Death penalty - for or against

[OldBlueLady]

I wonder how many victims families advocate the death penalty?

 

[SARF]

Hang em high!!

 

[DTS]

We've been down this route so many times it's getting boring.

It costs about £250,000 per year per prisoner. (I think the actual cost is £150,000, so we're already erring on the side of caution.)

Let's say there are currently 15 people this would cover. (It really is that low because most "murderers" would probably not be counted - eg women that have murdered an abusive husband).

That makes it about £ 3,750,000 a year. Let's now divide that by 30,000,000 which is the the working population who are paying taxes.

So, it is costing each of us 12.5p a year to ensure these people rot in jail rather than take the easy option of being killed.

Moreover, how much more would it cost for these people to be kept on death row and go through appeal after appeal as they would have to be entitled to, to ensure there are no miscarriages of justice?

So you are saying there are only 15 convicted repeat murders in the UK. Not an expert but seems very low to me.

Also what about sex offenders as most people here would want them executed.

Your figures also take no account of opportunity cost of the money we are spending.

 

[DTS]

Would also be interested to know how many on the No vote would feel the same if someone they loved was killed in cold blood.....

 

[steveo]

Anyway we'll obviously never agree, I've enjoyed the debate though. Time for me to go.

Me too mate, look forward to the next one.

 

[Andyhsufc]

I think it would also damage us from a political pov as we can hardly tell other countries to stop their barbaric actions if we are killing people in our backyard. We have to practice what we preach and not fall into barbaric ways

 

[JoshC]

I wonder how many victims families advocate the death penalty?

Thats irrelevent though because they're just going to want revenge for the death of a loved one, they aren't going to be thinking rationally are they?

 

[DTS]

I think it would also damage us from a political pov as we can hardly tell other countries to stop their barbaric actions if we are killing people in our backyard. We have to practice what we preach and not fall into barbaric ways

Dosent stop America....

 

[DTS]

Thats irrelevent though because they're just going to want revenge for the death of a loved one, they aren't going to be thinking rationally are they?

So the wishes of the victims family are irrelevant are they Mr Clark? Bit harsh.

 

[Gremlin]

Would also be interested to know how many on the No vote would feel the same if someone they loved was killed in cold blood.....

And so to balance that you'd also need to know how the yes voters would feel if someone they loved was wrongly convicted of murder and faced the death penalty for a crime they hadn't commited. Works both ways, right?

 

[Andyhsufc]

Dosent stop America....

But I would like to think that our standing in foreign affairs is a lot stronger than the USA. Lets be fair, they dont care about anyone else except themselves when it comes to international affairs

 

[JoshC]

So the wishes of the victims family are irrelevant are they Mr Clark? Bit harsh.

They are irrelevent because they are biased and you can't kill someone because of a biased opinion. Do you think that the family would c are if the evidence was 100%? of course not, Mr Baker...

 

[SARF]

But I would like to think that our standing in foreign affairs is a lot stronger than the USA. Lets be fair, they dont care about anyone else except themselves when it comes to international affairs

I shouldnt think anyones standing in foreign affairs is stronger than the States.

 

[londonblue]

So you are saying there are only 15 convicted repeat murders in the UK. Not an expert but seems very low to me.

Also what about sex offenders as most people here would want them executed.

Your figures also take no account of opportunity cost of the money we are spending.

Obviously I don't know the actual number, it really is a very low number. This was mentioned on Five Live about a year ago when they were having this exact discussion.

As for opportunity cost. That is really a bit of red herring. Governments don't work out how much money they need, and then raise taxes accordingly. What they actually do, is set a tax rate (and fleece us all for the maximum they think they can get away with), count how much they have, and then decide what to spend it on.

 

[Firestorm]

having read this thread through again, is the poll about bringing back the death penalty to its pre 1965 level of inforcement, its pre 1957 (homicide act) or to an even earlier level ?
Certainly since 1900 there has not been the death penalty for sexual offences

 

[OldBlueLady]

Thats irrelevent though because they're just going to want revenge for the death of a loved one, they aren't going to be thinking rationally are they?

I don't know, there's been a few of the families of the victims of recent knife crime murders over here that have said they forgive the killers, and also Rhys Jones' family did the same IIRC.

 

[londonblue]

Would also be interested to know how many on the No vote would feel the same if someone they loved was killed in cold blood.....

I would also like to know how the people on the Yes side would feel if they (or a relative/friend) was wrongly convicted.

I think emotion would change everybody's point of view, and it is better that we make this decision without the interference of emotion.

However, the only person I do know that had a friend murdered was all for the death penalty to start with. She then realised that her opinion was based on hatred and the wish to gain revenge, rather than justice. I believe she has since visited the murderer, but I may be wrong there.

 

[OldBlueLady]

having read this thread through again, is the poll about bringing back the death penalty to its pre 1965 level of inforcement, its pre 1957 (homicide act) or to an even earlier level ?
Certainly since 1900 there has not been the death penalty for sexual offences

That's why I'm not voting, I don't want it brought back similarly to it's past enforcement at all. It needs redefining for cases of exceptional and repetitive serial murders where there is proof beyond any shadow of a doubt. Whether there might then need to be something else for terrorist martyr types would need a whole seperate debate.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Would also be interested to know how many on the No vote would feel the same if someone they loved was killed in cold blood.....

I'd be just as opposed to the death penalty even if a loved one was killed.

In fact I'd like to think that I would be even more opposed to it, as I'd be aware exactly how terrible taking someone's life away is.

 

[steveo]

Whether there might then need to be something else for terrorist martyr types would need a whole seperate debate.

Thats a good point - perhaps we could electructe them and hang them too.