No rude hand gestures allowed

[blue sky]

Perhaps you can send these officious stewards over to the East Greens. I'm fed-up having to wait 15 minutes to get out of the East Greens at the end of games because of all the people stopping to gawp at the TV by the exit while the stewards hide round the corner by the Far-Post Bar entrance, oblivious to the crush that builds up.

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Mar. 13 2005,18:36)]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 13 2005,18:13)]Of course the reaction of the stewards seems over-officious and entirely unempathetic with the passion that being a supporter brings to these moments and we all know so well. And as all these incidents escalate, when stewards with an extremely limited brain capacity continue to bathe in their limited power it only goes to incite us fans even more.

But let's not try and pretend that making such hand gestures is all good and great and should be actively encouraged - as seems to be the growing feeling in this thread. Would you make a gesture like this to someone on the street or in a bar without expecting repercussions? No. So why should it be any different at a football ground, surrounded by children and women?

And to confuse this issue with fans who don't care or show passion is to hide behind am extremely thin argument.

I wouldn't make that gesture in the street no, I do it at football because I feel that is the time and place for it. I am not in a family stand but behind the goal - traditionally the place where the more vocal and passionate fans congregate. To my mind if you go in that part of the ground then you must expect to see and hear certain things.

I have no problem with people who choose to watch the game in a more sedate manner, but feel there has to be a place in football for a certain amount of passionate support.

I know this goes on, in the heat of the moment it's a laugh, part of the game and I totally agree, should be overlooked by any sensible steward. All I am saying is, in a reasonably civilized society, let's not try and kid ourselves that this kind of behaviour should be actively encouraged and endorsed. The fact that you say football is the time and place to do this merely means you think it's the time and place where you might get away with it. On this occasion you didn't.

Yes, people can expect to hear and see certain things at football matches but does that make it ok? After all, 20 years ago at The Den, people could expect to hear monkey noises and racist chants couldn't they?

I know that's an extreme example and I wait to be shot down... but please just take a look at my user-name.

DA

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,07:30)]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Mar. 13 2005,18:36)]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 13 2005,18:13)]Of course the reaction of the stewards seems over-officious and entirely unempathetic with the passion that being a supporter brings to these moments and we all know so well. And as all these incidents escalate, when stewards with an extremely limited brain capacity continue to bathe in their limited power it only goes to incite us fans even more.

But let's not try and pretend that making such hand gestures is all good and great and should be actively encouraged - as seems to be the growing feeling in this thread. Would you make a gesture like this to someone on the street or in a bar without expecting repercussions? No. So why should it be any different at a football ground, surrounded by children and women?

And to confuse this issue with fans who don't care or show passion is to hide behind am extremely thin argument.

I wouldn't make that gesture in the street no, I do it at football because I feel that is the time and place for it. I am not in a family stand but behind the goal - traditionally the place where the more vocal and passionate fans congregate. To my mind if you go in that part of the ground then you must expect to see and hear certain things.

I have no problem with people who choose to watch the game in a more sedate manner, but feel there has to be a place in football for a certain amount of passionate support.

I know this goes on, in the heat of the moment it's a laugh, part of the game and I totally agree, should be overlooked by any sensible steward. All I am saying is, in a reasonably civilized society, let's not try and kid ourselves that this kind of behaviour should be actively encouraged and endorsed. The fact that you say football is the time and place to do this merely means you think it's the time and place where you might get away with it. On this occasion you didn't.

Yes, people can expect to hear and see certain things at football matches but does that make it ok? After all, 20 years ago at The Den, people could expect to hear monkey noises and racist chants couldn't they?

I know that's an extreme example and I wait to be shot down... but please just take a look at my user-name.

DA

I agree with DA.

If you are an adult you should act like one, not like a schoolboy giving the W sign out of a coach window.

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,07:30)]I know this goes on, in the heat of the moment it's a laugh, part of the game and I totally agree, should be overlooked by any sensible steward. All I am saying is, in a reasonably civilized society, let's not try and kid ourselves that this kind of behaviour should be actively encouraged and endorsed. The fact that you say football is the time and place to do this merely means you think it's the time and place where you might get away with it. On this occasion you didn't.

Yes, people can expect to hear and see certain things at football matches but does that make it ok? After all, 20 years ago at The Den, people could expect to hear monkey noises and racist chants couldn't they?

I know that's an extreme example and I wait to be shot down... but please just take a look at my user-name.

DA

Sorry, that strikes me as utter rubbish. If we are going to ban waving hand gestures, non-specifically towards the pitch, what else should be banned and what else doesn't comply with what we should be doing in society.

Are we allowed to jump up in the air and shout "YEAAHHH!" when we score? Perhaps clapping along to "Hey Baby" is childish and should be banned? Using the term "by far the greatest team" would never come up in everyday conversation, maybe we shouldn't shout it at a football match?

Instead, you name me one person who really gave a toss (pardon the pun) about the hand gesture and maybe we can work out why that would be enough to be banned.

As for the Millwall example, I'm sorry, but that's a terrible example. Racism is an incendiary gesture or remark based on the colour of someones skin showing a prejudice based on nothing other than that person's skin colour or ethnic origin. If your example is valid, perhaps you are suggesting that people should lay off those who masturbate because it is discriminatory towards masturbaters.

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,09:03)]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,07:30)]I know this goes on, in the heat of the moment it's a laugh, part of the game and I totally agree, should be overlooked by any sensible steward. All I am saying is, in a reasonably civilized society, let's not try and kid ourselves that this kind of behaviour should be actively encouraged and endorsed. The fact that you say football is the time and place to do this merely means you think it's the time and place where you might get away with it. On this occasion you didn't.

Yes, people can expect to hear and see certain things at football matches but does that make it ok? After all, 20 years ago at The Den, people could expect to hear monkey noises and racist chants couldn't they?

I know that's an extreme example and I wait to be shot down... but please just take a look at my user-name.

DA

Sorry, that strikes me as utter rubbish.  If we are going to ban waving hand gestures, non-specifically towards the pitch, what else should be banned and what else doesn't comply with what we should be doing in society.

Are we allowed to jump up in the air and shout "YEAAHHH!" when we score?  Perhaps clapping along to "Hey Baby" is childish and should be banned?  Using the term "by far the greatest team" would never come up in everyday conversation, maybe we shouldn't shout it at a football match?

Instead, you name me one person who really gave a toss (pardon the pun) about the hand gesture and maybe we can work out why that would be enough to be banned.

As for the Millwall example, I'm sorry, but that's a terrible example.  Racism is an incendiary gesture or remark based on the colour of someones skin showing a prejudice based on nothing other than that person's skin colour or ethnic origin.  If your example is valid, perhaps you are suggesting that people should lay off those who masturbate because it is discriminatory towards masturbaters.

A ban should not be implemented by the club I agree. It would be impossible to enforce and would cause far more problems than it would solve. What I objected to was the tone of this thread - not only trying to justify what to many is an obscene jesture but actively encourage it. I'm trying to say it's our responsibility to act in a civilized manner not that of some half-wit in a yellow coat.

On the topic of poor examples, does the difference between calling someone a w***er and cheering a goal, singing along to Hey Baby or clapping really need explaining?

 

[Hooly]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,07:30)]All I am saying is, in a reasonably civilized society, let's not try and kid ourselves that this kind of behaviour should be actively encouraged and endorsed. The fact that you say football is the time and place to do this merely means you think it's the time and place where you might get away with it. On this occasion you didn't.

Yes, people can expect to hear and see certain things at football matches but does that make it ok?

Excellent points DA (taking note of the post name), but only if you want a game in a sterile atmosphere full of Keano's favourite prawn sandwich eaters.  Is that how you want to watch your football.  Without any passion?  No not for me thank you.

If you really want to go to a game where no-one shouts anything or waves anything or says anything have you tried netball?  Or to take it a stage further try polo, I'm sure they'd welcome the civilised silence you think appopriate & the horses are probably better looking than the netball players!

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,09:24)]A ban should not be implemented by the club I agree. It would be impossible to enforce and would cause far more problems than it would solve. What I objected to was the tone of this thread - not only trying to justify what to many is an obscene jesture but actively encourage it. I'm trying to say it's our responsibility to act in a civilized manner not that of some half-wit in a yellow coat.

On the topic of poor examples, does the difference between calling someone a w***er and cheering a goal, singing along to Hey Baby or clapping really need explaining?

The differences are not so much the issue as the similarity. Each is something that would not be acceptable in the street or would be frowned upon by passers by. Neither I, nor my represented party, would suggest it's the sort of gesture that is acceptable at all times however, the sentiment behind the gesture combined with how it affects the intended target is surely much more significant than the gesture itself.

For instance, I may jokingly use the gesture to a friend and the friend will appreciate it as a joke. The big man upstairs sometimes makes the gesture to St. Peter if he lets the odd rotten apple in but St. Peter appreciates God's humour in this respect. At a football match, it is a reaction to something that has happened on the pitch. However, I'm not convinced the target, usually a player, would be in the least bit affected, nor the other supporters in the stand.

Admittedly, we don't want people walking round the street calling any Tom, Dick or Abraham a masturbator using the hand gesture but is there really any harm making the gesture at a football match in a stand typically full of grown men and women?

Also, posting under a pseudonym is fun.

GA

 

[Hooly]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Mar. 14 2005,09:24)]I'm trying to say it's our responsibility to act in a civilized manner not that of some half-wit in a yellow coat.

If you're going to come on here pontificating these "football should be played in a morgue" views could you at least do it under a proper user name so that we have chance of knowing who you are, as sooner or later we all get to know who's who.  The one thing I hate about open boards is that anonymous people come on here & tell us what to do without the guts to put their name to it.  Ron, Jávea, myself and most of the others are well enough known that if someone takes issue with us we can talk face to face.  You come on here telling us what to do but won't actually back it up with your own moniker.  In my eyes & using your own phrasing that makes you no better than jobsworth "some half-wit in a yellow coat" who say I'm only doing because I'm told to.

 

[McNasty]

Let's return to the days of football when it was a working bloke's game , long before political correctness, girly girls, and lefties, commies, and all the people who are trying to turn a man's game, with all the passion, into a sterile waste of time.
The steward in the SU told a fellow poster to "sit properly on your seat , not perched on the front of it ". What next?

 

[Westcliff Shrimper]

Quote[/b] (mcnasty @ Mar. 14 2005,10:11)]The steward in the SU told a fellow poster to "sit properly on your seat , not perched on the front of it ". What next?

Who said that? That bloke needs a personality bypass....

 

[sufcintheprem]

Quote[/b] (Hooly @ Mar. 14 2005,09:48)]sooner or later we all get to know who's who.

Well, that's not strictly true is it?

Quote[/b] ]The one thing I hate about open boards is that anonymous people come on here & tell us what to do without the guts to put their name to it.

I think I could condone it if the name is changed for comic purpose

 

[Hooly]

Quote[/b] (sufcintheprem @ Mar. 14 2005,10:29)]

Quote[/b] (Hooly @ Mar. 14 2005,09:48)]sooner or later we all get to know who's who.

Well, that's not strictly true is it?

Quote[/b] ]The one thing I hate about open boards is that anonymous people come on here & tell us what to do without the guts to put their name to it.

I think I could condone it if the name is changed for comic purpose

Ok Mr/Miss/Ms/Dr/Rev/Right Honourable/Royal Highness Picky

perhaps a sweeping generality, but let's say most of us know who the majority of our fellow posters are.

I hate comic names on here.  Some bloke posted for weeks on here as Happy Clappy Hooly!  That put my miserable old git lack of street credibilty to shame.  At least when ArseMad posted his complete carp he always did it under his own name so I knew who to bully!  

Piers
Not sitting properly on the edge of my seat, again!

 

[CANV]

'you wouldnt do it on the street' dosent really apply..
you wouldnt spend sixteen quid and get 5,000 other people together to watch 22 blokes kick a ball around on the street.. this is all toss, football is about beers, pies, swearing and irrational hatred of a group of strangers for 90 minutes, depite the fact that if you were on tour with england they would be your best mates.. its doesnt make 'adult' sense but there you go its what makes it fun.. if southend f.c. want 5,000 people sitting clapping nicely and discussing that great 'one two' then fine.. they can do without my 16 quid and my mates sixteen quids and beer money on our monthly visits to the hall..

 

[Hooly]

Quote[/b] (CANV @ Mar. 14 2005,12:41)]'you wouldnt do it on the street' dosent really apply..  
you wouldnt spend sixteen quid and get 5,000 other people together to watch 22 blokes kick a ball around on the street..   this is all toss, football is about beers, pies, swearing and irrational hatred of a group of strangers for 90 minutes, depite the fact that if you were on tour with england they would be your best mates..  its doesnt make 'adult' sense but there you go  its what makes it fun..   if southend f.c. want 5,000 people sitting clapping nicely and discussing that great 'one two' then fine.. they can do without my 16 quid and my mates sixteen quids and beer money on our monthly visits to the hall..

Couldn't agree more!

 

[Firestorm]

So the general Concensus is that its the stadium regulations, which i do not recall being changed recently, which are at fault here and not the Steward with the unenviable task of trying to enforce said regulations.

However there is nothing on the official site which explains the stadium regulations and i don't recall anything by the Ticket offices either. (if they are by the turnstiles or inside the ground that is too late because the ticket has already been purchased without sight of the regulations)

There is however a customer charter on the official site
Charter

Mobile phones, btw must be switched off during the game.....

So, do we need the stadium regulations to be reiterated ? then those who feel they are draconian, futile etc can raise the issue directly with the club knowing exactly where the club are coming from and why, ?

 

[sufcintheprem]

Quote[/b] (Hooly @ Mar. 14 2005,10:40)]Ok Mr/Miss/Ms/Dr/Rev/Right Honourable/Royal Highness Picky

Just overlord will do.

Who says sitting in a certain manner on a seat is sitting properly anyhow?

 

[Jonesy tap-in]

Quote[/b] (Hooly @ Mar. 14 2005,12:44)]

Quote[/b] (CANV @ Mar. 14 2005,12:41)]'you wouldnt do it on the street' dosent really apply..
you wouldnt spend sixteen quid and get 5,000 other people together to watch 22 blokes kick a ball around on the street.. this is all toss, football is about beers, pies, swearing and irrational hatred of a group of strangers for 90 minutes, depite the fact that if you were on tour with england they would be your best mates.. its doesnt make 'adult' sense but there you go its what makes it fun.. if southend f.c. want 5,000 people sitting clapping nicely and discussing that great 'one two' then fine.. they can do without my 16 quid and my mates sixteen quids and beer money on our monthly visits to the hall..

Couldn't agree more!

Quote[/b] ]

Quote[/b] (CANV @ Mar. 14 2005,12:41)]'you wouldnt do it on the street' dosent really apply..
you wouldnt spend sixteen quid and get 5,000 other people together to watch 22 blokes kick a ball around on the street.. this is all toss, football is about beers, pies, swearing and irrational hatred of a group of strangers for 90 minutes, depite the fact that if you were on tour with england they would be your best mates.. its doesnt make 'adult' sense but there you go its what makes it fun.. if southend f.c. want 5,000 people sitting clapping nicely and discussing that great 'one two' then fine.. they can do without my 16 quid and my mates sixteen quids and beer money on our monthly visits to the hall..

Couldn't agree more!

Spot on! This is football, not a f*cking pantomime! It's things like this that are eroding the core values of the beatiful game!

Supporting your team is a completely tribal affair. Your team is essentially an extension of yourself and your community and if someone tries to get one over on the team (eg diving), you take it personally. And you want to register this displeasure with whoever the culprit is, whether it be official or player, on their side or yours.

To single individuals out a football match for making obscene gestures is quite frankly ridiculous!

 

[Jonesy tap-in]

Damn browser! Didn't mean to quote that twice.

 

[BluePartridge]

I want my cigarettes Nurse Ratched!

 

[southend_utd_fan]

At some home games my old man gets told to sit down even tho there still about 10 mins to before the game starts!