DiCanio

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Our parents / grandparents fought wars to keep fascism out and 2 clubs in this country are happy to be represented by one as their manager. It's straight forward - lifelong supporters will ditch the club because of his employment, so don't employ him. He is not missunderstood or missrepresented, he said he was a fascist and from football pitches he gave the fascist salute - he is iresponsible and not fit to be a manager.

The fact this wasn't news when he was appointed at Swindon just shows how no one in the media gives a monkeys about League 2.

 

[KAB]

Fascism in Italy is not the same as we understand it. To us it represents a Nazi ideal and the definitions we have stem from that. Italian fascism covers a much broader spectrum and their understanding of it and its definition, is different to ours. I do not share his political views but I do not see why there is such an outcry. We are not the only country in the world and our views are not essentially the only ones that are correct. We supposedly preach tolerance and understanding but only on our terms. We are no longer an empire that teaches the world how to think. Give Di Canio a break and try to understand his views. He is no more right wing than many of the politicians sitting in Parliment and governing us this very day.

 

[EastStandBlue]

Gabriele Marcotti has got it just about bang on in today's Times - http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/sport/football/clubs/sunderland/article3729432.ece (requires a Times sub, mind)

EDIT - Someone's ripped it here - http://www.readytogo.net/smb/showthread.php?t=771551

 

[Napster]

Gabriele Marcotti has got it just about bang on in today's Times - http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/sport/football/clubs/sunderland/article3729432.ece (requires a Times sub, mind)

EDIT - Someone's ripped it here - http://www.readytogo.net/smb/showthread.php?t=771551

fair enough. Italian history/politics is complex.

 

[South Bank Hank]

fair enough. Italian history/politics is complex.

That Garibaldi bloke takes the biscuit!

 

[Crabby Shrimper]

Regardless of saying that Trevor Sinclair & Chris Powell are his best mates, maybe he should look under what fascism means:

Fascism views political violence, war, and imperialism as a means to achieve national rejuvenation and asserts that "superior" nations and races should attain living space by displacing weak and inferior ones.

Well done on David Milliband and Durham Union of Mine Workers. Total scumbag, and if I was a non-white player (or even a white player with a conscience) at Sunderland I'd be looking to my agent to move me on.

Strictly speaking it'd be possible for a white fascist to believe that the Chinese are a stronger race, and to therefore accept the displacement of his own race.

Fascists are often associated with racists (and a lot of them are), however it's also Darwinian in terms of "survival of the fittest"


another definition (not wiki this time :winking: )

FASCISM

The term fascism comes from the word fasces; an ax tightly wound with sticks. Fascism can be defined as a political attitude and mass movement that arose during time between the first and second World War. Fascism is the attitude of giving full interest in economic, social, and military power to a dominant race or state lead by a single dominant leader. Fascism basically rejected the idea of Socialism, Capitalism, and Democracy. Fascism’s are single-party dictatorships characterized by terrorism and police surveillance. It focuses on ethnicity and “our” race being better than “your” race. Fascism isn’t limited to one culture alone. Each culture can believe that it is better and each person can consider himself to be better than his fellow man. Fascism is used to categorize censorship and oppression. Ones who take away freedom from others can be considered fascist.

Which, ironically, is what the left wish to do with fascists! The best way to treat them is to let them make fools of themselves, unless you believe that the general population is, unlike yourself, unable to decide for themselves what's right and wrong?

and for the record, although I'm right of centre, I'm not THAT far right!

 

[MK Shrimper]

There we go, here's the statement to placate the masses.

But in a statement he said: "I am not political, I do not affiliate myself to any organisation. I am not a racist.

"I do not support the ideology of fascism. I respect everyone. I am a football man and this and my family are my focus. Now I will speak only of football."

We'll just rewrite history and airbrush out those salutes eh Paulo.

 

[Jam_Man]

There we go, here's the statement to placate the masses.

But in a statement he said: "I am not political, I do not affiliate myself to any organisation. I am not a racist.

"I do not support the ideology of fascism. I respect everyone. I am a football man and this and my family are my focus. Now I will speak only of football."

We'll just rewrite history and airbrush out those salutes eh Paulo.

A photo can be taken out of context. He was probably just showing how steep the stand was.

 

[EastStandBlue]

We'll just rewrite history and airbrush out those salutes eh Paulo.

Did you not read the Marcotti piece then?

 

[MK Shrimper]

Did you not read the Marcotti piece then?

Yes I have. And? Marcotti is obviously a close friend which makes it all a bit pointless - it's like getting Blair Sturrock's best mate to write an article about how he's the best striker since Pele.

DiCanio is obviously not an idiot, but he has been idiotic in not realising that in countries that fought against fascism in WW2 might be a bit adverse to people who (in the past) claim to idolise Mussolini and make the salutes that were made infamous at Nuremburg.

 

[Jam_Man]

Yes I have. And? Marcotti is obviously a close friend which makes it all a bit pointless - it's like getting Blair Sturrock's best mate to write an article about how he's the best striker since Pele.

DiCanio is obviously not an idiot, but he has been idiotic in not realising that in countries that fought against fascism in WW2 might be a bit adverse to people who (in the past) claim to idolise Mussolini and make the salutes that were made infamous at Nuremburg.

He doesnt idolise Mussolini though....

So too is his condemnation of much of what Mussolini did. He calls his actions “vile” and “calculated”. He says Mussolini “went against his principles”.

 

[EastStandBlue]

Yes I have. And? Marcotti is obviously a close friend which makes it all a bit pointless - it's like getting Blair Sturrock's best mate to write an article about how he's the best striker since Pele.

DiCanio is obviously not an idiot, but he has been idiotic in not realising that in countries that fought against fascism in WW2 might be a bit adverse to people who (in the past) claim to idolise Mussolini and make the salutes that were made infamous at Nuremburg.

I don't see how providing insight into Di Canio's background and reasoning to not necessarily justify, but explain his train of thought regarding fascism and/or fascist salutes can merely be written off as a bit pointless. At least Marcotti has attempted to provide context, rather than vilify someone for claims that have been grossly exaggerated. I don't think Di Canio's ever claimed to "idolise" Mussolini at all, he's stated that he has been fascinated by him as a historical figure but, as Marcotti points out, goes to great lengths to condemn Mussolini in his autobiography and is at odds with most fascist concepts and ideologies.

I've got no time for Di Canio as a sportsman. He's clearly devoted and meticulous in his pursuit of success, but much like Roy Keane, there are more than enough cases of this being taken too far (his constant changing of captains who disappoint him, the fact that a Swindon coach is still off work with stress after Di Canio's reign). There are more than enough reasons to despise Di Canio without breaching his political views and opinions which, according to him, have been misreported. He's a self-confessed Hammer, after all...

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

He doesnt idolise Mussolini though....

He has a Mussolini tattoo.....

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

‘Paolo is not racist, he just didn’t grasp meaning of that gesture’
Gabriele Marcotti

so from this if you are really really really uber open minded and you believe that he doesn't understand what a Nazi salute means and accidently gets tattoos you'd have to wonder why any football club would want someome so stupid and naive managing their team.

 

[chapperzUK]

‘Paolo is not racist, he just didn’t grasp meaning of that gesture’
Gabriele Marcotti

so from this if you are really really really uber open minded and you believe that he doesn't understand what a Nazi salute means and accidently gets tattoos you'd have to wonder why any football club would want someome so stupid and naive managing their team.

I don't think bringing in a manager's intelligence is a good move as we have a man who considered being called "orange" racist and called Pirlo "homophobic" because he hasn't played outside of Italy.

 

[Thorpe Groyney]

It's odd how journalists from organisations which, among other things, hacked into the mobile phone of a dead teenage girl deleting her voicemail messages in the process, and suppressed a documentary revealing the identity of a serial paedophile they'd employed for decades, suddenly taking a moral high ground.

I certainly don't remember West Ham United, during their bid for the Olympic Stadium, come under such scrutiny when they opened the Paolo Di Canio Suite at the Boleyn Ground in his honour.

Nor do I call much outrage when his autobiography, detailing his hooligan exploits and expousing his politicial views, was published in 2001.

I dare say that if Di Canio had been appointed in the East End instead of the North East, the press hacks would have instead been fawning over the return of the prodigal son.

The resignation of David Miliband is a curious one, as he had announced last week already that he was standing down, as he was leaving the country to live Stateside. It seems he couldn't resist the opportunity of appearing principled at the expense of the football club he purported to back. Malcolm Tucker would be proud of the spin he put on that one.

That is why Sunderland supporters are angry. They are relieved O'Neill has gone, as they were going down without even a whimper. Now, though, all this has done is galvanise them. In a relegation battle, a siege mentality, of us v the rest of the world, could be the very thing that saves them.

No doubt the press will then claim the credit for being the catalyst .....

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

I don't think bringing in a manager's intelligence is a good move as we have a man who considered being called "orange" racist and called Pirlo "homophobic" because he hasn't played outside of Italy.

I don't think he is stupid, I think he is a fascist, but anyone that believes he isn't, stupid is the only other viable option. Brown is just stupid.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Tor-Kristian Karlsen with another fascinating insight into where football clubs could do better, looking at Di Canio's contentious appointment - http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/...-canio-sunderland-manager-research?CMP=twt_gu

Perhaps Ron should've had a word before we rushed into appointing Brown...

Good article, albeit painful reading.

Obviously you start with the style of football they prefer, their general approach to the game, tactics and systems, but also important are their man-management skills and personal-communication style. Perhaps your academy is important to your club – does your intended new manager like to play youngsters?

:'(

Would he insist on a high level of input into transfers and would you be happy to give him that? If so, what is his previous record in the transfer market?

:'(

Does he have the cultural understanding to make your foreign signings fire on all cylinders? How does your potential manager deal with pressure and would he be a good ambassador for your club? Does he have long-term visions or does he tend to burn out after the initial quick fix?

:'(


Martin OUT!

He has a Mussolini tattoo.....

Mussolini loved his parades.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Mussolini loved his padres.

you mixing him up with Franco?!

 

[FarmdogSUFC]

Am I being ignorant in the fact that I don't see a problem with this? I don't remember this being brought up when he was appointed Swindon manager so why now all of a sudden?