Wake up Tilly

[londonblue]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 02 2005,15:38)]

Quote[/b] (Proud Shrimper @ Jan. 02 2005,13:16)]

Quote[/b] (Thenewblue @ Jan. 02 2005,00:58)]When will this stop! When we make champions league? Urgh he has Brush beside him plus he's getting his badges, he loves the club and experience or not he's getting the best out of his players which is the hardest thing to do. we're 4th!! Last year we were where Rushden are now, how can you even question Tilsons judgement! Stupid post!

I agree, VERY stupid post IMO. How is Tilson supposed to get his experience then - every manager has to start somewhere. Yes Tilly has very little experience but decided to rest Gray/Eastwood yesterday to keep them fresh for Kiddy and enhance our chances of 3pts, now that uis a sign of a manager with little experience making decisions as if he'd been in a job for many years. How anyone can question his decision-making is beyond me, there isn't a single manager out there who could have turned this club around in such a short space of time. When he leads us to League One in May will "rabbloke" still be questioning ST and PB?

And another thing, Tilly will DEFINITELY be here for not just next season but I'm sure the forseeable future - he is Southend through and through and it would take a big job for him to walk away from us, he'll be given a more than fair go from the supporters because of who he is also. I have to ask "rabbloke" doesn't it register that you are the only one on this entire thread who has the opinions you've put forward and no-one has agreed with you at all?

' Idiots ', ' Mental hospital..', ' doesn't it register?'. You all have a wonderful smug way of trying to be so superior with your own opinions. I have never wanted Tilly to go or questioned his contribution but I am not blind to his faults and if they cost us promotion the squad will not be the same next season and neither may the manager. Apparently we were only aiming for 12th this season. Well if that were true half the players we have were conned. Go tell Eastwood or Gray they were told when they signed that they only had 12th to look forward to. I may be the only one on this thread with concern but I am not ashamed to be the only voice of reason. What none of you questioned Corbetts absence earlier in the season, or Jupps inclusion or which keeper should be played. People in glass houses.... Your passion for The Blues is no greater than mine and after more than thirty years of support and trawling around countless league grounds to see them I have learnt there are no certainties in football. Least of all with SUFC. Dream on boys and post again when reality strikes home. I hope we make the LDV final and promotion. Terrific. But if we dont then dont expect it again for some time.

You're not the only voice of reason. You're the only one being unreasonable.

And yes, the players knew what the club's measure of success was for the season. In fact, not only was it to finish mid table, it was to still be in existence at the end of it!

Just because the aim was to finish 12th doesn't mean that we shouldn't push for better. The whole point of goal setting is to ensure it is achiveable otherwise there is no point setting them. Given that we finished 17th last season, 12th is a reasonable aim this time around. But, as I said, there is no harm in trying to better it. Personally I think Ron Martin knew he had a rookie manager and set a goal of 12th on that basis, hoping obviously that we'd better it.

More to the point, if the goal of 12th is achieved (and from where we are now that would now be considered a disappointment) Tilly will be going nowhere. Will the players still be here? Well, as for the ones mentioned; Gower, Dudders and Fredy are all contracted through next season too. So they only way they will go is if Tilly decides to let them. He will only do that if he has better people lined up. I trust his judgement on players too. So far he has bought in Petts, Bentley, Gray, Eastwood, Bart, Edwards, Barrett, Prior and Dudders. Some may have taken time to settle, but there is not a weak player amongst them.

I hope to god that we get promotion this season, but if Tilly's inexperience (and that is something I am yet to be convinced is an issue) means we drop a couple of points along the way then so be it. If we don't go up this season then I for one think the future looks rosy for next.

To answer the point about Tilly's inexperience. The only evidence people have of that is that he tends to not make substitutions. Well, neither did Dave Webb, and he was far from inexperienced. Maybe it is a matter of opinion rather than inexperience? I sometimes moan that we need to make changes, but I did the same when Dave Webb was manager....in fact every time DW was manager!

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 01 2005,23:30)]Firstly it is saying he has been inflexible in his selection for more than half a season and secondly he has his favourites.

I would hate to end this season and see us not quite make promotion just because Tilly could not see the most simple things in football.

I also wonder whether Eastwoods bench warming stint was to avoid injury with a possible transfer imminent. I am sure at two up today I would have put our top scorer on and not Gray if I wanted to secure the win. Just a thought.

If Tilson had made mass changes for the Mansfield game and lost then he would have been blamed for changing a winning team. Steve Tilson is the only manager we have had since returning to this division that has a consistency in approach and selection to each game and he is being criticised for it!

I would much rather just miss out on promotion rather than scratch around at the wrong end of the table. Tilson has sown that he can take this club in the right direction and only a total moron would sack him for that.

Why bring on Eastwood to a heavy pitch and wet conditions after a limited warm up when the game is already won? Does "hamstring injury" not mean anything to you? Who's going to buy him anyway? It will take a fair amount to get him and the only clubs with that kind of money wouldn't be able to offer him first team football anyway

 

[Guest]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 02 2005,15:38)]

Quote[/b] (Proud Shrimper @ Jan. 02 2005,13:16)]

Quote[/b] (Thenewblue @ Jan. 02 2005,00:58)]When will this stop! When we make champions league? Urgh he has Brush beside him plus he's getting his badges, he loves the club and experience or not he's getting the best out of his players which is the hardest thing to do. we're 4th!! Last year we were where Rushden are now, how can you even question Tilsons judgement! Stupid post!

I agree, VERY stupid post IMO. How is Tilson supposed to get his experience then - every manager has to start somewhere. Yes Tilly has very little experience but decided to rest Gray/Eastwood yesterday to keep them fresh for Kiddy and enhance our chances of 3pts, now that uis a sign of a manager with little experience making decisions as if he'd been in a job for many years. How anyone can question his decision-making is beyond me, there isn't a single manager out there who could have turned this club around in such a short space of time. When he leads us to League One in May will "rabbloke" still be questioning ST and PB?

And another thing, Tilly will DEFINITELY be here for not just next season but I'm sure the forseeable future - he is Southend through and through and it would take a big job for him to walk away from us, he'll be given a more than fair go from the supporters because of who he is also. I have to ask "rabbloke" doesn't it register that you are the only one on this entire thread who has the opinions you've put forward and no-one has agreed with you at all?

' Idiots ', ' Mental hospital..', ' doesn't it register?'. You all have a wonderful smug way of trying to be so superior with your own opinions. I have never wanted Tilly to go or questioned his contribution but I am not blind to his faults and if they cost us promotion the squad will not be the same next season and neither may the manager. Apparently we were only aiming for 12th this season. Well if that were true half the players we have were conned. Go tell Eastwood or Gray they were told when they signed that they only had 12th to look forward to. I may be the only one on this thread with concern but I am not ashamed to be the only voice of reason. What none of you questioned Corbetts absence earlier in the season, or Jupps inclusion or which keeper should be played. People in glass houses.... Your passion for The Blues is no greater than mine and after more than thirty years of support and trawling around countless league grounds to see them I have learnt there are no certainties in football. Least of all with SUFC. Dream on boys and post again when reality strikes home. I hope we make the LDV final and promotion. Terrific. But if we dont then dont expect it again for some time.

Maybe the fact that Tilly knows his best XI and sticks to it should be considered a positive rather than a negative? The players know the system, are used to playing with each other and no doubt this breeds confidence. If things start to go pear-shaped and he doesnt change it around, maybe Tilly would deserve some criticism then. Why not enjoy our success while we#ve got it? Its been along time coming.....

Jimmy was 2 stone over weight when he came back for pre-season, hardly surprising Tilly didnt play him. As for Jupp, if we dropped everyone after a bad game, we wouldnt have any players left. There's no harm in a manager having faith in his players. Its a shame some of our "fans" cant have faith in a young manager who loves this club.

 

[South Bank Hank]

Just to add my twopenneth...

It took a brave man to criticise so openly after we cemented our 4th position with a 3-0 victory, but Rabbloke, in all honesty, did you not expect/deserve some sort of backlash from a post titled "Wake up Tilly?" when you consider the job he's doing.

 

[Shrimp in a Kilt]

Rabbloke, I am not questioning your supporting credentials, and some of the points you make are perfectly valid.

BUT

you have taken molehills and built a mountain out of them. Yes Tilly makes mistakes (I was screaming for him to make a couple of late subs against Boston to hold things up a bit along with 80% of the fans) but the evidence you have produced does not support the dramatic conclusion that you have come to.

Chill out and enjoy, stop looking for trouble!!

 

[Shrimp in a Kilt]

Quote[/b] (Its grim up north! @ Jan. 02 2005,11:25)]Bring back Wignal!

It's a disgrace!

Hi OS  

Far too short and sardonic for IGUN!

 

[Technician]

Rabbloke had some reasonable points of view that have been lamblasted by a number of posters on here, who seem to have very short memories. The fact that he quotes "people in glass houses" is something I empathise with and is one of the reasons why I am a very infrequent visitor to this forum now.

Whilst I don't agree with all that Rabbloke has said, he is right on one thing... Tilson knows (from being a player) what the Xmas footballing schedule can do to a team and 90 minutes of football twice in two days can take it's toll and affect the outcome of an expected good result, irrespective of how fit the team is.

The decisions Tilson makes affects us all and I am not doubting his track record, nor his ability to achieve the success we all crave for the team, nor what he has done within his short managerial career. My expectations however, have been well known from the start... I believe we will make the playoffs and the final in Cardiff, at which point I hope that he has learnt from the many (however insignificant) errors in judgement you people keep quoting... so that we achieve promotion via this route.

Whilst we are fourth, we are keeping the teams above us honest and in doing so, Scunny and Swansea have both slipped up in recent games. With 21 matches to go, anything could happen and I suspect there will be more up's and down's before the season closes, but we need to avoid another Mansfield and not take these teams for granted.

For me, last Tuesday's effort meant we lost momentum that would have seen us win five straight games, for the first time since the early 90's because of an error in judgement! it's in the past now anyway... let's move on and bury the hatchet!!!

 

[Welsh_Shrimperz]

Tilson is doing it for Southend in real life like I'am doing on Football Manager 2005. I'am glad we got Tilson in charge, if we got the like of Cotterill (Burnley) & Danny wilson (MK Dons) in charge of us & lead us to 4th, both of them would walk out on us (like fatty Fry did) when an better offer come along - but Tilson is loyal with Southend & I can see him staying for long time - unless an few moron decide that we should be playing rubbish & struggling between 12th to 24th with players that show no passion then they will force Tilson out.

Looking at Rushden, they remind me of Southend under Newman, Martin & Wignall - look how far we come this season. look at Orient manager, he keep boasting that they going to romp this Division at the start of the season, I rather have manager (Tilson) who keep his feet on the ground than a manager who use his big mouth everytime (like Orient).

PS: Tilson was my Hero as an 10 years old in our glory years between 1990 to 1992.

 

[Shrimper JK]

Quote[/b] (southend4ever @ Jan. 02 2005,17:40)]

Quote[/b] (Shrimper JK @ Jan. 02 2005,10:18)]I honestly cant believe people are still finding stuff to moan about when we are fourth! And to add to that moaning after a 3-0 victory! I know after yesterdays games I'd rather be a Southend fan than a Rushden fan (they should be worried, they were truly awful) Think how they feel, and some blues fans still find things and people to slag off after giving someone a 3-0 trouncing. I came on here expecting to see people giving Tilson a lot of credit for yesterday for mixing the team up a bit (especially playing Nicky left mid) but instead they moan about how he should have done it earlier.

people are not 100 out against Tilly, they are just finding faults in his armoury. To be fair if he was much better then he would be coaching teams outside of this league because the turnaround in a short space of time at this club has been phenomenal.

I would say most is constructive criticism, and there are people that just want to be the best and so they post, saying how people could improve. that is what has happened here.

Fair enough, constructive critisism is OK, but I just felt annoyed that people are to me what feels like moaning, after a 3-0 victory! As I said earlier I came on here expecting to read people giving credit to Steve for mixing the team around and giving some players a rest and still coming out with a result, not complaining about how he should ahve done it earlier. At least criticise after a poor performance and result please!

UP THE BLUES!

 

[DTS]

Reading Rab Blokes post you can see that he is a genuine Southend fan and fair call for having an opinion and standing by it....

But personally I find the whole thing a bit confusing. Whilst Tilly has limited exerince and I am sure by his own admission he is still learning. We have had managers with loads of experince such as Little and Wignall and neither have taken us anywhere neat fourth.

We lost 2 top players in the summer in the Leons and Tilly has more than replaced them with Barrett and Wayne/Fred which for my mind shows him to be a good manager.

The football at the moment is largely superb and Ic ant remember at time at the hall when every week I expect us to win.

We have a manager who is Southend through and through and if he does move on the better pastures it will only be because he has achieved at Southend.

I am walking round with a permanent grim on my face at the moment as I cant believe we are 4th. Surely its a bout time to start looking up and making the most of our time in the top few. We have waited 7 YEARS for it afterall.

See you at Kiddy...
DtS

 

[The General]

Think Dave has it spot on. Tilson, himself, is a local person who loves the club and by the looks of it, he's also trying to bring in as many 'local' players as possible. He hasn't really up-rooted anyone by bring them in for up north. Most players have either been London or Essex based and thus shouldn't effect their personal life as its preety easy to get into training from where they used to live so kids dont have to move school, move houses etc... This brings passion as the players want to do well for the club and this seems to be breeding success.

At the start of 2004 we were in the sh*t. At the end of it we were 4th. Who would have believed that 12 months ago? Who would have believed we'd be genuine play-off contenders (because that is what we nearly are) and just 4 points off the automatic spots.

No manager is perfect. But its better than having muppets like Wignall, Taylor, Whelan etc... at the club nearly crippling us.

Right, off to Kiddie.

Kev

 

[sufcintheprem]

And....

Football league review described us as 'on fire' at the moment. I can assure you, we've not been 'on fire' since I started going regularly.

Perhaps Tilson made the odd mistake but he's only been a manager in any capacity for a season and a half. He'll be learning from every game still and I'm not surprised by the odd mistake.

Frankly, keeping Jupp in, for instance, was relying on an experienced senior player to come through a bad spell, the keeper debate has rarley been a debate due to injuries and most 'errors' have just been academic in the context of relevant results.

Beat Kiddy today and we could be within a point of Swansea.