The Ashes Thread

[canveyshrimper]

To be fair to him, he was right. We were taking the ****, and I'm surprised Strauss didn't get hauled before the referee for it. It was OK the 1st time, but twice in 2 overs was a bit much.

You are right, England were taking the ****. But the sight of Ponting taking the moral high ground was truly vomit inducing inferring that Australia don't indulge in gamesmanship. A case of short term memory loss after Ponting vehemently claimed a catch off Colly, it has to hit the bat or glove you piggy eyed pillock.

 

[BLUEBLOOD]

You are right, England were taking the ****. But the sight of Ponting taking the moral high ground was truly vomit inducing inferring that Australia don't indulge in gamesmanship. A case of short term memory loss after Ponting vehemently claimed a catch off Colly, it has to hit the bat or glove you piggy eyed pillock.

That was shocking, it must of missed bat/gloves by at least 6 inches yet he goes screaming up to the umpire .. in a word that is cheating, we were just being unsporting, a totally different kettle of fish IMO

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I'm not sure about momentum swinging back to England if they manage to draw, however if it is a draw England can gain some comfort from being completely outplayed.

I wouldn't advocate wholesale changes for Lords but IMO Harmison must come back in place of Panesar, and IMO Onions should play instead of Broad. Although the second innings with the bat has been a bit of a horror show, I'd keep faith with the top 6.

Momentum will swing towards us, if we start to get the ball to swing. Otherwise it will be a struggle to bowl the Convicts out.

Harmison should have played ahead of Panesar at Cardiff, and I'd be tempted to ditch both spinners for Lords. Cardiff was a turning pitch and they took one wicket for 250+ between them. If they can't take wickets on turning tracks, when exactly are they going to take them?

I apologise for repeating myself, as this is exactly the same thing I said after our two spinners failed to bowl India out in Chennai.

Collingwood was even more effective in the holding role than either spinner. Swann was in top form in India and West Indies and didn't look like bowling teams out.

Agreed about Harmison... As long as England get rid of one finger spinner I'll be happy, and Panesar has done absolutely nothing this Test.

The only change I'd make to the batting order is Cook, who's been a passenger with the bat, but then again who exactly would open with Strauss? I feel for Bopara... He's had an excellent summer so far, was obviously nervous in his first innings and then given that horrible decision in his second.

As for Pietersen... Well he's still an enigma. You never know what KP is going to turn up until the day.

As for dropping a batsman, that would be a move towards the bad old days of knee-jerk selections. Whenever Cook returns to county cricket he proves he is the best English opener who hasn't retired from international cricket. I can't see anyone else being an upgrade. He's in decent enough nick at the moment, you've just got to hope that he makes a few technical adjustments.

It was Old Trafford in 2005 when Lee & McGrath held out for a draw for the convicts.

Fair play to Anderson & Panesar, but I think that Flintoff, Broad and Swann should all get a mention for the length of time they occupied the crease with Collingwood.

The difference being in 2005, Australia were pushing for a win at times during that 5th day when Ponting was in full flow, whilst England were grimly holding on to avoid a humiliating innings defeat.

That was shocking, it must of missed bat/gloves by at least 6 inches yet he goes screaming up to the umpire .. in a word that is cheating, we were just being unsporting, a totally different kettle of fish IMO

I think the end justifies the means. Anything that gets Ponting annoyed is therefore OK with me.

I think the term whinging POM must refer to the Convicts, because they were the prisoners of mother England and certainly are always whinging. I was a little surprised that the nation that got so upset about Harold Larwood's innovative and skilful bowling would attempt to replicate it, yet Siddle went around the wicket and was firing it short into Swann's body. Personally, I think that is a fair enough tactic, but then I didn't go crying off about unfair play when someone used the same tactic against my side and get my PM involved.

 

[Napster]

but then I didn't go crying off about unfair play when someone used the same tactic against my side and get my PM involved.

is this about the Apprentice?

 

[SARF]

I agree on the no spinners .. Ours are rubbish.. Get Harmy back in.. At the very least we may be able to batter a couple of them..

 

[BILLERICAY BLUE]

Flintoff injury doubt for 2nd Test, Harmy added to squad.

BBC

 

[Pubey]

Flintoff injury doubt for 2nd Test, Harmy added to squad.

BBC

blessing in disguise, or are we ****ed?

 

[Swiss Tony]

Flintoff injury doubt for 2nd Test, Harmy added to squad.

BBC

Good,and i hope he gets in,then he can make that **** siddle eat leather.

 

[Pubey]

Denys Finch-Hatton, consultant editor at Wisden, said: "Australia have essentially just drawn a test match against a team that seemed to consist mainly of second-hand furniture. :D

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/test-matches-stupid-200907131898/

 

[number11]

So, if Flintoff is out, would people prefer him to be replaced by a batsman, bowler or bits and pieces allrounder (a la Bresnan). If he is replaced by a batsman it will be Bell, who coming in at 6 may allow him a bit more comfort at the crease. It would leave us with 4 bowlers - Anderson, Swann and 2 from Broad Harmison and Onions. With Prior at 7, Broad 8 and Swann 9 its not a bad tail. (Assuming it will then be Anderson and Harmison / Onions).

If they replace him with a bowler it gives us a decent ish looking attack of Onions, Harmison, Anderson, Broad and Swann, but leaves Broad and Swann coming in at 7 and 8, Anderson at 9.

Apparently the pitch is looking lively, and if that is the case then Id favour Bell and rely on 3 seamers getting enough out of the pitch. Obviously the concern is that 5 bowlers couldnt make any inroads at Cardiff, so can 4 at Lords....

 

[BILLERICAY BLUE]

I'd be inclined to go with the extra batter, as Broad at 7 and Swann at 8 is probably a place too high for both of them. However, according to Geoff Miller, Harmy is only in the squad as cover for Flintoff, so if Flintoff is unfit, you would say that Harmy is going to play in a 5 man attack.

Assuming Flintoff is fit, I would iamgine that Onions will come in for Panesar, and they'll leave the rest alone.

If Flintoff is unfit, I would go back to a 4 man attack with Bell coming in, and Harmy replacing Panesar. Extra overs to be made up from Colly, Rav and KP.

Incidentally, I can't believe Ravi didn't get a bowl in the 170 overs we were in the field...

 

[number11]

Incidentally, I can't believe Ravi didn't get a bowl in the 170 overs we were in the field...

I thought that shocking too. Once they went past our score there should have been a level of protection afforded to Freddie (and to a lesser extent the other seamers), especially with back to back tests. Seeing him bowl 35 overs didnt leave me confident he would be able to play effectively at lords as well....

 

[BLUEBLOOD]

I know bowling in International matches is a massive step up from County games, but Ravi is consistantly one of our (as in Essex) most reliable bowlers in all three forms of the game yet doesn't get a look in on the bigger stage .. criminal in my mind

 

[Matt the Shrimp]

So, if Flintoff is out, would people prefer him to be replaced by a batsman, bowler or bits and pieces allrounder (a la Bresnan)

Bowler.

Our batsmen played poorly in Cardiff, and frankly will need to show a lot more discipline and application at Lords. However, it's a ground with happy memories for all our batsmen - since the last Ashes series, they've posted the following on the Lord's honours board:

Strauss - 1 ton
Cook - 2 tons
Bopara - 1 ton
Pietersen - 4 tons
Collingwood - 2 tons
Prior - 1 ton

Strauss is the interesting one - as former Middlesex captain, and with two tons at Lord's in 2004, you'd expect him to relish playing on his "home" turf.

However, the key is that those 6 batsmen ought to be capable of building up a substantial score - especially when you take into account that none of Swann, Anderson or Broad are complete bunnies with the willow in their hand.

What is utterly indisputable, however, is that we took 6 wickets in Cardiff - and that our bowling attack could therefore be described as "powder puff". You could have a side of 11 Kevin Pietersens, frankly - but if you only take 6 wickets, you'll never win a Test match.

Personally, I'd pick Harmison. Yes, he is a total bloody enigma. He gets homesick, he can be moody, temperamental, and when he's not on his game, wayward and carted for 40+ a wicket.

However, right now, he's playing well. And a Harmison in form is a more potent weapon than any other Englishman we have at the moment - other than Freddy and his shot knees, perhaps.

More than that - it should make for an explosive Test match. Australia will go after him, you can be sure of that, in a hope to exploit that fragile temperament of his. However, having seen the Varsity match at Lord's 10 days ago, it looks to be a quick surface, and one with plenty of bounce in it - in other words, perfect for Harmy. If the Ockers go after him, you can be sure that there will be plenty of chances - and that means, potentially, wickets.

My personal jury is still out on Onions. I've seen him 3 times at Lord's - but, oddly, the last of those three was a Test match (admittedly against the devil-may-care Windies led by the ridiculous Gayle), and he bowled venomously in that game. If I understand the weather forecast for this week to be correct, there will be plenty of cloud around... and it's those sorts of seam / swing conditions in which Onions thrives.

I don't see either of Onions or Harmison to be particularly fantastic long-term prospects. Onions is, ultimately, a solid county-standard seamer who requires classic "English" cloudy conditions (often found at Chester-le-Street) in order to take wickets. Harmison is a maverick, mentally fragile, and in no way a long term England bowling prospect because of his travel-sickness.

But, balls to that, we've got an Ashes series to compete in, and we desperately need wickets.

My XI:

Cook
Strauss (c)
Bopara
Pietersen
Collingwood
Prior
Swann
Broad
Anderson
Harmison
Onions

 

[Pubey]

My XI:

Cook
Strauss (c)
Bopara
Pietersen
Collingwood
Prior
Swann
Broad
Anderson
Harmison
Onions

this^^^^^^

 

[BILLERICAY BLUE]

Bowler.

Our batsmen played poorly in Cardiff, and frankly will need to show a lot more discipline and application at Lords. However, it's a ground with happy memories for all our batsmen - since the last Ashes series, they've posted the following on the Lord's honours board:

Strauss - 1 ton
Cook - 2 tons
Bopara - 1 ton
Pietersen - 4 tons
Collingwood - 2 tons
Prior - 1 ton

Strauss is the interesting one - as former Middlesex captain, and with two tons at Lord's in 2004, you'd expect him to relish playing on his "home" turf.

However, the key is that those 6 batsmen ought to be capable of building up a substantial score - especially when you take into account that none of Swann, Anderson or Broad are complete bunnies with the willow in their hand.

What is utterly indisputable, however, is that we took 6 wickets in Cardiff - and that our bowling attack could therefore be described as "powder puff". You could have a side of 11 Kevin Pietersens, frankly - but if you only take 6 wickets, you'll never win a Test match.

Personally, I'd pick Harmison. Yes, he is a total bloody enigma. He gets homesick, he can be moody, temperamental, and when he's not on his game, wayward and carted for 40+ a wicket.

However, right now, he's playing well. And a Harmison in form is a more potent weapon than any other Englishman we have at the moment - other than Freddy and his shot knees, perhaps.

More than that - it should make for an explosive Test match. Australia will go after him, you can be sure of that, in a hope to exploit that fragile temperament of his. However, having seen the Varsity match at Lord's 10 days ago, it looks to be a quick surface, and one with plenty of bounce in it - in other words, perfect for Harmy. If the Ockers go after him, you can be sure that there will be plenty of chances - and that means, potentially, wickets.

My personal jury is still out on Onions. I've seen him 3 times at Lord's - but, oddly, the last of those three was a Test match (admittedly against the devil-may-care Windies led by the ridiculous Gayle), and he bowled venomously in that game. If I understand the weather forecast for this week to be correct, there will be plenty of cloud around... and it's those sorts of seam / swing conditions in which Onions thrives.

I don't see either of Onions or Harmison to be particularly fantastic long-term prospects. Onions is, ultimately, a solid county-standard seamer who requires classic "English" cloudy conditions (often found at Chester-le-Street) in order to take wickets. Harmison is a maverick, mentally fragile, and in no way a long term England bowling prospect because of his travel-sickness.

But, balls to that, we've got an Ashes series to compete in, and we desperately need wickets.

My XI:

Cook
Strauss (c)
Bopara
Pietersen
Collingwood
Prior
Swann
Broad
Anderson
Harmison
Onions

All good points Matt (as always), but I just think that tail is too long. Put it another way, I think Foster is a better bat than both Swann and Broad, but I still think 7 would be a touch too high for him in a Test match.....

 

[Matt the Shrimp]

All good points Matt (as always), but I just think that tail is too long. Put it another way, I think Foster is a better bat than both Swann and Broad, but I still think 7 would be a touch too high for him in a Test match.....

I agree that the tail does look long. But without a genuine all-rounder, I see no way of lengthening it while also retaining the fire-power to take 20 wickets. Bresnan ain't the answer; neither Ravi nor Luke Wright is good enough with ball in hand; Rashid is too raw.

The only other name that pops to mind is Liam Plunkett - 36 @ 22.88 first class wickets and a 6/63 to his name this season; and he's a useful ODI batsman, for sure, with a half-century to his name (albeit his test average is not so pretty).

But, for whatever reason, he seems to be out of favour at the moment; so, for now, it has to be Swann at 7 for me.

Matt

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

I agree that the tail does look long. But without a genuine all-rounder, I see no way of lengthening it while also retaining the fire-power to take 20 wickets. Bresnan ain't the answer; neither Ravi nor Luke Wright is good enough with ball in hand; Rashid is too raw.

The only other name that pops to mind is Liam Plunkett - 36 @ 22.88 first class wickets and a 6/63 to his name this season; and he's a useful ODI batsman, for sure, with a half-century to his name (albeit his test average is not so pretty).

But, for whatever reason, he seems to be out of favour at the moment; so, for now, it has to be Swann at 7 for me.

Matt

I'd almost forgotten about Plunkett - he didn't get as many chances as Broad did he?

 

[blues_r_best]

Rumours going around that Flintoff is going to announce his retirement from Test cricket very soon.

 

[BLUEBLOOD]

Rumours going around that Flintoff is going to announce his retirement from Test cricket very soon.

Indeed ...

http://www.cricinfo.com/england/content/current/story/414514.html

Andrew Flintoff has called a press conference at 12.30pm today, in which he will announce his retirement from Test cricket at the end of this Ashes summer, although he still intends to make himself available for Twenty20 and ODI cricket.