Dale farm evictions "may breach human rights"

[Tangled up in Blue]

Hang on a mo. So because you include yourself in your analogy it's ok then is it? And what the hell has being human got to do with their contributions to society being the same as mine. Barna, here's a couple of questions I'd ask you to answer please.

In the context of contributing financially and morally to the general upkeep and well being of the nation through taxes etc, do you consider their contributions to society to be the same as mine? And just so as we're clear. I've spent 32 years in continuous employment and all the while paid my tax and NI.

Do you believe that certain laws become unenforceable and/or null and void because they may impinge on a member of societies choice to live a certain way either by choice, circumstance or tradition.

Just askin like.

In answer to your first question,probably not.But then neither of us I suspect(certainly not myself)have access to hard information as to what the Dale Farm residents employment record actually is.
In answer to your second question,(and we've been through this before if you care to scroll back a bit),yes in cases where civil disobediance would appear to be justified cf Rosa Parks et al,etc

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Hang on, are you now criticising me for going off topic? Your first post on this thread was to start a political debate and I quote (in bold so you dont ignore it) "um..this is not right wing?"

Perhaps you could tell me how that comment was relevant to the Dale Farm eviction, or alternatively just ignore the question as you always do when your'e struggling.

The comment of mine, which you've quoted here, referred to your previous claims(on other threads) not to be right wing.
I've tried to keep my comments on topic throughout(where possible).It's difficult not to get sidetracked though, when everyone (and their dog),feels entitled to have a pop.I'm fully aware that this is quite an emotive issue for some.
However,(as I've said before), I don't feel I should have to tolerate abuse for an honest opinion, which I'm prepared to argue the case for rationally and not emotionally,like some.

 

[Bielzibubz]

So now your comparing the Dale Farm evictions and the rights of those living there with the rights of blacks during their struggle for equality? :hilarious: Priceless. Answer the question in regards to those living at Dale Farm. Because it's their tradition, or because they choose it, or whether it's because of circumstance, do you think the planning law and their breaking of it is both null and void and justified?

And there is no employment record for those living at Dale Farm because none of the feckless, work shy asswipes do an honest days graft. And just because a point can't be proved does not mean it's isn't true.

 

[Shrimper]

In answer to your first question,probably not.But then neither of us I suspect(certainly not myself)have access to hard information as to what the Dale Farm residents employment record actually is.In answer to your second question,(and we've been through this before if you care to scroll back a bit),yes in cases where civil disobediance would appear to be justified cf Rosa Parks et al,etc

Wow. Just wow. How can you compare the two?

 

[steveo]

The comment of mine, which you've quoted here, referred to your previous claims(on other threads) not to be right wing.
I've tried to keep my comments on topic throughout(where possible).It's difficult not to get sidetracked though, when everyone (and their dog),feels entitled to have a pop.I'm fully aware that this is quite an emotive issue for some.
However,(as I've said before), I don't feel I should have to tolerate abuse for an honest opinion, which I'm prepared to argue the case for rationally and not emotionally,like some.

I have never claimed not to be right wing. You seem to be getting in a bit of a pickle here Barna. It probably is a far more emotive issue for those of us living in the area as opposed to those living in other countries so its quite likely a lot of us will take some of your throwaway remarks as offensive, particularly when you keep insisting that as hard working law abiding tax paying citizens we contribute the same to society as non working, law breaking benefit fiddlers.

When everyone and their dog has a pop, does it not cross your mind that you might be wrong on this occasion?

 

[davewebbsbrain]

You miss the point that I was including myself in that comparison -to the effect that we're all human.(And in case what exactly has that got to do with "the propriety or otherwise of the eviction at Dale Farm)?"

No you weren't, you are backtracking because you made a ridiculously stupid statement that was downright rude to every SZ member on this board.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Just seen in the Echo,Basildon council might move the travellers onto the Craylands estate,those poor people are in for a shock,the crime rate on the estate is appalling,call in the UN i say.

I was brought up on Craylands, it isn't half as bad as people make it out to be. My parents still live there, right opposite the homes that the council are going to put the travellers in. The houses are due to be pulled down to make way for a new road on the estate but they are now hurridly putting new kitchens and bathrooms in the places.

The council forced people out of these homes, people who had been living there 30 years were sent on their way. They have been empty coming up to 2 and a half years now. If they are going to use these for people, let the homeless live in them, not travellers who are supposed to travel and live in caravans....or go home to the houses they actually own.

Who is going to foot the bill for these houses being re-fitted? You and me will, but certainly not the travellers who will move into them, because they do not pay taxes.

I feel sorry for my parents and everyone else living on Craylands. People on the outside may thing Craylands is bad, they ain't seen anything yet. Once the travellers have moved in, nobody will be safe, day or night,

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

So now your comparing the Dale Farm evictions and the rights of those living there with the rights of blacks during their struggle for equality? :hilarious: Priceless. Answer the question in regards to those living at Dale Farm. Because it's their tradition, or because they choose it, or whether it's because of circumstance, do you think the planning law and their breaking of it is both null and void and justified?

And there is no employment record for those living at Dale Farm because none of the feckless, work shy asswipes do an honest days graft. And just because a point can't be proved does not mean it's isn't true.

Is there a God?I don't think so.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

No you weren't, you are backtracking because you made a ridiculously stupid statement that was downright rude to every SZ member on this board.

Check out my original post.You'll find I explicity included myself in the comparison.

 

[pickledseal]

Oddly Oak Road was shut earlier in the week, but reopen today (this leads to Oak Lane aka Dale Farm).

Heard an estimate that the old bill recon it will take a month to clear out...

There was a lot of police about the village today but prob more due to the dead body found in a car there yesterday! Not only the travellers the residents of Crays Hill have to worry about...

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I was brought up on Craylands, it isn't half as bad as people make it out to be. My parents still live there, right opposite the homes that the council are going to put the travellers in. The houses are due to be pulled down to make way for a new road on the estate but they are now hurridly putting new kitchens and bathrooms in the places.

The council forced people out of these homes, people who had been living there 30 years were sent on their way. They have been empty coming up to 2 and a half years now. If they are going to use these for people, let the homeless live in them, not travellers who are supposed to travel and live in caravans....or go home to the houses they actually own.

Who is going to foot the bill for these houses being re-fitted? You and me will, but certainly not the travellers who will move into them, because they do not pay taxes.

I feel sorry for my parents and everyone else living on Craylands. People on the outside may thing Craylands is bad, they ain't seen anything yet. Once the travellers have moved in, nobody will be safe, day or night,

I'm glad you've finally declared your personal interest in this matter.Some people(not myself I might add)might think you have something of an axe to grind here.:winking:

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Wow. Just wow. How can you compare the two?

Civil disobediance?:unsure: Do try and keep up.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I have never claimed not to be right wing. You seem to be getting in a bit of a pickle here Barna. It probably is a far more emotive issue for those of us living in the area as opposed to those living in other countries so its quite likely a lot of us will take some of your throwaway remarks as offensive, particularly when you keep insisting that as hard working law abiding tax paying citizens we contribute the same to society as non working, law breaking benefit fiddlers.

When everyone and their dog has a pop, does it not cross your mind that you might be wrong on this occasion?

Could well be I got you mixed up with someone else(who's certainly a fellow traveller).:hilarious:
No,btw is my answer to your question(though it's possible of course).We'll just have to wait for events to take their course and for some hard "evidence" to come to light.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Civil disobediance?:unsure: Do try and keep up.

Jesus H Christ on a bike! One was fighting for the right to be treated as equal human beings and the other are protesting because they broke the law and that law has finally caught up with them. You seriously think that just because they both have a common theme, ie the 'civil disobedience' angle that they both have the same justification to law breaking don't you. :hilarious: **** me I thought David Ike was a wierdo but your rational on this is so far out there you should change your moniker to PlutoBlue. It really was quite a dull day up until now but you and your comments have really managed to cheer me up, cheers :thumbsup:

 

[davewebbsbrain]

I'm glad you've finally declared your personal interest in this matter.Some people(not myself I might add)might think you have something of an axe to grind here.:winking:

The travellers being moved to Craylands only came to light in the last day or so. I just wish there were moving in next to you. You would change your tune very quickly, I guarantee that.

 

[Napster]

Ok, Keith Jones is great as well. :thumbsup:

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

Oh knoes,the lastest appeal to get the eviction called off has been rejected,sad sad news.

 

[Bielzibubz]

BBC News:

"A last-ditch attempt to stop the eviction of travellers from Dale Farm in Essex goes to the High Court, three days before bailiffs are due to move in.
The travellers say they have new medical evidence that will halt the eviction which suggests that many of the residents are too ill to be evicted.
Communities secretary and Essex MP, Eric Pickles, says that the travellers have broken the law and have to be moved on"

Since when did being a work shy thieving pykey become a medical issue?

 

[class]

Reading the Echo today, there was a quote from that pikey or other than was in Big Brother. Apparently if the Dale Farm lot get moved on, they will be like fish out of water, and drown. :unsure:

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Reading the Echo today, there was a quote from that pikey or other than was in Big Brother. Apparently if the Dale Farm lot get moved on, they will be like fish out of water, and drown. :unsure:

We can but hope