Brexit negotiations thread

[Member]

So apparently Johnson (our foreign secretary) decided not to turn up to a COBRA meeting regarding a chemical weapon attack/murder in our country (potentially instigated by another country). May should sack him on the spot, but she won't.

 

[SUFC_Ross]

And Boris has resigned......

 

[Gt Yarmouth Shrimper]

For the good of everyone in the country, she needs to step aside.

Who do you propose takes the job on. It's political suicide and they all know it.

 

[Member]

Who do you propose takes the job on. It's political suicide and they all know it.

only one man for the job...

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

So apparently Johnson (our foreign secretary) decided not to turn up to a COBRA meeting regarding a chemical weapon attack/murder in our country (potentially instigated by another country). May should sack him on the spot, but she won't.

We're just a laughing stock, you'd thought they would have at least sent someone!

Michael Roth, the German Europe minister, tweeted his displeasure, saying: “We’re still waiting for our host....”

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

When does this become meltdown? Chaos, farce, pantomime, delusion are words that come to mind. The Brexit timebomb is ticking and the government don't appear to have the faintest idea how to defuse it, before it blows up in their face.

 

[RHB]

Bye bye Boris.

 

[Bearded Shrimper]

It seems to me, from my very biased position, that things aren't looking good. At the moment May is the best bet for sensible government. The alternatives are governments led by the likes of Johnson, Rees-Mogg or Corbyn. All are the hardest of hard Brexiteers and their appeal is based on fantasy and populism. These are not good things.
Politicians needs to do what is best for the country for once, not for their own delusions.

In my opinion we should apply to join EFTA and do so as soon as we leave the EU. Once settled in EFTA we can then sort out what on earth we do next

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Apparently the Cabinet has agreed (grudingly) to the softest of soft Brexits. What a waste of time.

It's not the softest of soft Brexits. It's a Brexit which screws services, when we are a services economy.

It seems to me, from my very biased position, that things aren't looking good. At the moment May is the best bet for sensible government. The alternatives are governments led by the likes of Johnson, Rees-Mogg or Corbyn. All are the hardest of hard Brexiteers and their appeal is based on fantasy and populism. These are not good things.
Politicians needs to do what is best for the country for once, not for their own delusions.

In my opinion we should apply to join EFTA and do so as soon as we leave the EU. Once settled in EFTA we can then sort out what on earth we do next

Christ, if May is the best bet for sensible government we really aren't in a good position.

If our politicians were serious about Brexit then they would be proposing that we joined EFTA whilst we worked out the details (which will take years - this got shouted down as Project Fear when I pointed this out before the referendum but look at how little David Davis has achieved in two years).

 

[Bearded Shrimper]

It's not the softest of soft Brexits. It's a Brexit which screws services, when we are a services economy.



Christ, if May is the best bet for sensible government we really aren't in a good position.

If our politicians were serious about Brexit then they would be proposing that we joined EFTA whilst we worked out the details (which will take years - this got shouted down as Project Fear when I pointed this out before the referendum but look at how little David Davis has achieved in two years).

Great minds

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

It seems to me, from my very biased position, that things aren't looking good. At the moment May is the best bet for sensible government. The alternatives are governments led by the likes of Johnson, Rees-Mogg or Corbyn. All are the hardest of hard Brexiteers and their appeal is based on fantasy and populism. These are not good things.
Politicians needs to do what is best for the country for once, not for their own delusions.

In my opinion we should apply to join EFTA and do so as soon as we leave the EU. Once settled in EFTA we can then sort out what on earth we do next

Are you ****ting me? You equate Corbyn with Johnson and Rees-Mogg?
You'd rather May stay as PM? She is the worst PM in a generation.

Labour 2017 manifesto - what do you object to?
Personally I'm happy to roll with that and I sold it on the doorsteps. Only adjustment is that the Tories have tried and failed to the Leave the EU so Labour no longer have to honour the referendum result as the Tories have wrecked it.

In that scenario you liken Labour to Johnson and Rees-Mogg? Please get serious.

 

[Bearded Shrimper]

Are you ****ting me? You equate Corbyn with Johnson and Rees-Mogg?
You'd rather May stay as PM? She is the worst PM in a generation.

Labour 2017 manifesto - what do you object to?
Personally I'm happy to roll with that and I sold it on the doorsteps. Only adjustment is that the Tories have tried and failed to the Leave the EU so Labour no longer have to honour the referendum result as the Tories have wrecked it.

In that scenario you liken Labour to Johnson and Rees-Mogg? Please get serious.

Getting ready to shout down all dissenting opinions if Corbyn makes it to Number 10? I hear Siberia is nice this time of year.

Yes, I am of the centre left and supported staying in the European Union. I would like us to leave the EU and become a member of EFTA, ideally more similar to Switzerland than to Norway. The weird thing is that, looking at the options, May seems more likely to both bring about a Brexit that I think would be good for the country and do a decent job of running the country.
I have no confidence in Corbyn. As I set out, his appeal and politics is based on fantasy and populism. Johnson and Rees-Mogg are the same, Trump too to a large extent. That is the whole point with populist demagogues. Some of their politics is the same, especially on Brexit

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Getting ready to shout down all dissenting opinions if Corbyn makes it to Number 10? I hear Siberia is nice this time of year.

Yes, I am of the centre left and supported staying in the European Union. I would like us to leave the EU and become a member of EFTA, ideally more similar to Switzerland than to Norway. The weird thing is that, looking at the options, May seems more likely to both bring about a Brexit that I think would be good for the country and do a decent job of running the country.
I have no confidence in Corbyn. As I set out, his appeal and politics is based on fantasy and populism. Johnson and Rees-Mogg are the same, Trump too to a large extent. That is the whole point with populist demagogues. Some of their politics is the same, especially on Brexit

not shouting down, expressing surprise in the terms that will show the level of surprise. I know fully well you can state your case so I don't need to skirt around the issues but express what I think. I assume we are both cool with that and Siberia doesn't need a visit.
I voted Remain and see no need for a half arsed version of Brexit that will appeal to very few on either side. We don't need to do that any more. Those who are bringing down the PM are doing so because her Leave isn't Leave enough. She won't survive so her version of Leave - which has only existed since late on Friday and hasn't been written out in any official form - won't be happening as her MPs are deserting her. So soft Brexit is dead. I suspect the choice will be hard Brexit or no Brexit.

I expect the Labour policy of giving the Tories the space to make a hash of Brexit and prove it unworkable to mean that we no longer have to look at half measures but at Brexit not happening.

2017 Manifesto - did you not approve?

 

[Bearded Shrimper]

Brexit has to happen. It is surely just a matter of whether we leave with a deal or not. I hope that we do, preferably a certain kind of deal which to me is more stable and less disruptive. That to me means a phased approach of going to the free trade deal based on an established precedent. Once we have got there we can work out what to do next. I know it means staying in the single market but, for now, that is a good deal given the alternative which appears to be chaos.
Given all of those things it appears to me that backing Theresa May to remain as Prime Minister, with a more supportive cabinet who have had to explicitly sign up to the current policy is the best way of achieving that.

That is me is what is best for the country. For that to happen it may be that Labour MPs have to put the country above their careers which will be difficult for them to do.. I can only hope that they do so though because the alternative is not a pleasant one

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

it doesn't have to happen - the government have had two years to come up with a workable plan - the plan is yet to be made public but the three main players in the Brexit team have quit, the Foreign Secretary has quit and we are told that a number of elements to the plan have already been rejected by the EU.

Backing May with a more supportive Cabinet? 8 members of the Cabinet have left since November, the Cabinet will be made up of Gove, Hunt and a bunch of juniors who know if they keep quiet they will last as long as May does. If they back her that means very little.

Brexit is dead. It maybe had a chance to work but the Tories made a historic mess of it. After two wasted years any version that is still achievable will be a pale version of what it could have been.

Its dead, don't put it on life support - the version that will be left is not worth living.

What did you not like about the 2017 Manifesto? The Labour one I mean, the Tory one has been deleted if you try to find a copy.

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

Who do you propose takes the job on. It's political suicide and they all know it.

which is exactly why they turned down her offer to resign after she screwed up GE

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

Bye bye Boris.

Can't see it being for long, she'll be gone by the end of the month (or at least a leadership challenge) - personally can't wait.

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

Personally, I still Think Brexit will happen.However, if we leave without a deal that means we'll crash out on WTO terms and there won't be any implementation period.

As Eire's President helpfully explained last week, the UK appears to be under the delusion that it's an equal partner with the EU.It's not.The UK has a population of around 60 million people whereas the EU has around 500 million.The UK is just one country whereas the EU comprises 27 other nation states any of which can reject the Checker's deal and kill it dead as government ministers will find when they try and hawk the white paper around European capitals later this week.

Of course you're forgetting that the UK is the third (probably the second) highest contributor to the EU and therefore it's absence would be rather more keenly felt than if lets say Ireland or Spain decided to go - which of course they wouldn't as they take more out of the EU than they pay in.

 

[mattitouk]

Post deleted. Possible problem with SZ

 

[Lord Football]

The thing is, the Brexiteers won, so now they need to shut up and deliver Brexit. Only thing is, of course, they've not got a Scooby what Brexit they can actually deliver that meets their jaundiced, one eyed political agenda that doesn't screw up the economy on a long term basis.

They've all worked very hard to ruin any plan so far put forward without putting forward any alternative - and they know "just leaving" isn't an option. Two of them resigned yesterday, without putting forward an alternative solution. People like JMR have wrung their hands at the letting down of the British people but haven't got a solution. There are various other faceless Tories, such as Bone and Redwood, who've no concept of how to deliver their hard, stand alone Brexit. And then there is Farage catching endangered sharks gleefully clapping his hands as Ministers resigned and egging on others like some kind of self appointed puppet master. He too, doesn't have a solution.

All we get from this rag tag mob is line after line of meaningless tosh about a brighter future that none of them can actually put any detail on. They failed to do so in the referendum, they failed to do so when HMG were developing plans and they fail to do snow. They can't provide any details, because they do not understand how international trade, economies and movement of people are all linked and breaking those links have consequences. National and international consequeneces.

So it really is time we stopped listening to them. It is time we stopped giving them airtime, it is time they stopped misleading the people of this country.

What May did last night was, AT LAST, show a bit of leadership. She told them to shut up and I applaud her for doing so. Yes, she may need to work with Labour to deliver some sort of Brexit - a Brexit that doesn't necessarily shaft us all, that might even keep us in a Customs Union of sorts, that will stop our manufactures moving operations to the EU and will keep jobs in the UK.

The Hardliners didn't do their maths, they didn't get 48 letters need to force a leadership challenge. Even if they did, would never have got any kind of plan through a Parliament that emphatically does not agree their position.