Do you support Southend's Grammar Schools?

[Jam_Man]

If they have 300 places and 300 kids get 90% in the test and 200 of those are not in the catchment then without those kids you may only have needed 85% to get in. They will need to fill the spaces they have so of course the less people you are competing with increases your chances.

Getting a bit over specific though so we may be boring others. My main point really is that I don't want my choice of schools for my kids limited by gender, religion, finance or the ability to pass a test at the age of 11.

There are plenty of schools to choose from even without the grammar schools though. Admiitedly in Southend the schools arent great, but then if you decided the grammar schools were no longer Grammar schools they would simply be as good as the rest of them anyway.

Grammar schools are just a way for a select few to get a little better. Its not perfect, my daughter is bright and could have done well there (She is now part of the "gifted students" program in her current school so not just my bias!), but it is what it is. Id rather she had the chance to at least try to have gone there than there not to have been an option in the first place.

And just to kill any argument dead, Rachel Riley went to WHS. Are you saying she shouldnt have and that you think she shouldnt be on Countdown in those little dresses? :smile:

 

[londonblue]

There are plenty of schools to choose from even without the grammar schools though. Admiitedly in Southend the schools arent great, but then if you decided the grammar schools were no longer Grammar schools they would simply be as good as the rest of them anyway.

Grammar schools are just a way for a select few to get a little better. Its not perfect, my daughter is bright and could have done well there (She is now part of the "gifted students" program in her current school so not just my bias!), but it is what it is. Id rather she had the chance to at least try to have gone there than there not to have been an option in the first place.

And just to kill any argument dead, Rachel Riley went to WHS. Are you saying she shouldnt have and that you think she shouldnt be on Countdown in those little dresses? :smile:

In your opinion. Don't forget the pupils from the area that currently go there would have to go to school somewhere. Are you saying they would be dragged down by everyone else? I suspect not, and the article from the BBC would back that argument up.

And don't get me started on Rachel Riley, I need to go home at 5.00!

 

[Benfleet A1]

I haven't said much in this thread but for the record, I'm in favour of Grammar Schools. I would have liked my daughter to have had the chance to go to one but her maths is dross so she wont pass her 11+. I am hopeful that she will get into our prefered Comprehensive which also has the best exam results in the borough [Thurrock not Southend]

So Grammar if you are good enough and if you aren't then the best comp in the area you live, if you can.

Simples

 

[Jam_Man]

In your opinion. Don't forget the pupils from the area that currently go there would have to go to school somewhere. Are you saying they would be dragged down by everyone else? I suspect not, and the article from the BBC would back that argument up.

And don't get me started on Rachel Riley, I need to go home at 5.00!

If you took those kids out of grammar school they certainly wouldnt do better in comprehensive and some would do lesser Im sure, whatever the BBC may say.

I just dont see who that would benefit, its not going to improve anyone by removing them.

 

[londonblue]

If you took those kids out of grammar school they certainly wouldnt do better in comprehensive and some would do lesser Im sure, whatever the BBC may say.

I just dont see who that would benefit, its not going to improve anyone by removing them.

The BBC were reporting on a world wide piece of analysis. The only report I have seen so far actually disagrees with you.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Just to throw another one out there, what about, for instance, King John which has an entry exam for children not in catchment? Surely that's only a small side step away from the 11+?

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

Just to throw another one out there, what about, for instance, King John which has an entry exam for children not in catchment? Surely that's only a small side step away from the 11+?

And another.........
One of my daughters got into Eastwood (when it was on the up) and she got in on a sports entry although the school was out of our catchment area and over subscribed.
She ran at the athletics club, swam for club & also did drama.
Is that not selective education too?

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

I won't have that you are boring AAS....can we settle on misguided perhaps?

Just because you choose not to have the choice of gender, Religion, financial / academic ability etc for your child, it gives you no right to impose this on others.

Isn't the true litmus test of this that if mixed Comprehensives were truly great places, it wouldn't matter.

If you read that back what I am arguing for is to remove limitations. If you local school doesn't bar you on the grounds of your gender, your religion, your financial situation or your ability to pass a test at the age of 11 then that increases your choice of schools.

The litmus test would need to be carried out scientifically and if whole schools full of bright kids have been removed from the comprehensive system then the study is not scientific. I'm loathe to keep bringing it down to personal experience but my daughter has got a lorry load of GSCE grade As from our nearest comprehensive so I have no issues with that but I don't see why she should be clogging up the roads because the 6 or so schools that are nearer are either single sex or Catholic or both.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

There are plenty of schools to choose from even without the grammar schools though. Admiitedly in Southend the schools arent great, but then if you decided the grammar schools were no longer Grammar schools they would simply be as good as the rest of them anyway.

Grammar schools are just a way for a select few to get a little better. Its not perfect, my daughter is bright and could have done well there (She is now part of the "gifted students" program in her current school so not just my bias!), but it is what it is. Id rather she had the chance to at least try to have gone there than there not to have been an option in the first place.

And just to kill any argument dead, Rachel Riley went to WHS. Are you saying she shouldnt have and that you think she shouldnt be on Countdown in those little dresses? :smile:

I think those same kids going to 'normal' schools will get a little better anyway as schools teach in a way that is geared at ability. When those same kids get a job (depending on the job) they are unlikely to be siphoned off into an environment where they are only dealing with the intelligentsia. Rachel Riley would have thrived in a comprehensive I'm sure, she would still grace our screens and she would have increased her chances of crossing paths with me and the opportunity to complete herself - segregation has robbed her of this opportunity.

 

[londonblue]

I think we might need a new thread but I'm pretty sure Rachel Riley went to SHS. She apparently lived opposite the school too.

 

[GrumpyBlue]

I think we might need a new thread but I'm pretty sure Rachel Riley went to SHS. She apparently lived opposite the school too.

Well her mum and dad live down that way so probably right

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

I think we might need a new thread but I'm pretty sure Rachel Riley went to SHS. She apparently lived opposite the school too.

Southend High according to Wiki. Despite supporting Man Utd, she is as fit as F*** so on that basis grammar schools are clearly a good thing.

 

[manor15]

For those who do agree with Southend's grammar schools, please sign this petition against cutting funding for the grammar schools in the local area, who have seen funding cut massively and are struggling to maintain the standards that they have become used to providing https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/cuts-to-funding-for-grammar-schools-in-southend

 

[Fred]

For those who are interested in supporting increased funding for the four Southend Grammar Schools please sign the following petition.


https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/cuts-to-funding-for-grammar-schools-in-southend

 

[Fred]

For those who are interested in supporting increased funding for the four Southend Grammar Schools please sign the following petition.


https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/cuts-to-funding-for-grammar-schools-in-southend

Oops. Should have checked previous posts. I just want to reiterate how important this is for the pupils. My son has been told that he will be losing at least 4-5 hours tuition every fortnight.

The schools are only asking for a fair crack of the whip.

 

[Beefy]

Just read all 11 pages of this. It was a very interesting debate (with the exception of one individual anyway). As a former SHSB student I always feel a bit defensive about the grammar school debate. I loved school and look back extremely fondly on my time at SHSB. I think on the whole that selection is a positive and I've always thought that if I have kids I'd want them to grow up in the local area and have a shot at maximising any academic abilities that they may have by going through the same school or one like it.

I find it difficult to support them when they're taking 85% students outside the borough. There were a handful of people who came in from other areas when I was there in the 90s but nothing like that. The schools should be obliged to take at least 75% students from within five miles or so even if that means lowering the entrance criteria a little.

 

[Pubey]

Just read all 11 pages of this. It was a very interesting debate (with the exception of one individual anyway). As a former SHSB student I always feel a bit defensive about the grammar school debate. I loved school and look back extremely fondly on my time at SHSB. I think on the whole that selection is a positive and I've always thought that if I have kids I'd want them to grow up in the local area and have a shot at maximising any academic abilities that they may have by going through the same school or one like it.

I find it difficult to support them when they're taking 85% students outside the borough. There were a handful of people who came in from other areas when I was there in the 90s but nothing like that. The schools should be obliged to take at least 75% students from within five miles or so even if that means lowering the entrance criteria a little.

This is still the greatest post in recent SZ history.

http://www.shrimperzone.com/vb/show...mmar-Schools&p=1704915&viewfull=1#post1704915

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I think we might need a new thread but I'm pretty sure Rachel Riley went to SHS. She apparently lived opposite the school too.

Well her mum and dad live down that way so probably right

Actually, her parents,Chris and Celia, live in Thorpe Bay (and in Canvey before that).


I used to play football fairly regulary with her Dad,back in the day.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Hmm, I can see that it has held you back academically.

If you'd have been bright enough where would you have liked to have studied instead?

Actually,I'm quite happy with the way things panned out.

One of my my younger brothers (not R.N.) went to St.Johns College,Cambridge.

I wouldn't have fancied that at all.

 

[Hotman]

Echo this - my eldest daughter got so many A's that you sound like a scouser if you real them all off.
I have 3 daughters and made a point of sending them to whichever mixed non religious comprehensive was closest to our home. Judging kids at 11 is not good and if they are in catchment of a grammar then they feel like a failure if they don't get in.
As far as I am concerned we should draw a circle round each school and if you are in the circle you go there. That is the way to build a community.

If they don't get in, they are a failure - fact. But doesn't make them any worse a person etc.