48 Hours Max Work Per Week

[steveo]

I'll help with the trains.

The jobs market is flat and employers hold the cards. They can pay dire wages and get away with it because simply put, people are desperate for work.

Thank Gawd we have the National Minimum Wage.

This wont always be the case though, and at some stage the employees will have the pick of the jobs. In a lot of cases its almost impossible to get rid of someone who cant be bothered to do a decent job. If you follow the correct procedures, as you will be aware, it can take a hell of a long time. However, an employee is free to quit as and when they want.

The National minimum wage, can also contribute to unemployment and force employees to take on casual cash in hand labour.

To me the problem with a lot of these laws is that they are not thought through and discussed with people who actually run a business or work in one. Take the maternity leave law. Having the option of a single 20 year old or a 40 year old married with kids, why would anyone take on the 20 year old when she could become pregnant and clear off for a year whilst her job is held open for her.

 

[Irate Ian]

This wont always be the case though, and at some stage the employees will have the pick of the jobs. In a lot of cases its almost impossible to get rid of someone who cant be bothered to do a decent job. If you follow the correct procedures, as you will be aware, it can take a hell of a long time. However, an employee is free to quit as and when they want.

The National minimum wage, can also contribute to unemployment and force employees to take on casual cash in hand labour.

To me the problem with a lot of these laws is that they are not thought through and discussed with people who actually run a business or work in one. Take the maternity leave law. Having the option of a single 20 year old or a 40 year old married with kids, why would anyone take on the 20 year old when she could become pregnant and clear off for a year whilst her job is held open for her.

Exactly right, we only would consider to engage mature and very experienced secretarial personnel and suppose that's a product of regulation to a large extent, but also for their other qualities.

 

[Benfleet A1]

Bit hazy on the whole thing, but isn't there a rule that every 7 days you must have 35hrs off, in addition to the 11 hrs between shifts? If so then that'd add up to (I think) 90hrs of off time a week, leaving 78hrs maximum to be worked.

We work a 6 and 3 rolling week meaning 6 days on at 12 hours a day and 3 off meaning 72 hours off. That means we work a 72 hour a week but have 72 hours off. In my line of work, 48 hours maximum would mean in real terms and this isn't me making anything up, but heres what would happen......... Britain's roads would be littered with broken down vehicles because just about every recovery driver in the country would leave because we couldn't make a decent living working the hours laid down by the EU. These faceless wonders don't live in the real world. I would not be able to maintain my out goings working a standard 48 hour a week. My personal shortfall would amount to £800 a month which I can ill afford to lose and I don't even have a mortgage. I work on a percentage of 30% per job, that works out to about £11 per job. I need 10 jobs a day to earn a livable wage, cutting my working week by 24 hours takes away my earning possibilities which in turn takes away my standard of living. Living in one of the most expensive countries in the world makes that a hard pill to shallow. I work what I am comfortable with so what give these idiots on £120,000 + expenses the right to cap my wages?

 

[Irate Ian]

We work a 6 and 3 rolling week meaning 6 days on at 12 hours a day and 3 off meaning 72 hours off. That means we work a 72 hour a week but have 72 hours off. In my line of work, 48 hours maximum would mean in real terms and this isn't me making anything up, but heres what would happen......... Britain's roads would be littered with broken down vehicles because just about every recovery driver in the country would leave because we couldn't make a decent living working the hours laid down by the EU. These faceless wonders don't live in the real world. I would not be able to maintain my out goings working a standard 48 hour a week. My personal shortfall would amount to £800 a month which I can ill afford to lose and I don't even have a mortgage. I work on a percentage of 30% per job, that works out to about £11 per job. I need 10 jobs a day to earn a livable wage, cutting my working week by 24 hours takes away my earning possibilities which in turn takes away my standard of living. Living in one of the most expensive countries in the world makes that a hard pill to shallow. I work what I am comfortable with so what give these idiots on £120,000 + expenses the right to cap my wages?

Way to Go Go Go; Harry;

The Brussels dipsticks haven't a clue what it takes to carve out a living in the real world.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Exactly right, we only would consider to engage mature and very experienced secretarial personnel and suppose that's a product of regulation to a large extent, but also for their other qualities.

Isn't that discriminatory Ian?

 

[steveo]

Isn't that discriminatory Ian?

Course it is OBL, but I expect most people taken on - especially by smaller firms - are subject to some sort of discrimination.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Oh well, if I ever want to get back into secretarial work, I'll know where to go then!

 

[Irate Ian]

Isn't that discriminatory Ian?

No Kay it's common sense.

The best legal secretaries are those having extensive prior experience.

Worth their weight in gold.

Now look what you have go and made me say. Hope they don't have access to SZ or may want a massive pay rise !

 

[osymandus]

Err we had this problem about the more experince for years , thats why the age discrimination laws came in , we had a ton of experinced people let go , as cewrtainly the image in teh City is unless your a hungry bright young thing (i.e below 35) your useless .

Regarding GHG , errr no more people would be employed to cover teh extra shifts , and we;; bugger me the economy would have to be reduced in value (or the commoduties at any rate) becuase if people cant afford to buy the goods the buisness selling them go out of wait buissness .

This real world you speak of dosnt exisit , its a badly thought out ill constructed mess , if your market forces are dependent upon the over working of your force then there's somthing severly wrong.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Osy, to be fair, that's been the case in every place I've ever worked. There's always people that put in more than their fair share, and those that don't; those that soldier on through illness and those that take days off sick at the drop of a hat; those who put in extra hours before and after and those that arrive and leave on the dot. Unfortunately, also in my experience, those that take advantage in this way are often the more charismatic ones who seem to have a way with the bosses, while those who give their all in good old graft are seldom recognised. It's why I really value where I am now, because I know how much my efforts and contribution are appreciated as I am constantly being told so and I don't feel taken for granted.

 

[osymandus]

Osy, to be fair, that's been the case in every place I've ever worked. There's always people that put in more than their fair share, and those that don't; those that soldier on through illness and those that take days off sick at the drop of a hat; those who put in extra hours before and after and those that arrive and leave on the dot. Unfortunately, also in my experience, those that take advantage in this way are often the more charismatic ones who seem to have a way with the bosses, while those who give their all in good old graft are seldom recognised. It's why I really value where I am now, because I know how much my efforts and contribution are appreciated as I am constantly being told so and I don't feel taken for granted.

I agree and ive seen it as well , however its that attitude that socalism ;) , you will find in some case those charismatic and go getters can be contemptuous of the hard grafters , of whose efforts they do ride . Its about everyone being recognised , a good example in the city for instance is Traders and teh back office stelments and checking people without who the traders are pretty much screwed . You cant keep lording one part if society and saying their fantastic because their work so many hours , in Germany for instance you would be cosidered incompeteant , (Why cant you complete your work in the given hours ?) , our working ethics are a reflection of teh evolution and history of our societies .

 

[OldBlueLady]

Fair point, I've also heard those kind of people ask why they should put in extra effort if they're not getting paid to do so, which again is probably a fair point. Personally, I'm just one of those who will do as much as I possibly can in any one day to give myself a head start the next - that applies at home as well.

 

[jassyfa1]

This wont always be the case though, and at some stage the employees will have the pick of the jobs. In a lot of cases its almost impossible to get rid of someone who cant be bothered to do a decent job. If you follow the correct procedures, as you will be aware, it can take a hell of a long time. However, an employee is free to quit as and when they want.

The National minimum wage, can also contribute to unemployment and force employees to take on casual cash in hand labour.

To me the problem with a lot of these laws is that they are not thought through and discussed with people who actually run a business or work in one. Take the maternity leave law. Having the option of a single 20 year old or a 40 year old married with kids, why would anyone take on the 20 year old when she could become pregnant and clear off for a year whilst her job is held open for her.

Im not sure the employees will have the pick of the jobs. The only jobs going at the moment in the free papers are for care assistants in the community, and trust me thats not a nice job.
Most of the low paid jobs are going to immigrants who will work for less minimal wage, and when the job market does open up again you are going to have to fight the immigrants and the rest of the unemployed to geta decent job.
Now if you have just lost your job, think what else can you do with your skills, and how can I retrain. Got a driving licence and only 3 points, then train to be a bus driver. Or if you have a bit of money put away then train to be a driving instructor (dont go with the one on the television).
Got a degree, then look at teaching.

 

[Lord Football]

This wont always be the case though, and at some stage the employees will have the pick of the jobs. In a lot of cases its almost impossible to get rid of someone who cant be bothered to do a decent job. If you follow the correct procedures, as you will be aware, it can take a hell of a long time. However, an employee is free to quit as and when they want.

The National minimum wage, can also contribute to unemployment and force employees to take on casual cash in hand labour.

To me the problem with a lot of these laws is that they are not thought through and discussed with people who actually run a business or work in one. Take the maternity leave law. Having the option of a single 20 year old or a 40 year old married with kids, why would anyone take on the 20 year old when she could become pregnant and clear off for a year whilst her job is held open for her.

You can get rid of an employee VERY quickly. I've seen it done in less than a day. A myth of Employment Law is that it favours the employee, it doesn't. Yes, you follow procedures, but those procedures are of the employers making.

The National Minimum Wage is probably the best piece of legislation in the last 20 years. I'll try and view this where you come from politically rather than the left wing rant.... It stopped employers paying less than subsistence wages to their employees, which in turned forced them into have more than one job. In turn that had an effect on the employment market. It also encouraged some off the dole and into work because the dole no longer paid more than some jobs.

Maybe look at the opt out provisions John Major negotiated 1993 by doing a google search.

I did. I check the regulations on the BERR site. Unless my old eyes are dying I can't find it. Can you?

We work a 6 and 3 rolling week meaning 6 days on at 12 hours a day and 3 off meaning 72 hours off. That means we work a 72 hour a week but have 72 hours off. In my line of work, 48 hours maximum would mean in real terms and this isn't me making anything up, but heres what would happen.........

It's averaged out over 17 weeks to allow for scenarios like yours.

 

[Lord Football]

Got a degree, then look at teaching.

No. Don't even CONSIDER that. I want you nowhere my kids. The eldest is still have nightmares about the crab.

 

[steveo]

You can get rid of an employee VERY quickly.

If they have done something very wrong. Believe me, I speak from first hand experience, if you want to get rid of someone just because they are not particularly good, its a lot more difficult. After you have done so, their first port of call is to the job centre, who contact you straight away - "have you followed the correct procedures - have they been given the right warnings blah blah blah"

It stopped employers paying less than subsistence wages to their employees, which in turned forced them into have more than one job

But it was still that persons choice to take the job regardless of the money. If no one would work for that money the employer would have to pay more - bring in the immigrants. The minimum wage can help protect the worker, but it can also force people into working in low paid cash in hands jobs.

Think we will disagree on this one Lord.

 

[Lord Football]

But it was still that persons choice to take the job regardless of the money. If no one would work for that money the employer would have to pay more - bring in the immigrants. The minimum wage can help protect the worker, but it can also force people into working in low paid cash in hands jobs.

Think we will disagree on this one Lord.

Choice... hmmmm.... choice. The choice was (and still is to a certain extent) "take that job or lose the benefits". So the choice becomes one of subsitistence wages or nothing. The minimum wage DOES protect the worker, that's why it is there.

Yes, we will disagree. That's the fun of it.

 

[osymandus]

Fair point, I've also heard those kind of people ask why they should put in extra effort if they're not getting paid to do so, which again is probably a fair point. Personally, I'm just one of those who will do as much as I possibly can in any one day to give myself a head start the next - that applies at home as well.

Fair point you work to live not live to work . It is an occupation not your life . And as already stated you chosse what you want to do with it.

 

[Aberdeen Shrimper]

You can get rid of an employee VERY quickly. I've seen it done in less than a day. A myth of Employment Law is that it favours the employee, it doesn't. Yes, you follow procedures, but those procedures are of the employers making.

The National Minimum Wage is probably the best piece of legislation in the last 20 years. I'll try and view this where you come from politically rather than the left wing rant.... It stopped employers paying less than subsistence wages to their employees, which in turned forced them into have more than one job. In turn that had an effect on the employment market. It also encouraged some off the dole and into work because the dole no longer paid more than some jobs.



I did. I check the regulations on the BERR site. Unless my old eyes are dying I can't find it. Can you?



It's averaged out over 17 weeks to allow for scenarios like yours.

I am afraid that it is not quite as easy as that

 

[Firestorm]

No Kay it's common sense.

The best legal secretaries are those having extensive prior experience.

Worth their weight in gold.

Now look what you have go and made me say. Hope they don't have access to SZ or may want a massive pay rise !

its also against current age discrimination legislation , ridiculous as it may sound ....