money meltdown !!!!

[Napster]

Markets always correct themselves given time.

 

[graysblue]

Soon enough? Despite the hundreds of billions of pounds poured into the banking system the stock markets are still plummeting, I'm no expert but seems to me this is gonna take a long time before it sorts itself out.

ageed BA this is meltdown which the world in my view has never seen before.

 

[steveo]

surely the fairest way is to charge households on actual annual income

How is that fair?You mean people who work harder/do better should pay more on top of the extra tax they already pay? Good idea. Why don’t we get onto Ron Martin and ask him to charge people who earn 50K t 40 quid a ticket and people who earn 25K £20 quid, then he can let the people who don’t earn much in for nothing.

 

[SARF]

This is almost amusing to watch.. You have the government bandying around the number 500 billion to save the banks. no bank has taken up this offer yet.. Dont tell the press that.. Then there is the buy gold mob! Yup lovely er where will you keep it.. Oh in one of those Bank things.. What intrest does it pay.. er you pay them to look after it for you.. What the **** are you going to do with a gold sovreign if the Banking system collapses, throw it at the bloke nicking the food from your fridge? Even more amusing you have a government telling banks to lend more to vunerable borrowers whilst also telling them to rebuild Tier one capital ratios and calling them vermin for lending too much to vunerable borrowers in the first place.. Cut intrest rates to 3 per cent (which they should have done last year) and let the system take the pain.. Yes there will be losers and in months to come spectacular winners.. its the natural order of things, fight it at your peril .. Greed n bust are as regular as the tides..

 

[graysblue]

How is that fair?You mean people who work harder/do better should pay more on top of the extra tax they already pay? Good idea. Why don’t we get onto Ron Martin and ask him to charge people who earn 50K t 40 quid a ticket and people who earn 25K £20 quid, then he can let the people who don’t earn much in for nothing.

council tax by law must be paid,however popping along to the hall is classed as leisure so has no bearing on this discussion.

lets clarify your views,you think multi millionaires should pay less council tax,then you say persons earning slightly more than the average joe should not pay more.

love to know your answer.

 

[graysblue]

This is almost amusing to watch.. You have the government bandying around the number 500 billion to save the banks. no bank has taken up this offer yet.. Dont tell the press that.. Then there is the buy gold mob! Yup lovely er where will you keep it.. Oh in one of those Bank things.. What intrest does it pay.. er you pay them to look after it for you.. What the **** are you going to do with a gold sovreign if the Banking system collapses, throw it at the bloke nicking the food from your fridge? Even more amusing you have a government telling banks to lend more to vunerable borrowers whilst also telling them to rebuild Tier one capital ratios and calling them vermin for lending too much to vunerable borrowers in the first place.. Cut intrest rates to 3 per cent (which they should have done last year) and let the system take the pain.. Yes there will be losers and in months to come spectacular winners.. its the natural order of things, fight it at your peril .. Greed n bust are as regular as the tides..

you sir have hit the nail on the head

 

[steveo]

you think multi millionaires should pay less council tax

Don't recall saying that at all. I think they should pay the same.

A lot of people dont have water metres and still pay water rates. Presumably you think they should pay more for this service as well then. How about prescriptions? Should you pay more if you have more money in the bank?

 

[graysblue]

as i understand it and must admit i never knew.

this could well be my last post on this matter as i have used my quota on this subject,if indeed this is true will respond tommorow

 

[steveo]

as i have used my quota on this subject

is there a limit then?

 

[graysblue]

is there a limit then?

no idea mate,the orange thingy beside the thread is telling me my final post today.


any mods out there who can explain if i have reached a certain quota.


cheers

 

[SUFC_Al]

no idea mate,the orange thingy beside the thread is telling me my final post today.


any mods out there who can explain if i have reached a certain quota.


cheers

there is no post limit, the "last today" you get when hovering your mouse over the orange envelope means your last post in the thread was today not that it is your last post allowed today.

Hope this clears it up.

 

[loz]

More means testing by local councils, no thanks.

No more means testing required. Scrap council tax, work out how much local govt needs based on population or whatever other formula you use, then increase income tax by the required amount in each borough.

and to steveo- yes, as a general principle I do think those who earn more should contribute more. They may well work hard, but so do plenty of people at the bottom. At some level, those in high income brackets are able to get those rewards as a result of the labour of those at the bottom, and the rise in inequality in the UK and US suggests that, in de-regulated markets, that wealth is not 'trickling down' as most neo-liberals claim it should. If the markets don't redistribute it, I think it's just that government should intervene to do so. Not an anti-capitalist position, but a moderated one.

 

[graysblue]

there is no post limit, the "last today" you get when hovering your mouse over the orange envelope means your last post in the thread was today not that it is your last post allowed today.

Hope this clears it up.

cheers mate.


steveo,

water metres are good and very soon every dwelling will have one installed.

the more you earn the greater the tax,its the way its worked for a very long time.

low paid persons need as much help they can get,so if people earn very decent wages they should contribute more.

 

[Napster]

cheers mate.


steveo,

water metres are good and very soon every dwelling will have one installed.

the more you earn the greater the tax,its the way its worked for a very long time.

low paid persons need as much help they can get,so if people earn very decent wages they should contribute more.

You're an old socialist at heart. It's not the case that the more you earn the greater the tax. Income tax is only one part of the tax system. VAT is a regressive tax.

ps no water metre for us - we can't get one fitted.

I believe help for lower paid people should only be in the form of incentives, not handouts.

 

[steveo]

they should contribute more.

Which they already do through the taxation system. You want them to pay more to live in the house they have paid more for. Where does it all end? Maybe rich people could sort of adopt a family of poor people and buy everything for them, how does that sound?

And Loz, you lefty:

They may well work hard, but so do plenty of people at the bottom. At some level, those in high income brackets are able to get those rewards as a result of the labour of those at the bottom

This is the rich people and poor people thing which we have probably discussed before. In a lot of cases the poor people had the same opportunities as the rich people but didn’t take them or didn’t make the extra effort.
If there were no rich people, how would the poor people survive? Who would they work for? Who would pay their wages?

 

[graysblue]

You're an old socialist at heart. It's not the case that the more you earn the greater the tax. Income tax is only one part of the tax system. VAT is a regressive tax.

ps no water metre for us - we can't get one fitted.

I believe help for lower paid people should only be in the form of incentives, not handouts.

any incentive for full time low paid working folk will need to be funded from higher earners which i believe is fair play

however

those on the dole, in particular if they have claimed longer than 12 months should be forced either into any job or do menial tasks for the community.


getting back to the original thread.

during 1998 i sold my 3 bed terrace for £59,995 allowing anyone earning 20k to easily afford this gaff,august 2006 this property was resold for a the crazy sum of £169,995 meaning the new owners would need an annual income of 57k to make ends meet.

back in 98 if anyone had told me i would be faced with 3% stamp duty i would have laughed in their face,yet amazingly myself and thousands of average people have been forced into paying massive amounts in stamp duty whilst loony labour happily collected the cash without adjusting the duty range to be compatible with property values.

 

[loz]

And Loz, you lefty:



This is the rich people and poor people thing which we have probably discussed before. In a lot of cases the poor people had the same opportunities as the rich people but didn’t take them or didn’t make the extra effort.
If there were no rich people, how would the poor people survive? Who would they work for? Who would pay their wages?

I agree with both of those to an extent, but equally I think there are inequalities of opportunity that can't be compensated for by effort, and that 'workers' and 'bosses' exist in a symbiotic relationship where each is dependent on the other. My reading of that relationship doesn't justify the levels of inequality of outcome that exist in some western societies- and it's not the only model- look at the difference in pay differentials between the US/UK and Japan, for example.

 

[steveo]

But how would you change it? If you tax the higher earners too much so they are equal with the lower earners, there would be no incentive to be a higher earner. Roll on communism.

 

[seany t]

If people only did everything they wanted, everyone would just spend all day sitting on the carpet, watching the poker channel, ****ing and eating those expensive German biscuits. Probably.

 

[Napster]

If people only did everything they wanted, everyone would just spend all day sitting on the carpet, watching the poker channel, ****ing and eating those expensive German biscuits. Probably.

You mean Belgian. I think.