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Thanks Kev - but is a new manager needed?

Should Maher go?

  • Yes

    Votes: 160 29.3%
  • No

    Votes: 281 51.4%
  • On the fence

    Votes: 106 19.4%

  • Total voters
    547
I like your posts, and its great to have some inside info.

No offense, but the complete authority with which you are dismissing anyone elses opinions is coming across as a bit arrogant tho at times. As though nowone elses opinions or sources are valid.

Somethings happened morale and spirit wise, that much is clear. Sometimes there is more then meets the eye.

I’m not dismissing opinions. I’m clearing up misinformation. If people want to be Maher Out or Maher In, it’s up to the individual. I’m obviously Maher In, but I can see the flaws he has. It’s a shame most of the Maher Out can’t see any of his pros.

I’m happy to not share the stuff I do, if that stops upsetting people.

The last few days, obviously with the result yesterday has made it a bad place to be. I’ve not even looked at the post match thread. Thankfully my day shifts are done before Christmas now, so I don’t need to use SZ as a way of making the day go quicker.
 
I’m not dismissing opinions. I’m clearing up misinformation. If people want to be Maher Out or Maher In, it’s up to the individual. I’m obviously Maher In, but I can see the flaws he has. It’s a shame most of the Maher Out can’t see any of his pros.

I’m happy to not share the stuff I do, if that stops upsetting people.

The last few days, obviously with the result yesterday has made it a bad place to be. I’ve not even looked at the post match thread. Thankfully my day shifts are done before Christmas now, so I don’t need to use SZ as a way of making the day go quicker.
Not upsetting me at all. Dont take it personally. I guess after 4 years of in the know claims about things that havent transpired to be true (often with no ill intention) its a bit draining when someone comes on and immediately dismisses what other people have heard, lacks any sense of humility.
 
Not upsetting me at all. Dont take it personally. I guess after 4 years of in the know claims about things that havent transpired to be true (often with no ill intention) its a bit draining when someone comes on and immediately dismisses what other people have heard, lacks any sense of humility.

I’d be intrigued to know the bits that haven’t come true.

Normally, when something starts as a rumour, and this isn’t just Southend United related, it isn’t true. You have to know where it’s coming from, or it being from someone with some sort of track record. I believe I’ve proved myself to have a track record. Whether people want to believe that or not is up to them. Same as when a poster, with no track record, says I’ve heard X, Y & Z.

Sorry for my apparent lack of “humility” when shooting down stuff that I know not to be true. I’d rather nip things in the bud.

I’m happy for people to question Maher’s tactics, substitutions, signings etc but when there are things that aren’t true, I’m also happy to dismiss them.

Some people, and I’m not labelling you here, seem to be happy when I say we are after a striker with 82 goals in 12 matches blah blah blah, and will believe that, but don’t want to believe stuff I say that doesn’t fit in with their agendas.
 
That never happened.

The players refused to play with Kensdale, but Kev never wanted to sweep it under the carpet.
Well I certainly don't claim to be in the know as much as you.

I heard that kensdale flat out denied any wrongdoing, even offering certain players out.

Maher told the players it would be dealt with "in house" not actually saying that the club would sack him but alluding he still had a part to play.

The players said to Maher that they would refuse to play alongside Kensdale and were unhappy at the notion that Kensdale may have a way back.

This is the point that things changed IMHO.
 
I just can’t get motivated to watch this dross, that’s a little over 20 years, of watching through our downfall etc and this is the least I’ve wanted to go to and watch the football.

You are guaranteed to not be entertained, you know exactly how we are going to play, you know that unless we are up against one of the top 4/5 teams and we concede a few, you won’t see many goals.

Unless this changes soon attendances will drop off and to be pessimistic, there’s a possibility we end up in a relegation scrap as it’s just rinse and repeat.

I think kev has hard the hardest job in football and has conducted himself in an exemplary manner, got results no one else could dream of. Of course it would be unjust of him to not get a proper season and a proper summer of recruitment. BUT, life is full of injustices and personally as gutted as I would be to not have that legend at the helm, if this doesn’t improve through January I’d be almost just as disappointed to not see a new face in the dugout.
 
Maher needs to prove his management skills now... these players may not be top 3. but they are far better than where we are now, certainly we should be fighting for a play off place ..
3 centre backs has not worked for us for 2 years. its not going to now.. not only does it not work it Is painful to watch, I mean really f..... boring ...

this is the national league. you dont need to spend 5 minutes breaking apart the oppositions defence. defenders in the league are big slow lumps. get it to feet at pace and move ! make them play running back to their goal. sure that cant happen all the time, but with us. It never happens. we let these teams get set with 2 banks of 4 while we are still guffing around in our own half out wide. when was the last time we made a break with 3 or 4 players piling forward off the ball ..?

play 4 across the back , a unit of defenders with the keeper, who know what each person is doing.

stick a holding midfielder in if you are scared of the opposition or away at a tough place to go .. if you want to

other wise switch it up from 433. 442. or 451. during the game. switch the front 3 around when we play em. let the players decide when! .

change it up in the first half if needs be. not always at 65 minutes..

football should not be hard to watch, soon sitting In a car trying to get into lakeside on a Saturday will be preferable to this season. and a lot of last.
 
Something has gone very wrong this season. You can point to the set up, tactics, formations recruitment etc but this isn’t far short of the squad that would have had us in the play offs last season without the -10pts. That included playing some of the season with less than 16 players and at times with 1 sub with Vhilete and Brooklyn upfront. Despite another disrupted preseason and embargo there shouldn’t be any excuses now. For the first month or so Kev can point to lack of fitness and pre season. We had the same situ the year before as well yet we performed very differently. The likes Wes and Powell have left but neither were good enough and not many were disappointed they left. The loss of Cardwell and Kensdale for different reasons defo hit us hard. However that doesn’t excuse some of the performances. So many players are off the pace and not performing to the standards we expect. The likes of Gus, Husin, Miley, Bridge, Walker, Bonne, Muncur, Crowther, to name a few are so under performing. This isn’t to say they aren’t good players but at the moment they are way off. Yet they get picked
Week after week. Yesterday Miley and Bridge were dreadful yet stayed on and arguably our most consistent midfielders in Coker and Morton who TBf has been a good signing get taken off. Kevs reliance on the 5-3-2 which isn’t working is baffling. We don’t have bad players but the system and tactics is killing them. KAF doesn’t get a chance, Kendall brought in yet not starting despite our current forward line barely having goals to their name. Yesterday he came on in the 81st minute at 3-0 down. Wind has performed well and if we were going defensive he should have started ahead of Gus who isn’t a good defender. Play gubbins or Golding and push Ralph to LWB. Kevs decisions will end up
Costing him his job. I love the guy and for what he has done this past few years will and should never be forgotten but time is running out I’m afraid and unless he can become less loyal and stubborn to certain players and tactics then he has to go. 6pts are a must in the next two or there could be a very large fan revolt against the three amigos. Have the players themselves grown tired of the boring tactics? Some looked disinterested yesterday and that’s never a good sign
We're getting into treating players like robots again.

We all know how indifferent many on here were about Powell and Fonguck leaving, but what about how the players felt? Especially with Kensdale and Cardwell on top.

When you're majority cooking on team spirit and togetherness like we were last season, it makes losing one or two squad members, or a major breach of trust from someone you've been to war with, all the more impactful.

It's not all about ability alone, especially, as I said, in situations like last season. Powell and Fonguck were big, popular characters. Doesn't matter how good they are, or how often they played. Their effects on morale, togetherness and training pitch/dressing room atmosphere were enormous. Same with Dave Martin. Similar, then, with Kensdale and Cardwell. That's a lot of characters to lose from a small and tightly-knit squad in a short space of time, and that's before you even get onto being unable to replace them with the ability AND the personalities that you want.

Lose to ebbsfleet, who are woeful infront of over 8k and I can really see things getting toxic.

Didn't go yesterday or watch as I was at a wedding but the highlights are dreadful.

How is Miley getting game time? In the highlights he was literally just walking to close down.

I heard a rumour of Kev wanting to sweep the kensdale situation under the carpet and the players saying they would refuse to play in the same team. This forced kevs hand. We have been dreadful and I'm wondering if the players lost respect for him. This certainly isn't a side that is playing at 100% or anywhere close.

Something has to change. Either the style and or the starting 11 or the management. Worryingly, I can't see any of the above changing.

I hope Cosu aren't expecting 7k average next season and season card renewals. We will be lucky to get 5500 avergage playing this grade of football.
Maybe, maybe not. I think that those who are so vehemently "Maher Out" are very probably a vocal minority at the moment, so I don't think we're at a toxic stage yet. You could well be right though, and that the atmosphere won't be great if we lose to Ebbsfleet.

I have to say, I was told the same that Kev wanted it to just go away and carry on as if nothing happened. Apparently he didn’t even want to hear about it and the players should sort. It was only when players made threats that he finally stepped in.
Absolutely not what I've heard. There may have been a big dose of disappointment on Maher's side - both disappointment in Kensdale, and disappointment/worry in losing yet another of his top players. It's a natural human reaction to struggle to face up to such disappointment. I dont believe he ever wanted to sweep anything under the carpet though. The players caught wind of what was going on, they were in charge of the money stolen, and so it was logical that they should be the ones to get the proof and then present it.

What proof of that do you have? They’ve never had to make such a decision before and is it really a panic button when you’ve won just 6 games all season? Failure to win the next two games should trigger a change.
We are 8 points off the playoffs and 7 off the relegation zone, with 69 points left to play for, in a season that the club's hierarchy knew might be difficult/that we might be starting from a position behind other clubs who are gunning for playoff positions. So no, I don't believe it is time to **** the bed at the moment.

I think it’s clear that a (good) few new players are needed. One thing I can’t understand with Kev is that even when he signs players, often for players who are failing, he seems to want the incumbents to have a chance before the new player. It seems that even if we signed the Liverpool first team that they’d have to wait 4 games to get a start. The only explanations are that he feels they need time to understand the system - which should be made more simpler if that’s the case; or he is signing player to make up the numbers still - and maybe Golding is no better than Crowther after all.
He is very loyal to his players, especially the ones that gave him so much in dire circumstances last season, but not exclusively to them. You could say he's loyal to a fault, and perhaps needs to ease off a bit in that respect. I think that gets confused with having "favourites". If, perhaps, he does have some favourites, then there is a logical reason why. Like I said though, that can be a flaw.

Well I certainly don't claim to be in the know as much as you.

I heard that kensdale flat out denied any wrongdoing, even offering certain players out.

Maher told the players it would be dealt with "in house" not actually saying that the club would sack him but alluding he still had a part to play.

The players said to Maher that they would refuse to play alongside Kensdale and were unhappy at the notion that Kensdale may have a way back.

This is the point that things changed IMHO.
If anybody thinks he was alluding to him still having a part to play, then I believe they misunderstood.

From what I heard, Maher knew pretty early on what would ultimately happen.

He also used the phrase "it's being dealt with in house" in interviews. What I understand him to have meant by that, is that it was being dealt by people above him, namely Tom L as CEO. The club needed to go through the process properly from start to finish - investigation, and then due legal process around contract termination, and they wanted it hush hush so that it was legally watertight at the club's end, and there was no risk of them getting sued or taken to arbitration.

I don't doubt for a second that Maher was very happy to wash his hands of that and to leave it to other people, hence the "in house" comments. I think he'll also have been told to be very careful about what he says to anyone - including his players. None of that means he wanted anything swept under the carpet, and I'm confident that any rumour to the contrary is inaccurate and/or a misunderstanding/misrepresentation.
 
I’d be intrigued to know the bits that haven’t come true.

Normally, when something starts as a rumour, and this isn’t just Southend United related, it isn’t true. You have to know where it’s coming from, or it being from someone with some sort of track record. I believe I’ve proved myself to have a track record. Whether people want to believe that or not is up to them. Same as when a poster, with no track record, says I’ve heard X, Y & Z.

Sorry for my apparent lack of “humility” when shooting down stuff that I know not to be true. I’d rather nip things in the bud.

I’m happy for people to question Maher’s tactics, substitutions, signings etc but when there are things that aren’t true, I’m also happy to dismiss them.

Some people, and I’m not labelling you here, seem to be happy when I say we are after a striker with 82 goals in 12 matches blah blah blah, and will believe that, but don’t want to believe stuff I say that doesn’t fit in with their agendas.
I think most of us on here are quite capable of discerning speculation posing as fact. With anonymity providing cover for those claiming to be in the know without needing to prove their credentials it is wise to be sceptical about all such pronouncements until proof is provided. Gossip is gossip from whatever the source.
 
We're getting into treating players like robots again.

We all know how indifferent many on here were about Powell and Fonguck leaving, but what about how the players felt? Especially with Kensdale and Cardwell on top.

When you're majority cooking on team spirit and togetherness like we were last season, it makes losing one or two squad members, or a major breach of trust from someone you've been to war with, all the more impactful.

It's not all about ability alone, especially, as I said, in situations like last season. Powell and Fonguck were big, popular characters. Doesn't matter how good they are, or how often they played. Their effects on morale, togetherness and training pitch/dressing room atmosphere were enormous. Same with Dave Martin. Similar, then, with Kensdale and Cardwell. That's a lot of characters to lose from a small and tightly-knit squad in a short space of time, and that's before you even get onto being unable to replace them with the ability AND the personalities that you want.


Maybe, maybe not. I think that those who are so vehemently "Maher Out" are very probably a vocal minority at the moment, so I don't think we're at a toxic stage yet. You could well be right though, and that the atmosphere won't be great if we lose to Ebbsfleet.


Absolutely not what I've heard. There may have been a big dose of disappointment on Maher's side - both disappointment in Kensdale, and disappointment/worry in losing yet another of his top players. It's a natural human reaction to struggle to face up to such disappointment. I dont believe he ever wanted to sweep anything under the carpet though. The players caught wind of what was going on, they were in charge of the money stolen, and so it was logical that they should be the ones to get the proof and then present it.


We are 8 points off the playoffs and 7 off the relegation zone, with 69 points left to play for, in a season that the club's hierarchy knew might be difficult/that we might be starting from a position behind other clubs who are gunning for playoff positions. So no, I don't believe it is time to **** the bed at the moment.


He is very loyal to his players, especially the ones that gave him so much in dire circumstances last season, but not exclusively to them. You could say he's loyal to a fault, and perhaps needs to ease off a bit in that respect. I think that gets confused with having "favourites". If, perhaps, he does have some favourites, then there is a logical reason why. Like I said though, that can be a flaw.


If anybody thinks he was alluding to him still having a part to play, then I believe they misunderstood.

From what I heard, Maher knew pretty early on what would ultimately happen.

He also used the phrase "it's being dealt with in house" in interviews. What I understand him to have meant by that, is that it was being dealt by people above him, namely Tom L as CEO. The club needed to go through the process properly from start to finish - investigation, and then due legal process around contract termination, and they wanted it hush hush so that it was legally watertight at the club's end, and there was no risk of them getting sued or taken to arbitration.

I don't doubt for a second that Maher was very happy to wash his hands of that and to leave it to other people, hence the "in house" comments. I think he'll also have been told to be very careful about what he says to anyone - including his players. None of that means he wanted anything swept under the carpet, and I'm confident that any rumour to the contrary is inaccurate and/or a misunderstanding/misrepresentation.
Interesting post Medway Blue.
It must of taken ages to put all this together. You must of had time on your hands at work 😉 , anyhow happy Christmas 🎄
 
I’m not dismissing opinions. I’m clearing up misinformation. If people want to be Maher Out or Maher In, it’s up to the individual. I’m obviously Maher In, but I can see the flaws he has. It’s a shame most of the Maher Out can’t see any of his pros.

I’m happy to not share the stuff I do, if that stops upsetting people.

The last few days, obviously with the result yesterday has made it a bad place to be. I’ve not even looked at the post match thread. Thankfully my day shifts are done before Christmas now, so I don’t need to use SZ as a way of making the day go quicker.

Please post BW with info, those who donot want to read can put you on ignore, but I guess the majority of us are happy with your posts
Have a good Christmas and get in the LM training 😂
 
I think the Xmas fixture are kind to us and Kev and 6 points is a must , fail to beat either ebbsfleet or Braintree and it’s got to be a thanks for your efforts but we need someone else .

FWIW I think we will beat both comfortably and maybe just maybe this could be the start of something to cheer about and get us up the table
I thought this a few games ago!
 
I think that those who are so vehemently "Maher Out" are very probably a vocal minority at the moment, so I don't think we're at a toxic stage yet. You could well be right though, and that the atmosphere won't be great if we lose to Ebbsfleet.
Despite heartfelt renewed expressions from some of a desire for KM to be replaced, it's interesting how Saturdays result / performance is being reflected in the poll.
On Friday the Yes vote was at 135 now 156.
The No's were at 289 now 282
On the fence was 98 now 100
up to 539 votes in total.
So after a few extra votes (27) and some changing of previous cast votes it
seems to indicate, that if the Zone is reflective of the wider fanbase and I believe a sample of 500 is considered a good indication by pollster's, the majority of Southend supporters are 'still' not supportive of KM removal. Well not yet anyway.
 
We're getting into treating players like robots again.

We all know how indifferent many on here were about Powell and Fonguck leaving, but what about how the players felt? Especially with Kensdale and Cardwell on top.

When you're majority cooking on team spirit and togetherness like we were last season, it makes losing one or two squad members, or a major breach of trust from someone you've been to war with, all the more impactful.

It's not all about ability alone, especially, as I said, in situations like last season. Powell and Fonguck were big, popular characters. Doesn't matter how good they are, or how often they played. Their effects on morale, togetherness and training pitch/dressing room atmosphere were enormous. Same with Dave Martin. Similar, then, with Kensdale and Cardwell. That's a lot of characters to lose from a small and tightly-knit squad in a short space of time, and that's before you even get onto being unable to replace them with the ability AND the personalities that you want.


Maybe, maybe not. I think that those who are so vehemently "Maher Out" are very probably a vocal minority at the moment, so I don't think we're at a toxic stage yet. You could well be right though, and that the atmosphere won't be great if we lose to Ebbsfleet.


Absolutely not what I've heard. There may have been a big dose of disappointment on Maher's side - both disappointment in Kensdale, and disappointment/worry in losing yet another of his top players. It's a natural human reaction to struggle to face up to such disappointment. I dont believe he ever wanted to sweep anything under the carpet though. The players caught wind of what was going on, they were in charge of the money stolen, and so it was logical that they should be the ones to get the proof and then present it.


We are 8 points off the playoffs and 7 off the relegation zone, with 69 points left to play for, in a season that the club's hierarchy knew might be difficult/that we might be starting from a position behind other clubs who are gunning for playoff positions. So no, I don't believe it is time to **** the bed at the moment.


He is very loyal to his players, especially the ones that gave him so much in dire circumstances last season, but not exclusively to them. You could say he's loyal to a fault, and perhaps needs to ease off a bit in that respect. I think that gets confused with having "favourites". If, perhaps, he does have some favourites, then there is a logical reason why. Like I said though, that can be a flaw.


If anybody thinks he was alluding to him still having a part to play, then I believe they misunderstood.

From what I heard, Maher knew pretty early on what would ultimately happen.

He also used the phrase "it's being dealt with in house" in interviews. What I understand him to have meant by that, is that it was being dealt by people above him, namely Tom L as CEO. The club needed to go through the process properly from start to finish - investigation, and then due legal process around contract termination, and they wanted it hush hush so that it was legally watertight at the club's end, and there was no risk of them getting sued or taken to arbitration.

I don't doubt for a second that Maher was very happy to wash his hands of that and to leave it to other people, hence the "in house" comments. I think he'll also have been told to be very careful about what he says to anyone - including his players. None of that means he wanted anything swept under the carpet, and I'm confident that any rumour to the contrary is inaccurate and/or a misunderstanding/misrepresentation.
@Medway Blue playing 5-3-2 don’t help at all, it’s holding the players back, most of NL side play 4-4-2/4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1, with paces and athleticism.

Mahar style of football is boring, slow, bland and no paces at all. He played 4-3-3 twice, against FGR and Halifax, we played better and at paces too. It’s play to our player’s strengths too.
 
Despite heartfelt renewed expressions from some of a desire for KM to be replaced, it's interesting how Saturdays result / performance is being reflected in the poll.
On Friday the Yes vote was at 135 now 156.
The No's were at 289 now 282
On the fence was 98 now 100
up to 539 votes in total.
So after a few extra votes (27) and some changing of previous cast votes it
seems to indicate, that if the Zone is reflective of the wider fanbase and I believe a sample of 500 is considered a goods indication by pollster's, the majority of Southend supporters are 'still' not supportive of KM removal. Well not yet anyway.
2 wins, decent games of football and goals from kendall will go a long way for a lot of people. Said it before mid table given the **** show of this season is to be expected, the boredom and crap football, late pointless subs, playing favourites out of form and defensive football has to change tho.
 
I just can’t get motivated to watch this dross, that’s a little over 20 years, of watching through our downfall etc and this is the least I’ve wanted to go to and watch the football.

You are guaranteed to not be entertained, you know exactly how we are going to play, you know that unless we are up against one of the top 4/5 teams and we concede a few, you won’t see many goals.
My thoughts exactly
 

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