Breaking News SZ & Trust meeting with RM Tuesday.

[North Wales Shrimper]

More to the point a smaller ground will be cheaper to build.

I still don't believe that Ron's managed to secure the proper funding to build it even now.

 

[onceknownasrab]

More to the point a smaller ground will be cheaper to build.

I still don't believe that Ron's managed to secure the proper funding to build it even now.

I expect the cost of building the stadium is a done deal with Sainsburys as announced but what good is the stadium without the retail park etc. Its the money for that which is likely the stumbling block but would we be a lot worse off with a new stadium initially on its own with probably less upkeep than the cost of maintaining RH? Is it feasible?

 

[Smiffy]

I expect the cost of building the stadium is a done deal with Sainsburys as announced but what good is the stadium without the retail park etc. Its the money for that which is likely the stumbling block but would we be a lot worse off with a new stadium initially on its own with probably less upkeep than the cost of maintaining RH? Is it feasible?

What isn't feasible is a 3 sided "stadium" without it's main stand and main source of income. Are we all expected to just trust Ron to find someone to fund the 4th side? Let's face it, without it we are finished anyway.

But he will have kept his end of the bargain up, enabling him to commence building of Ron World. Leaving us with a 3 sided pile of ****, with no income streams other than the norm at a stadium. In fact it will be worse, as we wont have a corporate offering (exec boxes, restaurant etc) or club shop. At least at RH we have that, albeit very basic.

The whole thing rings massive alarm bells in my head. Not sure about anyone else?

Latest artists impression of FF below by the way:

 

[ooh-andy-ansah]

The problem with the recession isn't really to do with credit ratings. As far as I'm aware we have the funding in place to build a new ground - Sainsburys are pretty much funding everything.

The issue will be that the whole point of the development from a Commerical stand point was building a shedload of flats and a large retail park. None of which are particularly viable investments in this economy. No one is buying property and shops are closing not opening.

That's not strictly true, Taylor Wimpey for one is doing ok, sound, sensible development projects are going ahead and are still profitable. The main source of funding may be coming from the Sainsbury's deal but there are a whole host of other business related transactions that would require a good solid company behind them. Moving forward how will Ron World be a viable business ? Who will want to deal with the man ?

 

[Beverly Hills Cop Blue]

I imagine McCallister will be told he won't be allowed to sign if and when the Embargo is lifted. Led to believe this is Ron's stance towards him after his embargo tweet.

 

[Jam_Man]

I would be happy with a four sided 15,000 seater stadium. Slightly bigger than we've got at the moment and therefore won't be mostly empty.

It is much easier to expand if we secured ourselves in the Championship than to downsize - aka shut most of it off.

I dont think removing the roof and building extra tiers would have been an easy expansion...

A good example of being able to expand as well is MK Dons

MK Dons is a big stadium without seats in the top tier.

The question is if you do that, does it matter if you actually put seats in, are empty seats any different to empty concrete ?

22,000 was always ambitious, but all of this really isnt worth it for 15,000 which is only 3,000 more than we have. 18,000 would have been a realistic size in my opinion.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

I imagine McCallister will be told he won't be allowed to sign if and when the Embargo is lifted. Led to believe this is Ron's stance towards him after his embargo tweet.

You can understand why some managers (eg Holloway) are totally against players being on social network sites. If it is the case it is rather vindictive of Ron but there again McCallister shares a greater proportion of responsibility in my view. If you are (as he must have been aware) in a rather delicate situation, it's not the most professsional thing, to go blabbing on twitter about it. Whilst he may have pleased some on here by confirming what was already obvious to the great majority of us, he certainly didn't do his own case any good. Sorry, not a lot of sympathy.

 

[Spenser]

'I asked about a break-even crowd figure but RM said that he didn't have a figure but it would significantly higher than the 6500 figure from a few years ago....'

Is it not slightly concerning that our beloved Chairman, a legendary figure in the business world, appears not to know what home crowd is required to break even.

Guess the figure is so high it's irrelevant, but you would have thought the Supreme Leader would know such basic financial
info such as how many punters he needs over the threshold.

Or then again, he could just be lying i s'pose....

 

[onceknownasrab]

What isn't feasible is a 3 sided "stadium" without it's main stand and main source of income. Are we all expected to just trust Ron to find someone to fund the 4th side? Let's face it, without it we are finished anyway.

But he will have kept his end of the bargain up, enabling him to commence building of Ron World. Leaving us with a 3 sided pile of ****, with no income streams other than the norm at a stadium. In fact it will be worse, as we wont have a corporate offering (exec boxes, restaurant etc) or club shop. At least at RH we have that, albeit very basic.

The whole thing rings massive alarm bells in my head. Not sure about anyone else?

Latest artists impression of FF below by the way:

View attachment 1936

I cannot deny that I would be happier with the four sides built and attendant income streams that brings. Again this is why I feel the council should be in talks with us and made patently aware of our concerns and that we want safeguards. They need to be left in no doubt that the project is a calamity in waiting if no constraints are levied.

 

[McNasty]

You can understand why some managers (eg Holloway) are totally against players being on social network sites. If it is the case it is rather vindictive of Ron but there again McCallister shares a greater proportion of responsibility in my view. If you are (as he must have been aware) in a rather delicate situation, it's not the most professsional thing, to go blabbing on twitter about it. Whilst he may have pleased some on here by confirming what was already obvious to the great majority of us, he certainly didn't do his own case any good. Sorry, not a lot of sympathy.

This can be a problem that, short of censorship, is impossible to police. A copy of the tweet was posted on the Zone for all to see. It goes against our policy of freedom of speech to remove a post like that but it leaves the damaging post available for anyone to see.

 

[Smiffy]

I cannot deny that I would be happier with the four sides built and attendant income streams that brings. Again this is why I feel the council should be in talks with us and made patently aware of our concerns and that we want safeguards. They need to be left in no doubt that the project is a calamity in waiting if no constraints are levied.

Agreed.

I did mail them several weeks ago outlining my personal concerns. This was the response.

Thank you for your e-mail in which you outline your concerns for the future of Southend United.

You pose questions which are difficult for me to answer. The Council, Members and officers, have tried to be as supportive to the club as we can be, recognising the importance of a successful football club for the town. We will continue to try to be supportive and positive whilst meeting our statutory duties and responsibilities.

As you will know, the Council is facing significant financial challenges and has extremely limited resources available to put to new projects. That said, I would hope that the type of worst case scenario that you describe will not happen but, if the club did face such circumstances I suspect that councillors would wish to explore how the Council can help keep a viable professional football side in the town for the future.

I am sorry that I can’t be more specific on your questions at present.

Which I thought was fairly encouraging. If anyone else has these concerns then fire them off an email. I can provide the address if you so wish.

 

[onceknownasrab]

Agreed.

I did mail them several weeks ago outlining my personal concerns. This was the response.

Thank you for your e-mail in which you outline your concerns for the future of Southend United.

You pose questions which are difficult for me to answer. The Council, Members and officers, have tried to be as supportive to the club as we can be, recognising the importance of a successful football club for the town. We will continue to try to be supportive and positive whilst meeting our statutory duties and responsibilities.

As you will know, the Council is facing significant financial challenges and has extremely limited resources available to put to new projects. That said, I would hope that the type of worst case scenario that you describe will not happen but, if the club did face such circumstances I suspect that councillors would wish to explore how the Council can help keep a viable professional football side in the town for the future.

I am sorry that I can’t be more specific on your questions at present.

Which I thought was fairly encouraging. If anyone else has these concerns then fire them off an email. I can provide the address if you so wish.

Super. Well done Smiffy. Action and not just words. I think a collective needs to contact the council adding support to your concerns. I know I covered it on another thread but in my view, as the council are essentially ripping up the covenant at boots and laces and ignoring the one on Roots Hall, the least they could do is guarantee the clubs future in return for the gains they make in this project.

Is it possible for one of the techno geeks to do a poll on whether a mass petition to the council is a good move?

 

[Smiffy]

Super. Well done Smiffy. Action and not just words. I think a collective needs to contact the council adding support to your concerns. I know I covered it on another thread but in my view, as the council are essentially ripping up the covenant at boots and laces and ignoring the one on Roots Hall, the least they could do is guarantee the clubs future in return for the gains they make in this project.

Is it possible for one of the techno geeks to do a poll on whether a mass petition to the council is a good move?

I think the SZ masses would need to discuss first, what it is we want from the council.

What assurances?

What answers?

What will these achieve?

Perhaps you could start a new thread outlining your thoughts Sir?...

Then we could perhaps discuss whether a letter to the council (Perhaps with the SZ Owners backing) is a worthwhile exercise.

After all, we were the ones that marched en-mass to the Southend & Rochford Council chambers, to get the plans passed in the first place (Which in hindsight, from my point of view) was perhaps a bit of a blinkered decision. I was one of them and I now feel partly responsible for where we are today.

 

[onceknownasrab]

I think the SZ masses would need to discuss first, what it is we want from the council.

What assurances?

What answers?

What will these achieve?

Perhaps you could start a new thread outlining your thoughts Sir?...

Then we could perhaps discuss whether a letter to the council (Perhaps with the SZ Owners backing) is a worthwhile exercise.

After all, we were the ones that marched en-mass to the Southend & Rochford Council chambers, to get the plans passed in the first place (Which in hindsight, from my point of view) was perhaps a bit of a blinkered decision. I was one of them and I now feel partly responsible for where we are today.

Not blinkered. We wanted the plans passes but in hindsight we have identified a snagging list. I will put my limited brain cells to the task in hand and if ok with you I will pm you with an outline thread and see if we can get a few bods on board to lobby the council. I also feel Sainsburys should be made aware as I am sure they would not want too much adverse publicity as to their involvement in a scheme that callously destroys a towns football club.

 

[Welly7]

Beggars belief. It really does. It's more than a few thousand as well, isn't it Ron?!...

Why are we sitting on away ticket money? That really is terrible behaviour.

And Ron you know as well as I do, things like that lead to Embargo. So whatever way you want to spin it. We are under Embargo for various non-payment of football debts. Why not just admit it? It just makes it all worse when you continue to treat fans like idiots.

And thats just what he's doing. Treating us like idiots. Again. And still he feels he can get away with what he's been doing for a while now. I find it shocking that he refutes the embargo claims and expects the fans to think 'oh well, Ron said we're not so thats that then!' A friend of mine text me what was said at the meeting early this morning and I was expecting zone to have a really strong reaction to this.

Luggy was right that 'Martin out' chants don't help the team, but whats more harmful to the whole club is Martin's continual lies, spin and disregard for its supporters. I've stopped believing anything he says years ago and nothing has changed/been done since to even warrant me reconsidering that. My personal belief is that we're in up to our necks big time and unless there is a major change at the top then we're going nowhere. I really fear for my club and its future. I hope there are more chants about him. Protests against him to let him know we're far from happy and I hope those that have a voice which is respected amongst fans can get things going.

...as the chants from Saturday said... 'you lying b*stard, get out of our club...'

 

[Wise Head]

I think the SZ masses would need to discuss first, what it is we want from the council.

What assurances?

What answers?

What will these achieve?

Perhaps you could start a new thread outlining your thoughts Sir?...

Then we could perhaps discuss whether a letter to the council (Perhaps with the SZ Owners backing) is a worthwhile exercise.

After all, we were the ones that marched en-mass to the Southend & Rochford Council chambers, to get the plans passed in the first place (Which in hindsight, from my point of view) was perhaps a bit of a blinkered decision. I was one of them and I now feel partly responsible for where we are today.

Complete red herring from onceknownasron. the council have granted planning permission when asked and bent over backwards to be flexible to the new stadium, even down to agreeing to a 3 sided stadium. We have to remember that not all council taxpayers would be in favour of having other services cut to fund Ron's project as he will be the beneficiary as he will own stadium.
The council and Sainsburys have done their bit and have gone as far as they can. It is up to Ron to get on and build it or more aside and offer the project out to others to share or take over. Ron needs to stop blaming other parties and make a decision one way or the other.

 

[Smiffy]

Not blinkered. We wanted the plans passes but in hindsight we have identified a snagging list. I will put my limited brain cells to the task in hand and if ok with you I will pm you with an outline thread and see if we can get a few bods on board to lobby the council. I also feel Sainsburys should be made aware as I am sure they would not want too much adverse publicity as to their involvement in a scheme that callously destroys a towns football club.

I have done my bit and I am happy enough with the response. If you have further questions for the council, then I am happy to PM you an email contact, for you to take your concerns up with them personally. But I'm not sure a mass petition is really needed against the council, who for me have been incredibly helpful and supportive.

 

[onceknownasrab]

Complete red herring from onceknownasron. the council have granted planning permission when asked and bent over backwards to be flexible to the new stadium, even down to agreeing to a 3 sided stadium. We have to remember that not all council taxpayers would be in favour of having other services cut to fund Ron's project as he will be the beneficiary as he will own stadium.
The council and Sainsburys have done their bit and have gone as far as they can. It is up to Ron to get on and build it or more aside and offer the project out to others to share or take over. Ron needs to stop blaming other parties and make a decision one way or the other.

Thats your view. lets get a consensus. The council can be influenced in our favour and should be mindful. Supporters are council taxpayers too. The club is a big employer. A successful club reflects well upon the town and I for one would be happy to instigate a legal review into the covenants and how they are trampled on. In fact I am going to.

 

[Jam_Man]

Its not anyone's view its a fact, the council have agreed the stadium.

I'm not sure what you think the council are doing to stop the development.

Trust me if it was the council dragging their feet Ron would be shouting from the rooftops about it.

 

[onceknownasrab]

I have done my bit and I am happy enough with the response. If you have further questions for the council, then I am happy to PM you an email contact, for you to take your concerns up with them personally. But I'm not sure a mass petition is really needed against the council, who for me have been incredibly helpful and supportive.

Maybe I am clutching at straws but I am more convinced that I need to be involved in doing something rather than waiting for disaster. You say the council has been helpful and supportive and I am not trying to lambast them but would like them to be ever vigilant of pitfuls and mindful of our concerns. I cannot believe it is in the councils interest to have a three sided stadium and no club. Does little for the town.