Freedman Overated

[steveo]

exactly. he has no pace and can't skin a man. surely his best role would be behind the front two (laurent and theo). having him as a target man with theo running off WILL NOT WORK.

All this behind the front two stuff would be fine if we could field 12 players. If you play someone in this role it immediately reduces your strength in the centre of midfield.

 

[Firestorm]

Freedman appeared to be the only one out there tonight (including the management team) who realised that we needed to use the width to spread the Crewe defence across the park and create more space, . During the second half he was constantly pulling wide left and also told Moussa to get out there on several occassions.
Unfortunately when Dougie pulled wide he took his marker with hime (rather than the Crewe right sided midfielder and it did not really help our cause much.

However , at times it did look like he wondered what sort of players he had got with him ?

Imho, he is the most intellegent of our players by a country mile, true he is not the quickest (but I don't recall him ever being known for his pace)

 

[Einstein]

I too think Freedman has lost whatever talent he had.

Whether its the dawning realisation that he has signed for an awful side and has no confidence, or he's just past it.

He just isnt quick enough in the feet to get away from anyone and he doesnt pull into any decent positions or make any good runs. I was especially disappointed in him tonight - for somebody 'experienced' to stand back to goal waiting for the ball to be rolled to him whilst surrounded by 4 red shirts was dumb.

He should of dropped off a bit to link play, or told Robinson to make runs into the channels.

Very disappointed in him and will be no great loss when he and hopefully Barnard are released in May/June god willing...

Unfortunately, I wasn't at the game tonight and I've only seen Freedman on three occasions this season. However, anyone who doubts Freedman clearly knows nothing about football. In those 3 games, he is one of the most intelligent players I've ever seen in a Southend shirt. In fact on first thinking, the only player I could really put infront of him is Mike Marsh.

If he drops off, then it'll mean he has to RUN at his man. Exactly what you are saying he can't do. Great advice.

If the ball comes into his feet then it's what Freedmans quality at. Spin and go. Exactly why Freedman has been playing a higher level of football than Southend have for the last decade.

Perhaps you should head over the Palace forum and understand exactly why they love him. Put your advice across on exactly what Freedman does 'wrong'.

And he is probably encouraging/moaning at players like Francis because they cannot put the ball at his feet which he needs. He's probably found himself thinking "why the hell did I decide to end my fantastic career?" with a team who cannot even pass.

 

[Southend_Lady]

I have to say that Freedman was the only one out there that turned up last night. With the service he is getting from midfield, it's no wonder he didn't score last night. Hoofing the ball upfield every time is not going to win us matches.

 

[Clinton Baptiste]

He must be wondering why he signed when he sees long balls from the back 4 flying over his head.

 

[palexander]

Unfortunately, I wasn't at the game tonight and I've only seen Freedman on three occasions this season. However, anyone who doubts Freedman clearly knows nothing about football. In those 3 games, he is one of the most intelligent players I've ever seen in a Southend shirt. In fact on first thinking, the only player I could really put infront of him is Mike Marsh.

If he drops off, then it'll mean he has to RUN at his man. Exactly what you are saying he can't do. Great advice.

If the ball comes into his feet then it's what Freedmans quality at. Spin and go. Exactly why Freedman has been playing a higher level of football than Southend have for the last decade.

Perhaps you should head over the Palace forum and understand exactly why they love him. Put your advice across on exactly what Freedman does 'wrong'.

And he is probably encouraging/moaning at players like Francis because they cannot put the ball at his feet which he needs. He's probably found himself thinking "why the hell did I decide to end my fantastic career?" with a team who cannot even pass.

FFS... did I say he should "Drop off and then run 30 yards like Stan Collymore"???

My point was, someone of his experience should know better (in my humble opinion) than standing back to goal waiting for the ball to feet when there is no space in behind to run into.

He was clumsy last night when he got the ball, his feet just arent quick enough - I like the guy, but that is what I saw. But hey, I know nothing about football right?

I would have liked to have seen him trying to find space instead - pulling off the back 4 would have taken his marker with him, leaving a gap for the quicker Robinson to run into.

Plus if he drops off, he doesnt have to turn and run - he could get his head up and pick a pass.

And the bit I've bolded is the most annoying thing about SZ posters. "I know it all anyone else knows nothing about football".

I admit when I'm wrong, I listen to other peoples opinions, I like a good debate - saying "everyone else is wrong" is just pompus bollocks.

Oh, and not being funny - but if you are judging him on the only 3 games you have seen him - then having a pop at me and saying I know "nothing about football" is a bit rich. Freedman DID look good when he signed, whether its injuries/form/confidence - he isnt the same player than the one that signed (IMO disclaimer).

 

[Rayleigh boy]

i was very sceptical about him ...... but i thought he won us the tranmere game by keeping us going - effort and qulaity -

again last night he had the intelligence to try and play outside the box rather than just
line up in the box ...

must say my respect for him has grown a lot ....

 

[Southend_Lady]

Ok so if Freedman is not good enough then I'd love to know who we could realistically get in with his experience. Some people forget we are SOUTHEND UNITED no Manchester United. Freedman might well be average in your book but in case you havn't noticed we were dog sh*t last night and Freedman was the only one who looked half decent!

 

[palexander]

Ok so if Freedman is not good enough then I'd love to know who we could realistically get in with his experience. Some people forget we are SOUTHEND UNITED no Manchester United. Freedman might well be average in your book but in case you havn't noticed we were dog sh*t last night and Freedman was the only one who looked half decent!

Cool, if that is what you think - I thought he and Robinson offered little - and the fact we didnt have a shot on target (IIRC) would give an indication to our attacking punch last night.

Shame Laurent wasnt fitter as perhaps he could have offered something different over 90 minutes as Barnard looked off the pace in his cameo too.

Like I said, I like Freedman and on paper it was (and hopefully still is) a very good signing to get someone of his experience in on apparently decentish wages. He needs to do it on the pitch though and his injury record and aging legs are going to catch him up.

Still, fingers crossed he can turn it around and prove me wrong.

 

[Kris]

He should of dropped off a bit to link play, or told Robinson to make runs into the channels.

Er, he did both. He was constantly making runs and dropping deep to receive the ball but, more often than not, he was either given a terrible pass or ignored completely. And I saw him signal to Robinson to make runs in behind Crewe's defence on several occasions.

Very disappointed in him and will be no great loss when he and hopefully Barnard are released in May/June god willing...

Yes, that's a good idea. Release the only proven goalscorers in the squad.

 

[Grayson]

Cool, if that is what you think - I thought he and Robinson offered little - and the fact we didnt have a shot on target (IIRC) would give an indication to our attacking punch last night.

Shame Laurent wasnt fitter as perhaps he could have offered something different over 90 minutes as Barnard looked off the pace in his cameo too.

Like I said, I like Freedman and on paper it was (and hopefully still is) a very good signing to get someone of his experience in on apparently decentish wages. He needs to do it on the pitch though and his injury record and aging legs are going to catch him up.

Still, fingers crossed he can turn it around and prove me wrong.

Turn it around? I bet our record with him playing is a lot better than without. As for our shot count, blame the rest of the team for not creating the chances.

 

[palexander]

Er, he did both. He was constantly making runs and dropping deep to receive the ball but, more often than not, he was either given a terrible pass or ignored completely. And I saw him signal to Robinson to make runs in behind Crewe's defence on several occasions.

And I saw Robinson and Laurent make good runs in behind during the closing stages and Dougie ignored them with his head down and ended up losing the ball...

Yes, that's a good idea. Release the only proven goalscorers in the squad.

I personally think their wages will be better spent on 1 forward who can stay injury free and partner them with Revs/Laurent... better still, a creative midfielder.

A squad our size cannot really carry 2 injury prone players can it?

 

[palexander]

Turn it around? I bet our record with him playing is a lot better than without. As for our shot count, blame the rest of the team for not creating the chances.

Can work 2 ways, if the midfielders have nobody to pass to (hence the number of stupid chipped balls to nobody or passing to someone double marked), then what else can they do? We've got nobody who can create anything from nothing, so I'd want the strikers to move around a bit more to make space/chances...

 

[Einstein]

And the bit I've bolded is the most annoying thing about SZ posters. "I know it all anyone else knows nothing about football".

Not really. It's my OPINION. If you think Freedman is a waste of space then IN MY OPINION you know nothing about football. That's my OPINION and that still remains. It's like you think people are ganging up on you whenever someone disagrees with you.

I like a good debate

Interesting. Over the last six weeks I'd be more inclined to call it a moan, rather than a debate.

Oh, and not being funny - but if you are judging him on the only 3 games you have seen him - then having a pop at me and saying I know "nothing about football" is a bit rich.

Why would that be a bit rich? That really doesn't make any sense to me at all.

I've seen him play 3 times with my own eyes and once on TV. Do you think every player is scouted at least 3 times before we sign him? Rightly or wrongly. Most of the players on here called Barnard cr*p when they had since he play once for Crewe last season! It's a weak argument to use and a bit like the "I go every week so I'm a better supporter than you argument" IMO.

I'll also add, looking at the fixtures I'd be surprised if you've actually seen that many more times. I'd guess there would be a very select few who have seen him play in all 12 League appearances he has made. He is injury prone, however it's late in his career. The same was said about Goater. If Freedman was five years younger, he wouldn't be at Southend United.

Games with Freedman in the team.

Carlisle 2-1 Southend 1
Southend 1-0 Hereford 0
Crewe 3-4 Southend 2
Southend 3-0 Leyton Orient 1
Southend 0-1 Huddersfield 0
Southend 1-0 Northampton 0
MK Dons 2-0 Southend 0
Stockport 3-1 Southend 0
Leyton Orient 1-1 Southend 0
Southend 1-0 Bristol R 1
Southend 2-1 Tranmere 0
Southend 0-1 Crewe 0

Played - 12
Won - 6
Drawn - 1
Lost - 5
Points - 19

Average points across season = 1.23
Average points without Freedman = 1.00
Average points with Freedman = 1.58

Bottom line. It's fact (note - not opinion) we achieve more points in the team with Freedman than without.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Not really. It's my OPINION. If you think Freedman is a waste of space then IN MY OPINION you know nothing about football. That's my OPINION and that still remains. It's like you think people are ganging up on you whenever someone disagrees with you.

Interesting. Over the last six weeks I'd be more inclined to call it a moan, rather than a debate.

Why would that be a bit rich? That really doesn't make any sense to me at all.

I've seen him play 3 times with my own eyes and once on TV. Do you think every player is scouted at least 3 times before we sign him? Rightly or wrongly. Most of the players on here called Barnard cr*p when they had since he play once for Crewe last season! It's a weak argument to use and a bit like the "I go every week so I'm a better supporter than you argument" IMO.

I'll also add, looking at the fixtures I'd be surprised if you've actually seen that many more times. I'd guess there would be a very select few who have seen him play in all 12 League appearances he has made. He is injury prone, however it's late in his career. The same was said about Goater. If Freedman was five years younger, he wouldn't be at Southend United.

Games with Freedman in the team.

Carlisle 2-1 Southend 1
Southend 1-0 Hereford 0
Crewe 3-4 Southend 2
Southend 3-0 Leyton Orient 1
Southend 0-1 Huddersfield 0
Southend 1-0 Northampton 0
MK Dons 2-0 Southend 0
Stockport 3-1 Southend 0
Leyton Orient 1-1 Southend 0
Southend 1-0 Bristol R 1
Southend 2-1 Tranmere 0
Southend 0-1 Crewe 0

Played - 12
Won - 6
Drawn - 1
Lost - 5
Points - 19

Average points across season = 1.23
Average points without Freedman = 1.00
Average points with Freedman = 1.58

Bottom line. It's fact (note - not opinion) we achieve more points in the team with Freedman than without.

Do the players log on here then? I haven't seen one player call Barnard c**p!!

 

[Einstein]

Do the players log on here then? I haven't seen one player call Barnard c**p!!

You know I meant posters :p

 

[davewebbsbrain]

You know I meant posters :p

Einstein in 'got it wrong' shocker :clap:

 

[Einstein]

Einstein in 'got it wrong' shocker :clap:

davewebbsbrain is not adding anything useful to the debate shocker :clap:

 

[palexander]

Games with Freedman in the team.

Carlisle 2-1 Southend 1
Southend 1-0 Hereford 0
Crewe 3-4 Southend 2
Southend 3-0 Leyton Orient 1
Southend 0-1 Huddersfield 0
Southend 1-0 Northampton 0
MK Dons 2-0 Southend 0
Stockport 3-1 Southend 0
Leyton Orient 1-1 Southend 0
Southend 1-0 Bristol R 1
Southend 2-1 Tranmere 0
Southend 0-1 Crewe 0

Played - 12
Won - 6
Drawn - 1
Lost - 5
Points - 19

Average points across season = 1.23
Average points without Freedman = 1.00
Average points with Freedman = 1.58

Bottom line. It's fact (note - not opinion) we achieve more points in the team with Freedman than without.

How many of those games also had Sawyer, Harding, Federici and Kanu too?

Genuine question as I think it makes a massive difference to your stats.

Oh and BTW, counting those matches, I've seen him 7 times.

 

[Einstein]

How many of those games also had Sawyer, Harding, Federici and Kanu too?

Genuine question as I think it makes a massive difference to your stats.

Carlisle 2-1 Southend - Harding, Kanu
Southend 1-0 Hereford - Harding, Sawyer
Crewe 3-4 Southend - Harding, Sawyer
Southend 3-0 Leyton Orient - Fed, Harding, Sawyer, Kanu
Southend 0-1 Huddersfield 0 - Harding
Southend 1-0 Northampton 0 - NONE
MK Dons 2-0 Southend 0 - NONE
Stockport 3-1 Southend 0 - NONE
Leyton Orient 1-1 Southend 0 - NONE
Southend 1-0 Bristol R - NONE
Southend 2-1 Tranmere - NONE
Southend 0-1 Crewe - NONE

NONE
Played = 7
Won - 3
Drawn - 1
Lost - 3

Points average = 1.42

That's still above our average over season and without. It's conclusive. We're better with Freedman in the team than without.