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Gaza

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Tangled up in Blue said:
Maybe I'm getting old but I can't find any post where you've specifically addressed that YOUGUV poll result.

So yes, a summary of your analysis of the reasons for why 60% of the British people oppose Israel's bombardment of Gaza would help greatly.

Thanks.
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I tell you what, you work it out. It seems pretty simple to me. Funnily enough I'm surprised that only 60% oppose. I consider that something of a victory for Israel.

After all, I'm still waiting for you to address many of the issues/points I have brought up over this entire thread.
 
I have just spent 90 mins reading through most of this thread. I don't pretend to be an expert on the subject but am clever enough to understand how news reports can be manipulated. This has been the most educational thread I have ever read on SZ and I thank LB and ACU in particular for their contributions. The explanations of 'facts' and opinions has been excellent. I fully appreciate that their are two sides to every story, and I started reading with a perspective that both sides are in the wrong, but Israel had gone OTT 'as usual' . Despite Barna's attempts to 'stick up for Hamas' (that is how it comes through even if it is not what he may or may not think) my view has somewhat changed and I will definitely listen to news reports going forward with an ever more open mind than normal.

ohhh lastley--- 15 pages on a highly charged issue and no slagging off of other posters . A SZ record?


ps - Barna= others have already said this , but I will also add - Why do you pick and choose points that agree with your own agenda? You come through as a clever guy and I can only assume that you are not being serious and are 'playing' to wind people up. If you are being serious then you come through as someone entrenched in an opinion who is unable to ever accept that just maybe they might not be entirely correct
 
Another unhappy aspect of this whole situation from a UK government press release today:

"Minister for Communities Stephen Williams today (13 August 2014) met the Jewish organisation Community Security Trust to hear about the rise in anti-Semitism since the Gaza conflict began, and to listen to the concerns of the British Jewish community.
Community Security Trust figures (PDF,3.30 MB) show 304 anti-Semitic incidents in the first 6 months of 2014, a 36% increase on the equivalent period in 2013.
And the most recent total - compiled for July - shows more than 200 incidents in 1 month, the second highest monthly total since the organisation started recording incidents in 1984."
 
Reg Martin said:
Another unhappy aspect of this whole situation from a UK government press release today:

"Minister for Communities Stephen Williams today (13 August 2014) met the Jewish organisation Community Security Trust to hear about the rise in anti-Semitism since the Gaza conflict began, and to listen to the concerns of the British Jewish community.
Community Security Trust figures (PDF,3.30 MB) show 304 anti-Semitic incidents in the first 6 months of 2014, a 36% increase on the equivalent period in 2013.
And the most recent total - compiled for July - shows more than 200 incidents in 1 month, the second highest monthly total since the organisation started recording incidents in 1984."
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This is one of the most worrying spin-offs of the Gaza situation for me.

There has been a rise in anti-semitism all over Europe,epecially in France and Germany, since Israel's bombardment of Gaza began.

There is always a similar sort of spike, of course, each time Israel takes this sort of action but this has been the most extreme yet,apparently.
 
Tangled up in Blue said:
This is one of the most worrying spin-offs of the Gaza situation for me.

There has been a rise in anti-semitism all over Europe,epecially in France and Germany, since Israel's bombardment of Gaza began.

There is always a similar sort of spike, of course, each time Israel takes this sort of action but this has been the most extreme yet,apparently.
Click to expand...

The media coverage just happens to have been heavily sympathetic to the Palestinians - statistics supplied by Hamas used without question, no mention of Hamas fighters in Gaza, no coverage of the execution of "collaborators", peace protesters, and one of Hamas' main leaders in an internal feud, every headline focusing on what Israel has done and only after reporting, in the small print, the prior action by Hamas (eg breaking the cease fire) which triggered it. No mention that the Egyptian border is completely closed while Israel is still allowing aid into, and injured Palestinians out of, Gaza. Coverage of the damage to the Gazan infrastructure but no mention that Israel continues to supply electricity....

Israel has been heavily and unfairly painted not only as a villain, but the only villain in this conflict, and then people act surprised that Jews are being attacked.
 
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Tangled up in Blue said:
This is one of the most worrying spin-offs of the Gaza situation for me.

There has been a rise in anti-semitism all over Europe,epecially in France and Germany, since Israel's bombardment of Gaza began.

There is always a similar sort of spike, of course, each time Israel takes this sort of action but this has been the most extreme yet,apparently.
Click to expand...

You really can't help yourself can you?

Israel hasn't been bombarding Gaza. It has attacked terrorist targets.
 
Rusty Shackleford said:
I'm not sure if that's some sort of inside joke, but I think londonblue would be entirely justified in kicking your teeth in.
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londonblue said:
I have to admit I have no idea what was meant by that.
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Actually,it's a well-known (though obviously not to you two) loaded question or logical fallacy.

Sorry to spring a bit of linguistics on you.:smile:

Basically. the question you ask presupposes the answer you're likely to get.Hence its relevance to the ST's YOUGUV poll question.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question
 
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Tangled up in Blue said:
Actually,it's a well-known (though obviously not to you two) loaded question or logical fallacy.

Sorry to spring a bit of linguistics on you.:smile:

Basically. the question you ask presupposes the answer you're likeky to get.Hence its relevance to the ST's YOUGUV poll question.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question
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The only fallacy is that the loaded question is actually loaded. Although it presupposes a "yes" or "no" answer (as it's seemingly intended to do), the overwhelmingly predominant answers would be "go **** yourself", "I'm not married", "I'd never hit a woman" or just a punch in the face.

#Barnagetsitwrong... AGAIN.

Sorry to spring a bit of reality on you.:smile:
 
South Bank Hank said:
The only fallacy is that the loaded question is actually loaded. Although it presupposes a "yes" or "no" answer (as it's seemingly intended to do), the overwhelmingly predominant answers would be "go **** yourself", "I'm not married", "I'd never hit a woman" or just a punch in the face.

#Barnagetsitwrong... AGAIN.

Sorry to spring a bit of reality on you.:smile:
Click to expand...

I'm happy to defer to your superior knowledge.

Obviously my M.A. in TESOL didn't prepare me properly for SZ "reality" sledging.:winking:
 
South Bank Hank said:
Why not go test it in a local pub when you come over for Portsmouth and see if I'm right? You can explain the finer points of Tesol to the paramedic.

:-D
Click to expand...

:off topic:As it happens, I did end up in a Barcelona hospital some years back with a broken jaw but that was after a "blues" concert,not a linguistic altercation. :smiles:


You do realise that I was actually agreeing with LB that the ST's YOUGUV poll question was probably a loaded one?
 
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Tangled up in Blue said:
:off topic:As it happens, I did end up in a Barcelona hospital some years back with a broken jaw but that was after a "blues" concert,not a linguistic altercation. :smiles:


You do realise that I was actually agreeing with LB that the ST's YOUGUV poll question was probably a loaded one?
Click to expand...

That's what I thought, but wasn't 100% sure!
 
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