitalism as I believe that the right to work is also a key component of liberty. I would allow government to make interventions into the economy to guarantee 100% employment and would remove most welfare entitlements except for those truely unable to work. Problem of benefit fraud in the gypsy community solved.

If these three freedoms were guaranteed then the main gripes about gypsies (tax avoidance, breaking planning permission and fraudulently claiming benefits) from those on the 'right' (for want of a better term) are no longer an issue. For me the 'problem' of gypsies is largely the result of systemic failings in our system of government. Unfortunately gypsy culture, even more than the various cultires in the settled community, is dependent on the ideal of personal freedom. That is part of the reason that their culture clashes so heavily with a British system of governance and law based around authoritarian control and state interference.

 

[Bielzibubz]

I definitely don't think they should be evicted. Complete waste of money and they will only move somewhere else which will result in another legal battle. Have an amnesty on the site, 1. survey every building and come down like a ton of bricks if any other structures appear. Also 2. compensate any loss of property value for the surrounding residents which has resulted from the site. That's my practical point made.

People say they've broken the law, this is true. 3. However the planning laws are an arse and everybody accepts they need to be changed. So I don't give a **** **** about them building on this land. I was much more concerned with the proposed 2000 new homes on green belt land on Jotmans farm. If you're from benfleet this seems to be the issue that should have angered you and not a few caravans.

From a personal point of view I'd go as far as saying i'm 'Team Gypsy' and can't help smiling everytime I see/hear/read angry reactionary racists getting wound up by each delay in the process. I work with travellers on a regular basis and for the most part find them easy to work with and extremely entertaining. Some of them don't pay tax 4. but I hate tax so sort of admire them for doing so. Are there any self-employed people on these boards that can say that they've always been honest to the tax man?

A survey of every building will achieve what exactly? Exactly nothing if your they're not prepared to abide by the results of that survey (council tax payments etc)

Very difficult to determine exactly who and by how much the surrounding properties have been financially blighted by the gypos, and also sets a legal precedence for anyone living in the vicinity of an illegal site. Very dangerous IMO.

Some planning laws are an arse. Is that your reasoning for condoning the breaking of them?

Again, you may hate tax but is that a valid reason for not paying it or breaking the law by not doing so?


Laws that require changing can and should be changed by any lawful means not by ignoring them. I got nicked doing 5mph over the speed limit in the 50mph zones on A127 and got a £60 fine and three points but the very next day on a TV prog they showed a motorbike cop chasing four bikers and at one point they were doing 140mph and he couldn't catch them. When he did eventually catch all four when they stopped he gave them the option of paying £200 and doing a speed awareness course. Now, should I have not paid my fine because the law is an arse and not fair because cameras have no discretionary powers and coppers do?

If you care about the council building 2000 homes on green belt land then take out a private injunction stopping them, if that's even possible.

I own three acres of land just outside the Southend Borough boundary but because of covenants built in to the original land deed I cannot build on it. Should I just ignore it and build anyway. Part of it's green and a small portion of it is brown belt, just so ya know ;)