Bernie Friend and Bad News

[jamesmut2000]

Problem with that though James, would be we'd be back into "unofficial" and "official" groups. I really don't get why people are so anti the Trust.

I know Kay- that's partly why I've never been convinced another club is a good idea. There's always going to be someone outside accusing those on the inside of being 'cliquey' but I guess that's the way of the world these days.

 

[OldBlueLady]

I know Kay- that's partly why I've never been convinced another club is a good idea. There's always going to be someone outside accusing those on the inside of being 'cliquey' but I guess that's the way of the world these days.

Too true, I don't understand why, when there is more transparency than ever before, and the numbers at the Trust's AGM are always so low, people are still so dissatisfied.

 

[jamesmut2000]

Too true, I don't understand why, when there is more transparency than ever before, and the numbers at the Trust's AGM are always so low, people are still so dissatisfied.

That's something that's always bugged me. Trust has a decent amount of members but when it comes to AGM's ,Q&A's with managers and the like then no ****er turns up bar the usual suspects. Is that down to lack of knowledge of said events or is it just that no one gives a ****? If its the former then it's something to work on - if its the latter then that's a bigger problem.

 

[TrueBlue]

Trouble is, Ken, as you well know, if ANY committee member takes it upon themselves to answer as an individual, then they are hung out to dry by the great SZ community. I have no wish to take that sort of responsibility on myself.

My understanding is that you have refused to return or respond to his attempts to contact you so maybe you should be asking yourself about who it is that doesn't want to "correspond" with an organisation.

For the record, and being as transparent as is possible, as anyone who bothered to look at the Trust website would know, the Trust have recently been seeking to update any plans for contingencies however, recent goings on have put that on the back burner while those of us who have been able, have been busy with organising stuff for Wembley, which has been the bigger priority at the moment. Unfortunately, we haven't had the luxury of being able to give the update the time it possibly should have because we have all had other things to do, as well as working!

Nobody ****ing hangs me out to dry! if anything I get more moaning from the committee for answering questions!!! Something which I have always championed is the committee stop being faceless and get amongst the fans be known and been seen and most of all be heard!

 

[TrueBlue]

Problem with that though James, would be we'd be back into "unofficial" and "official" groups. I really don't get why people are so anti the Trust.

People are anti trust because its totaly faceless at the top out of a whole committee of around 14 people 3/4 are home and away regulars!

Its not all about attendance but you need 'faces' you need figureheads and you need people with clout.

 

[Earls Hall Blue]

Nobody ****ing hangs me out to dry! if anything I get more moaning from the committee for answering questions!!! Something which I have always championed is the committee stop being faceless and get amongst the fans be known and been seen and most of all be heard!

Do you really want Kay to go topless and bang a drum in the NB too..:smile:

 

[Bobby dazzler]

As a previous secretary of athe supporters club many years back I am amused by the debate. We organized travel and certain events but we were amateur compared to the trust. I for one know Paul Fitzgerald very well and he is an honest and hard working individual.
he does not need to be part of this forum as the trust are an open book financially and are striving to work with the club for the benefit of both the club and the fans.
i am aware of the feelings of some of the trust and just because they do not air their opinions on this site, it doesn't mean they are not airing them with the club.
all those anti trust fans out there surely wouldn't be happy with however was there
do we expect the members of the trust to be financially capable of bailing out the club ? This is certainly not the case and unfair to even consider it
official and unofficial are irrelevant. We are all fans with our own take on what's best for the club

Up the blues and Wembley here we come

 

[OldBlueLady]

Do you really want Kay to go topless and bang a drum in the NB too..:smile:

Errr.....that is definitely 100% NOT EVER going to happen!

There is such a great need for another supporters club for the supporters and not a secert type club.
I know you said that you are not up for the fight Ken but others on the zone must be.
Southend United need a decent supporters club and a decent junior supportes club,the zone(Wino) have already given them a decent fan friendly travel service but now the fans need a decent honest open voice willing to fight and prod the hornets nest of lies and spin.
The trust not joining in debates on the zone is a joke and not a funny one at that,trust out shrimperzone independant supporters club in.

That may be your opinion Tony, but personally I think you're wrong. If the fans can't be united in their support of the Trust, then what hope is there in two opposing organisations getting along?

Frankly,I'm not too sure what all the current bickering is actually about, (unless it really concerns the non-allocation of Wemblely tickets to SZ).

I've aired my own concerns regarding the Trust's capacity as a supporters club to bail out SUFC-should the need arise-in the past.However, (to paraphrase LBJ), I'd sooner be inside the tent ****ing out, than outside ****ing in.

At the same time,I, for one,fully understand Paul Fitz's right (and wish) not to become a member of SZ and get involved with "debates" on SZ.He's well aware that there are more than a few wind up merchants on here.

I've never met him (so have no personal axe to grind) but can only say that, in private emails, he comes across as a very helpful and decent bloke.

For those who believe that #Barnagetsitwrongagain is always true, I say here it's not. He's spot on with his analysis.

People are anti trust because its totaly faceless at the top out of a whole committee of around 14 people 3/4 are home and away regulars!

Its not all about attendance but you need 'faces' you need figureheads and you need people with clout.

I think you're confusing faceless with notorious. That's two entirely different things, and I would say that Paul Yeomanson, for instance, is a far bigger figurehead than you are. And certainly one who is better respected.

Scott, you use the Trust totally, you only come to meetings if a) you want something or b) you want to discuss something. You rarely turn up to events, you rarely contribute time to any of the mundane activities - even when you volunteered to try and help with one session of selling coach tickets in the shop, you failed to turn up, and failed to explain or excuse yourself. You were supposed to turn up in the Shrimpers after the Area final 2nd leg for a brief chat about plans for travel but you also failed to do that, despite saying that you "supposed" you could spare 10 minutes before going to the pub. It's just as well we aren't all selfish enough to put our own needs before the needs of running a committee.

As for the discussion on this particular thread, as I understand it, Paul Fitzgerald has been accused by Ken Jarvis of saying that he didn't want TZ represented on the Fans' Forum. This is something which he totally refutes. What he said is that if TZ were to be represented, then maybe the organiser of the Trust's travel also ought to be included, and that there had been history, some years back, and long before the link up with SZ, when, as SOL travel, some Trust members were approached at a pick up point and asked to travel on SOL, rather than with the Trust. One person in particular, who is well known to all away travellers, can vouch for this having happened. Now, that may have all happened as a jokey suggestion, I have no idea, but it left a rather nasty taste for some time.

So, Ken, let me make it clear, that Paul has absolutely NO PROBLEM with Wino, or a representative, joining the Fans' Forum. If you believe he has, then there has been a MASSIVE misunderstanding, which has now got rather excessively out of hand.

I can't make this any more public than I have, so all the allegations and history are now in the open and people can maybe see and understand now why Paul has been so angered at the lies perpetrated on here. He, and the Trust, have always said that if anyone has an issue, that they can email him. There are enough committee members on the Zone that he should not feel pressured into having to join.

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

Im glad you think i am wrong Kay just like i think you are wrong when you post in the juniors post that i was trying to make trouble and just like i think you are wrong when you say that i am fishing in this thread.
I post my opinion and in this thread it is that we need another non trust like supporters club,there is no reason why it could not work along side the trust but as pitsea put so well(i green rep him was that fishing too) egos and agendas get in the way.
I had the same shizzle with Paul Holland friends with some even wishing our coach died on the way home from a game.
You are one reason why i think there is a nbeed for another club,your rant on arrival times for wembley and your rant above against Scott leave a sour taste in the mouth.
Yes from what i know of him Paul fitz is a nice guy but not joining the zone to my mind is a mistake,just my very humble opinion.
W will never ever be united and in my mind that is an ok thing,,the trust caters for some but i feel a indy club is needed for others like myself and ive had pm,s from a committee member agreeing.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Tony, I respect that you have your opinion, and although I have no personal knowledge of it, I respect that you have had long associations with the supporters' side of things in the club, and I am a relative newby.

Sadly, you have misinterpreted my issues over the Green Man. It was no "rant". It was genuine concern. I've not been to Wembley before and I have no idea how strict they will be over the state of inebriated fans. I don't want people's day out to be ruined by alcohol, either for themselves or for others. I also don't want any of the coaches affected because of alcohol. I've seen people drinking on coaches, I know it's not allowed. I'm not sure how tolerant the police would be if they came aboard a coach and found any.

You say I've "ranted" about Scott, yet you say nothing about the way he behaves, the rants he directs very personally at me. Your manner to me has changed since I picked you up on something on FB which I had to delete - you are a funny man, you've made me chuckle often at what you write but I think you sometimes misunderstand.

As things stand, there are different supporting factions, and of which I approve and I think you'd expect that anywhere, but I don't see how a separate independent "supporters' club" would work? Most of those who put heart and soul into the Trust are those that attend as many games as they can, and put as much work as they can into running the Trust effectively for members, and for the club. What would you propose an independent supporters' club do? And how would you expect the club to behave towards it because there is surely, in any club, only going to be one supporters' club that a club supports?

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

Well done Kay now thats what i call debating.
My manner has nothing to do with face book,i treat you and your posts the same as i treat Crickos and Scotts and i respect that my sense of humor(if you can call it that) would offend your friends real or facebook ones hence the reason for deleting my self from your page in the same way i did crickos and scotts,no agenda.
I have stood up for you in the past and if i feel the need to in the future i will do so but when you write that i am out to cause trouble i will react,same as when you write i am fishing.
Sometimes i think you feel its all about you,its not.
But the above post was/is good debating,as for Scott ranting at you well i see that as just pure puppy love/lust and nothing more,im sure that if it was more your husband would sort him out.
I stand by my opinion that another club is needed.

 

[OldBlueLady]

All respect to you Tony for sticking to your principles. We'll have to agree to disagree on that though.

To return to the subject of the thread and why "Shrimpers Trust" rarely post under that log in, I think a lot of that is down to the fact that there has been tinkering with the placing of the Trust's forum, and also the fact that a post regarding Trust travel in the "All things Wembley" forum was deleted with no explanation. Now, I "get" totally that SZ and TZ are linked now, but surely people can see that that kind of treatment is hardly conducive to a harmonious relationship?

I know what I consider to be quite a few people on SZ, I know quite a few people on TZ - probably more, in all fairness, between them than I do that are Trust members and don't post on here or travel with TZ. I am a fair minded person and I want everyone to get along because we should all be on the same side. I just don't understand why there has to be negativity towards any one group - and there was plenty on here aimed at SOL before the metamorphosis into TZ, which should be an illustration that groups/individuals aren't always how they appear. I realise that not everyone is always going to get on, that's life, but I don't like way that the Trust always seems to be the focus of so much ill feeling.

I wish some of those who do like to have a pop would come along to some of the fund raising and see how hard some of us work to try and raise money to help the club. I wish some of those who are members and still like to have a pop, would come along to the AGMs or Q&As and raise their concerns - or PUT THEM IN WRITING in advance. There was a questionnaire a while back, there have been huge efforts to try and address concerns raised in those. If we're still failing then people need to let us know. There is none of this Masons malarkey going on, it's no secret society, minutes are posted on the website for members to read.....what more would people have us do?

 

[Pubey]

So does the trust have a contingency fund or has it all been spent on youth team shirts and blue face paint?

a lot of this thread is TL;DR. I guess some of us just want the Trust (or A N Other) to be primarily focused on our survival, rather than Wembley etc.

 

[Napster]

I don't go to games home or away but I'd like to think I'll be recognised if I wander into a Southend pub. I can see both sides of the issue - having once been an owner of SZ (and contributed £000 to keep it running), and also having been a committee member in the past and now currently.

The trouble is the size of the fanbase. We're not really big enough for 2 supporters' organisations, but we're too big for just one official one. I think the problem is with officiality, comes bureaucracy and transparency.

Secondly, if the **** were to hit the fan, any official organisation (an administrator or Supporters Direct) would more than likely look to the Trust for guidance.

So we need to support and encourage ideas across the fanbase, not nitpick and moan about individuals and egos etc.

 

[TrueBlue]

Errr.....that is definitely 100% NOT EVER going to happen!


That may be your opinion Tony, but personally I think you're wrong. If the fans can't be united in their support of the Trust, then what hope is there in two opposing organisations getting along?



For those who believe that #Barnagetsitwrongagain is always true, I say here it's not. He's spot on with his analysis.


I think you're confusing faceless with notorious. That's two entirely different things, and I would say that Paul Yeomanson, for instance, is a far bigger figurehead than you are. And certainly one who is better respected.

Scott, you use the Trust totally, you only come to meetings if a) you want something or b) you want to discuss something. You rarely turn up to events, you rarely contribute time to any of the mundane activities - even when you volunteered to try and help with one session of selling coach tickets in the shop, you failed to turn up, and failed to explain or excuse yourself. You were supposed to turn up in the Shrimpers after the Area final 2nd leg for a brief chat about plans for travel but you also failed to do that, despite saying that you "supposed" you could spare 10 minutes before going to the pub. It's just as well we aren't all selfish enough to put our own needs before the needs of running a committee.

As for the discussion on this particular thread, as I understand it, Paul Fitzgerald has been accused by Ken Jarvis of saying that he didn't want TZ represented on the Fans' Forum. This is something which he totally refutes. What he said is that if TZ were to be represented, then maybe the organiser of the Trust's travel also ought to be included, and that there had been history, some years back, and long before the link up with SZ, when, as SOL travel, some Trust members were approached at a pick up point and asked to travel on SOL, rather than with the Trust. One person in particular, who is well known to all away travellers, can vouch for this having happened. Now, that may have all happened as a jokey suggestion, I have no idea, but it left a rather nasty taste for some time.

So, Ken, let me make it clear, that Paul has absolutely NO PROBLEM with Wino, or a representative, joining the Fans' Forum. If you believe he has, then there has been a MASSIVE misunderstanding, which has now got rather excessively out of hand.

I can't make this any more public than I have, so all the allegations and history are now in the open and people can maybe see and understand now why Paul has been so angered at the lies perpetrated on here. He, and the Trust, have always said that if anyone has an issue, that they can email him. There are enough committee members on the Zone that he should not feel pressured into having to join.

You are a total joke it's not about me it's about the good of the trust!

 

[OldBlueLady]

So does the trust have a contingency fund or has it all been spent on youth team shirts and blue face paint?

There ARE funds put aside. Off the top of my head I couldn't say how much, if the AGM minutes are up, then the accounts will be in there. There is the intention that a contingency plan is put together, which will be given due attention after Wembley.

Napster makes a very good point about the Trust being where an administrator would make contact. The Trust already has a very good relationship with Supporters Direct and they would point anyone immediately in the Trust's direction.

You are a total joke it's not about me it's about the good of the trust!

Your opinion. I say you are wrong, I know others who agree with me.

 

[TrueBlue]

Tony, I respect that you have your opinion, and although I have no personal knowledge of it, I respect that you have had long associations with the supporters' side of things in the club, and I am a relative newby.

Sadly, you have misinterpreted my issues over the Green Man. It was no "rant". It was genuine concern. I've not been to Wembley before and I have no idea how strict they will be over the state of inebriated fans. I don't want people's day out to be ruined by alcohol, either for themselves or for others. I also don't want any of the coaches affected because of alcohol. I've seen people drinking on coaches, I know it's not allowed. I'm not sure how tolerant the police would be if they came aboard a coach and found any.

You say I've "ranted" about Scott, yet you say nothing about the way he behaves, the rants he directs very personally at me. Your manner to me has changed since I picked you up on something on FB which I had to delete - you are a funny man, you've made me chuckle often at what you write but I think you sometimes misunderstand.

As things stand, there are different supporting factions, and of which I approve and I think you'd expect that anywhere, but I don't see how a separate independent "supporters' club" would work? Most of those who put heart and soul into the Trust are those that attend as many games as they can, and put as much work as they can into running the Trust effectively for members, and for the club. What would you propose an independent supporters' club do? And how would you expect the club to behave towards it because there is surely, in any club, only going to be one supporters' club that a club supports?

But the thing is Kay you do come across like your the boss you may not mean it but you do project that.

We are all Southend and I get your points but the way you tell us is just patronising

 

[TrueBlue]

There ARE funds put aside. Off the top of my head I couldn't say how much, if the AGM minutes are up, then the accounts will be in there. There is the intention that a contingency plan is put together, which will be given due attention after Wembley.

Napster makes a very good point about the Trust being where an administrator would make contact. The Trust already has a very good relationship with Supporters Direct and they would point anyone immediately in the Trust's direction.


Your opinion. I say you are wrong, I know others who agree with me.

And I know plenty who agree with me including other committee members

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

The trust in spilt shocker.
When i started the SUISC back in the day was you a member Kay or were your dustbin lids members of the junior blues when i was running it?
Ive said it before but Southend will never be united but it must be ready,not just after Wembley but at all times.
As for the zone well they have been good enough to provide the trust with a whole page and i see nothing wrong with someone deleting a post in whatever thread if the owners see fit,its their board and we are just mere users.
Id gues the zone has around 1,000 members and as such Paul Fitz should be on here fishermen or not,does the trust repersent all fans or just its members?

 

[OldBlueLady]

The trust in spilt shocker.
When i started the SUISC back in the day was you a member Kay or were your dustbin lids members of the junior blues when i was running it?
Ive said it before but Southend will never be united but it must be ready,not just after Wembley but at all times.
As for the zone well they have been good enough to provide the trust with a whole page and i see nothing wrong with someone deleting a post in whatever thread if the owners see fit,its their board and we are just mere users.
Id gues the zone has around 1,000 members and as such Paul Fitz should be on here fishermen or not,does the trust repersent all fans or just its members?

Probably not Tony, my son was a member of the Junior Shrimpers and Junior Blues from the age of about 10 so that would be 2001/2ish. I joined the Trust after that.