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Three Key Games For Tilson

Uncle Ron & Stevie Tilson are like cheese on toast... they go well together.

The day Tilson leaves will be a very dark day for this club indeed.

No disrespect to the author of this topic, but kneejerk reactions will not help and we all knew just how tough it was going to be this season. Let's just enjoy the ride and accept "what will be, will be!"
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Smiffy @ Nov. 28 2006,10:47)]Look stop worrying, the three points will be coming tonight or Saturday I can feel it!.

smile.gif
Can I ask for too much and request 3 points both tonight and Saturday?!
 
4 points from the next two games will leave us all a little happier...

Believe in Tilly, Brush & All The Lads.

It will come...



wink.gif
 
Point 1. That's your opinion, I disagree. I think T&B have an eye for a player and I still think we have better players now. But that's just my opinion.

Point 2. With the injuries we have had this season, plus we know very little about the behind the scenes goings on (who predicted that Ricketts would be show the door so quickly?) that can't be leveled as an informed criticism.

Point 3. As DtS has said, how can you prove that? I do think he could bring people on earlier, but that is my amatuer judgement.

We have had amazing success, there are good signs that things are coming together.

Tilly out? Dream on! We are still more likely to have him poached than sack him!
 
I can't help thinking that if this win at all costs, isn't it easy on Championship Manager type mentality existed 25 years ago that Dave Smith would have been sacked when we went down under his stewardship. We won the league the following year.
I will be absolutely gutted if Ron sacks Tilly and Brush and I doubt he will. The current experience although unwelcome is going to make them better managers/coaches in the future. We're playing the long game here.
And finally it's all very well saying a new manager but you have to be constructive. Who?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (RPG @ Nov. 28 2006,08:45)]I therefore believe that if we fail to win in the next three matches RM will have no alternative other than to replace Tilly.
A fine suggestion. Why don't we sack a manager every time he loses a game, wouldn't that be a good idea.

I wanted to post just, "you're an idiot," but for some reason I thought you were worth a little more courtesy than that. I'm really not sure though...
 
Whilst I dont agree with the notion that Tilly should be replaced yet, I dont think, given our league position, it is above speaking about, nor do I believe the people are brave enough to raise the issue should be treated with contempt.

The last 3 years have been magnificent if you're a Southend fan, no one can deny that, and that has to go down to Tilly, Brush and the players (and I may also add a bit from Wignall as well, lets not forget the majority of the squad which came up was built by him) but no one person is bigger than Southend United football club.

Of course we all knew it was going to be a struggle this season, butit shouldnt be as hard as we are making it out to be, thats for sure.

I do believe fundamental decisions by the management have been wrong this season, the quality of players being bought in, the amount of players being bought in (or lack of) and tactical decisions which have left even those with the minutist knowledge of football baffled.

I have said it before, but we continue to act like a League Two club at times, fans included, with this Oh well, we have had a good go, enjoy it while we can attitude. I dont want to be here for just one season, and I dont enjoy getting beaten every week, and why should I?

We got here on merit and there is absolutely no reason I can see why we shouldnt be here next season. We did it before, for 6 successful years, so stop thinking because were a small club thats why we are at the bottom and thats why its OK if we go back down from where we came from.... It isnt.

We are at the bottom for the reasons I stated above, fundamental decisions which have been got wrong, and they have cost us dearly.

If you look at other clubs in our division which are of a similar size, Luton, Col Ewe, Barnsley, Burnley and even QPR, they are all, with the exception of Barnsley, having good seasons or have had good seasons recently at this level, and the majority will be here next season, so i dont buy this small club cant survive here nonsense. Its like having a chip on your shoulder.

I think the excuses are running a bit thin now for our current predicament and they really do need to be sorted out PDQ before it is too late, although I have a feeling that we are past that mark now.

As I said, I am not advocating the sacking of the manager, BUT, he along with the players has to raise his game, and I agree that the next 3 games are crucial for us. One away to our relegation rivals and then 2 winnable home games.

I also think RM needs to come out and explain why such little activity happened in the transfer window? Is it because we simply cant afford the players (which if the case, then I am baffled as to where all the money we have collected recently has gone) or is it Tilly's inability to get in better class of players?

I dont believe Tilly is above criticism, or above losing his job if it means we can stay at this level, but I do agree with giving him more time to try and resolve it, as people have said, performances have improved slightly recently, and if we can build on that then all well and good.

If the position is still the same after the hectic Christmas period and we are adrift like we are now without and signs of improvement, then I believe the situation needs to be reviewed by the board and if necessary, action taken.

As for naming replacements, well if the times comes, then we can all do that, but dont think there are not managers out there who could do just as good a a job as Tilly because there are. For example, someone mentiond Stan Ternant in a previous post, journeyman perhaps, successful?... Definately.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (glasgowsufc @ Nov. 28 2006,10:43)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Einstein @ Nov. 28 2006,10:41)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (glasgowsufc @ Nov. 28 2006,10:27)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Einstein @ Nov. 28 2006,10:21)]Steve Tilson - Southend
Played Won Drawn Lost
167 72 45 50

Win Ratio - 43.11%
Not questioning your stats but I have Tilly down as W73, D44, L50.  Where did you get them from?
So you are questioning my stats then  
tounge.gif


Soccerbase.com - Thought they were usually reliable, but hey let's go with your stats, that's now a 43.71% win ratio for RPG!
I could be wrong but I religiously update them after every game!  Something I started to compile when I was very bored waiting out my notice time at RBS!

You do realise I am now going to have to cross-reference soccerbase with mine to see who's right!!!  
Oo.gif
Could the mystery be....

The Lincoln play off final game

Although it was an overall victory, it was a draw after 90 mins, maybe Soccerbase base their stats on 90 mins only?

rock.gif
?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Richard_Cadette @ Nov. 28 2006,13:02)]As for naming replacements, well if the times comes, then we can all do that, but dont think there are not managers out there who could do just as good a a job as Tilly because there are. For example, someone mentiond Stan Ternant in a previous post, journeyman perhaps, successful?... Definately.
got relegated with Gillingham
tounge.gif


actually his record is impressive. BUT it just goes to show very few people have totally successful careers. That includes Tilly as well. I do think we all ought to start living in the real world.

Hey Joe Royle's without a job I think

PS it's definitely definitely
 
If Tilson could afford the wages of Championship quality players he could keep us up.

If we stay up this year it is a miracle and Tilson is even more of a hero than he is already. The objective has to be to be a top half League 1 club until we have the new stadium. Anything above that is a huge bonus.

If we start looking like slipping straight through League 1 again, then it is time to question Tilson's position.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (MK Shrimper @ Nov. 28 2006,09:31)]Grrrr.....all these "replace Tilson" people do my head in. The man is a legend and even IF we go down he should stay manager.

Remember three years ago, or where you supporting a different team back then?

You want constant glory, go and support Chelsea.
For the record I have been supporting Southend for over 25 years attending 100's of matches.

I agree that Tilson has been excellent for Southend (as stated in my original post)!!

However we are a different club to that of 3 years ago. Our support has more than trebled, we have a young fan base and we could be moving to a 22,000 all seater stadium. If you want to live in the past and support a club that is achieving f... all then go and support Canvey Island.

Also if you philosophy is right then Alf Ramsey should have remained England manager past the 1970 world cup???
 
I haven't seen many games this season, Richard_Cadette, but what tactical decisions are you referring to specifically?

The quality of players being brought in is questionable, but I think it is a little harsh to judge them after a short period of time in a side that is bottom of the league because it went through a period of giving away endless goals from set-plays and getting caught short at the back, and has never really recovered from that.

This season was always going to be difficult because we had a small squad with virtually no experience at this level. Yes, you can justifiably level the criticism that this could have been rectified in the close season, but that is considerably easier said that done.

I knew there would be periods when we would lose three or four in a row. I thought we would score goals (relatively for a side at the bottom) but concede aerial power at the back, and so it has proved. What though could really be done? Where do you find a poweful centre half with experience at this level prepared to play for us and within our budget? The same could be said in any position.

I thought Tilson had to gamble in one of two ways in the summer: by bringing in younger players with the hope that they would come good or filling the squad with older players who had played at this level to some extent but had lost their way. He largely did the former, I believe with the philosophy that relegation would leave a stronger playing staff with the potential to develop. He also gambled on Ricketts, which we all know didn't come off. The second method would have cost more money, would have had a short term benefit if it worked and wouldn't have been as successful as the former coming good.

I don't think Tilson has done anything wrong this season. It is difficult to keep young players mentally strong when the side keeps losing and their own performances are not as they have been for the previous two seasons. It is for that reason that the likes of Guttridge, Francis & JCR were dropped. With limited replacements it was inevitable that players would have to play out of position.

You may criticise all you want and you may well consider it to be justified, but I do not believe it would be in the best interests of the club. The only reasons I think are reasonable for dismissing a manager are: he has lost the confidence of the players, he has lost sight or how to develop the club or someone else can do it better.

Tilson has certainly not lost the players, I think his general outline for the future is pretty clear and there is no one that can realistically do any better.

The talk of financial ruin if we are relegated isn't the case. There are no numbers to support this case and are often made by the same people that castigate Ron Martin for spending within the mean's of the club.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Stodge @ Nov. 28 2006,13:13)]If Tilson could afford the wages of Championship quality players he could keep us up.

If we stay up this year it is a miracle and Tilson is even more of a hero than he is already. The objective has to be to be a top half League 1 club until we have the new stadium. Anything above that is a huge bonus.

If we start looking like slipping straight through League 1 again, then it is time to question Tilson's position.
Nonsense!

Why should that be our objective? To be top half of League One? Of course it shouldnt. If it is, then we may as well all give up now and go home, lets not bother playing any more games this season.

As I said, there are plenty of other clubs at this level doing better than us, we have also done it before with the same stadium but with smaller crowds.

The size of our club is no excuse.
 
Too many points worth replying to on this thread, so I'll just add this for now:

We wait 10 years for a decent manager and then, when we finally get one, some people start calling for him to be sacked after a bad run of 15 games (albeit a very bad one, but interspersed with a victory over Man U on the way).
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (C'mon you Blues @ Nov. 28 2006,13:27)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Richard_Cadette @ Nov. 28 2006,13:18)]we have also done it before with the same stadium but with smaller crowds.
I thought it virtually bankrupted us but I may be wrong.
I wouldnt agree with that at all, we made some bad decision last time we were here, but if you remember, those decisions coincided with us getting relegated.

Before then, I think we were OK.
 
OK - I have read the previous threads and apologise for ever mentioning such a controversial topic. However I thought this was a message board where every Southend supporter could air their opinions without being subjected to insults just because other posters disagree with your opinion, I was obviously wrong!!!

For the record I believe that Tilson has done an excellent job for us and I hope and pray that he turns things around. I do not however believe that a Manager should continue to run a club purely based on past achievments. For example how many fans would continue to support Tilly if we only amassed 20-30 points at the end of the season?

At the start of the season most people on this board expected us to just avoid relegation (me included). Why is it then that other peoples expectations have slipped?

I still maintain that it is essential that we stay in this division. If RM has stated that we have a 5 year plan then so be it however 1 month is a long time in footbal let alone 5 years!!
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (RPG @ Nov. 28 2006,13:14)]Also if you philosophy is right then Alf Ramsey should have remained England manager past the 1970 world cup???
Sir Alf Ramsey did remain England manager until they failed to qualify for the World Cup in Germany in 1974.

I will pose this question again to all the Tilson out brigade, who the heck are you advocating to take over from him?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (RPG @ Nov. 28 2006,13:35)]At the start of the season most people on this board expected us to just avoid relegation (me included). Why is it then that other peoples expectations have slipped?
They haven't. At this point in time I still have the same expectation of just avoiding relegation. And at this point in time it is still very much achievable with Tilly at the helm. I always thought it might be a diaster for Tilly should he actually get us relegated and yes, then I could understand, but still not agree with the calls for him to be sacked. However, at the present time, we are falling a little short of that target, but win a couple of games (It could happen!!) and we are right back in with a good shout.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (RPG @ Nov. 28 2006,13:35)]OK - I have read the previous threads and apologise for ever mentioning such a controversial topic. However I thought this was a message board where every Southend supporter could air their opinions without being subjected to insults just because other posters disagree with your opinion, I was obviously wrong!!!
Hope you didn't think I was being abusive in starting off the debate to your original post?

"Get real" is a bit less than some people have resorted too but nonetheless, lets just say I'm not a morning person, so if I caused offence, I apologise!
 

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