Thanks Kev - but is a new manager needed?

[GBJ]

Looking back at the stats on the fees paid to agents, Aldershot paid £200 odd and we paid over £100k
so our recruitment budget must have been a lot more than theirs, yet we have only won two more games than them so far this season......somethings not right

This has been explained, they’re historic fees, which Ron didn’t pay. It’s nothing to do with this season.

Serious question. Those that are Maher in. What would it take to change your mind?

A continuation of the issues which have plagued us this season.

We lack quality in the squad, which most people seem to agree on judging by the retain thread. We need to recruit better, and being on level terms with every other club for a change should ensure us a fair chance.

If we’re going to stick with the same style of play - which is wing-play, not sideways/backwards - then we need players capable of being effective in that system. Wingers who have pace & can cross a ball. Strikers who’ll score. Etc.

In terms of how long, I’d say Kev has got until October. If by that time the improvements aren’t clear and visible, I’d expect most people will say enough is enough.

Personally, I think we’ll do alright next year, so this is all moot anyway

 

[Avl1983]

I’m not playing a game of moving goalposts with you again.

I’m not engaging in trolls anymore, and people who genuinely seem happy when things aren’t all rosy so they can knock the manager.

The amount of disrespect for a man who has done so much for this Club, both as a player and a manager, but more importantly as a man, is absolutely criminal.

Yes, you can knock team selections, substitutions etc, but the glee in some posters when they have something to abuse Kev about is awful. SZ is a terrible place to be after a defeat, seems to be the same with a draw now. I’ve been posting less and less, and I can see numerous others are the same.

The question was asked to the “Maher In” people what would it take to become “Maher Out”. I genuinely interested in what it would take for the other way round. For some people, I think even if we got into the playoffs and won promotion, that wouldn’t be enough. Even then, we’d have a sticky start and the knives would be out.

This is the last I’ll get involved in this thread.

This is a prime example of why a lot of the Maher out crowd don’t post! Calling people trolls? Why because your hero Maher has been criticized?

You spout on about what a great man he is and maybe in private he is, but as a general fan with no connections to the club I don’t see much of it, you hear the odd story about what he’s done if you read through the zone if they’re all true, but I haven’t personally seen any of these amazing accomplishments ‘as a man’. So what do you really expect?

I see a bang average manager that massively overachieved last season. He plays unimaginative, slow, boring, predictable football, he has signed a number of players that are questionable at best.
He’s a manager that is constantly screaming and shouting at the 4th official and a manager that turns on fans when he’s not happy.

There seems to be blind loyalty from some fans and whilst loyalty is admirable, for me personally his time has come if we want to move forward. I don’t have any trust he is the correct man to take us into the league above.

What would it take for me to change my mind? I want to watch faster paced football and be entertained when I watch my team! If we’re going to lose or draw, I’d rather do it whilst losing 3-2 or drawing 3-3 than the constant 0-0 and 1-0’s we have this season. As a bonus it would be nice if the respect we’re asked to have for the manager was reciprocated!

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

If funds for players are still limited, the cheapest option is to replace those out of contract, and make a change at the top. This would be the cheapest option, as DC would step up, and we would only have 1 contract to sort out.
This is the lowest cost, with possibly the biggest change on the field.
Unfortunately I don't believe things will change otherwise, as even the best players in the league would struggle with our set up. Look at LCP he's already looking unable to make something happen, even with the potential he has.

Genuinely, you think replacing Maher with Currie would have an impact? Based on what?

I’m not sure “the best players in the league” would struggle. A clinical goal scorer up top and a better crosser of the ball alone would have seen us win quite a few more I reckon. Regardless of the style Maher plays which I know not all are agreed on. Maher isn’t above criticism but we lack proper characters and that won’t change unless we sign some.
Maybe we need a Niclas Fullkrug to tell certain players some home truths

As for Leon, did you see the game on Friday? He had plenty of the ball and ran at them loads and nearly did make stuff happen. A stronger shot and he might’ve scored a superb individual goal. I didn’t see evidence of a player being told not to attack.

 

[Avl1983]

One thing is certain, whatever happens some people won’t be happy! COSU have a difficult job whether he stays or goes. I just hope we don’t live to regret keeping him for next season.

 

[GBJ]

One thing is certain, whatever happens some people won’t be happy! COSU have a difficult job whether he stays or goes. I just hope we don’t live to regret keeping him for next season.

When you say live to regret it, what is the worst that could happen? Another season in this division?

 

[Avl1983]

When you say live to regret it, what is the worst that could happen? Another season in this division?

That’s what I meant yeah! I’m not suggesting we’d go down etc the team and the management are good enough for that obviously. I can see us having another very similar season.

Maher clearly knows how to set a team up not to lose and keep some clean sheets, I have my doubts over his ability to turn those into wins though.

 

[Fairport]

I have just voted No but not with any great enthusiasm. The current squad is not good enough. We are overloaded with too many players who can't shoot or get into good goalscoring positions. At the end of the day surely KM can see this and should be given one last chance to improve the recruitment. We really have to get this right but having inadequate players on current contracts doesn't make it any easier.
We live in hope.

 

[Southend Elvis]

Genuinely, you think replacing Maher with Currie would have an impact? Based on what?

I’m not sure “the best players in the league” would struggle. A clinical goal scorer up top and a better crosser of the ball alone would have seen us win quite a few more I reckon. Regardless of the style Maher plays which I know not all are agreed on. Maher isn’t above criticism but we lack proper characters and that won’t change unless we sign some.
Maybe we need a Niclas Fullkrug to tell certain players some home truths

As for Leon, did you see the game on Friday? He had plenty of the ball and ran at them loads and nearly did make stuff happen. A stronger shot and he might’ve scored a superb individual goal. I didn’t see evidence of a player being told not to attack.

Something needs to change, we don't know if DC would be any good, but I think we have seen this season what KM offers. DC could be a stop gap, just like Tilly was.
LCP didn't create anything in my opinion, because the set up did not allow him to, because our players weren't anywhere near him, either to link up or help.
I'm not convinced that allowing KM to bring in new players would change anything.
We all have our opinions, but I'm not expecting anything different next season, even if we signed big players. And that post was to give another option, if we are still skint.

 

[NZamba Legend]

Maher clearly knows how to set a team up not to lose and keep some clean sheets, I have my doubts over his ability to turn those into wins though.

Absolutely. This is the crux of it. My view is that some underplay the importance of the clean sheets and the ability to not get beat easily. But we totally need to balance that that with a more potent attack. I think Kev can do it, but if he doesn’t he will inevitably be gone next season. I think everyone, including Kev and COSU recognises this.

 

[onceknownasrab]

When you say live to regret it, what is the worst that could happen? Another season in this division?

The wrong recruitment over the summer, along with our better players leaving or becoming disheartened, could impact on far more than one season. KM has brought players in and despite all of the talk about DD, analysis, players being his choice, he has failed to get a decent, consistent tune out of them.

Poor pre-season, embargo, third choice players, yes we have heard the same stale arguments time and again but, the key issue is whether we believe KM has got the best out of the squad he has. For me that's a no. His most loyal supporters prefer to dwell on 'circumstances' beyond his control and his heroic, even epic stand in the face of adversity. He deserves many an accolade for his playing and managing contribution to this club, that is beyond question,but it does not mean he is the right man to take us further.

The vast majority and on this forum, myself included, would absolutely be chuffed if he were to bring us success. I just do not think he will and I believe he has spurned opportunities to do so already, not least this season in particular.

 

[MisterStubbs]

Absolutely. This is the crux of it. My view is that some underplay the importance of the clean sheets and the ability to not get beat easily. But we totally need to balance that that with a more potent attack. I think Kev can do it, but if he doesn’t he will inevitably be gone next season. I think everyone, including Kev and COSU recognises this.

What gives you the confidence though that Kev can do it when he has shown this season that he can’t? We’ve had far to many games, especially at home this season like that against Braintree and each time Kev has failed to make game changing decisions in order to get us the win.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

Something needs to change, we don't know if DC would be any good, but I think we have seen this season what KM offers. DC could be a stop gap, just like Tilly was.
LCP didn't create anything in my opinion, because the set up did not allow him to, because our players weren't anywhere near him, either to link up or help.
I'm not convinced that allowing KM to bring in new players would change anything.
We all have our opinions, but I'm not expecting anything different next season, even if we signed big players. And that post was to give another option, if we are still skint.

Hmm we’ve seen on the odd occasion (FGR home, Charlton) a much more attacking approach but we never seem to carry that on for more than a couple of games. I get the wish for change but surely Currie is more of the same, aren’t they a team of 3? My opinion of Kev is he probably needs a proper crack at it but if you’d asked me after Sittingbourne or Barnet (think that’s the match I left early - first time ever) .. yeah .. different answer probably.

 

[Tommy2holes]

Yeah, he was awful last season.

So bad that he won the manager of the season award from the league, despite missing out on the playoffs. Awful.

I’d love to know a list of manager of the season awards, and the position they finish in. Can’t imagine too many managers win the award despite not gaining promotion. I’d hazard a guess not many. Probably all awful managers too.

Ranieri won the premier league and then got the boot the following season.

Fwiw I think Kev will get next season and proper pre season etc.

My worry is he will be too sentimentaly attached to undertake the overhaul that is needed.

Won't get the right players in and will continue to play this god awful style of football.

I genuinely hope that I'm wrong and we got up as champions with Kev at the helm, but look at what Dean Brennan is doing Barnet. Great style and full on entertaining attacking football. That will never be Kev

 

[Southend Elvis]

Hmm we’ve seen on the odd occasion (FGR home, Charlton) a much more attacking approach but we never seem to carry that on for more than a couple of games. I get the wish for change but surely Currie is more of the same, aren’t they a team of 3? My opinion of Kev is he probably needs a proper crack at it but if you’d asked me after Sittingbourne or Barnet (think that’s the match I left early - first time ever) .. yeah .. different answer probably.

How many great, attacking games have we seen this season, compared to the laboured, dull slow fair that we have seen in the last 2 games. Those games you mentioned are few and far between.
Deep down does any fan really think we are going to rip it up next season, if things stay the same, or do they have their fingers and toes crossed that something good happens.

 

[Holy Joe]

This is a prime example of why a lot of the Maher out crowd don’t post!

If only!

 

[Holy Joe]

How many great, attacking games have we seen this season, compared to the laboured, dull slow fair that we have seen in the last 2 games. Those games you mentioned are few and far between.
Deep down does any fan really think we are going to rip it up next season, if things stay the same, or do they have their fingers and toes crossed that something good happens.

If things stay the same then, all other things being equal, results will be the same. BUT all other things won't be equal - I'm pretty sure our squad won't be the same. I'm certain opposition squads won't be the same. Will we rip it up next season - no one knows, even those that say no (although statistically they're more likely to be right as only 2 or 3 teams can rip it up)

 

[MisterStubbs]

The wrong recruitment over the summer, along with our better players leaving or becoming disheartened, could impact on far more than one season. KM has brought players in and despite all of the talk about DD, analysis, players being his choice, he has failed to get a decent, consistent tune out of them.

Poor pre-season, embargo, third choice players, yes we have heard the same stale arguments time and again but, the key issue is whether we believe KM has got the best out of the squad he has. For me that's a no. His most loyal supporters prefer to dwell on 'circumstances' beyond his control and his heroic, even epic stand in the face of adversity. He deserves many an accolade for his playing and managing contribution to this club, that is beyond question,but it does not mean he is the right man to take us further.

The vast majority and on this forum, myself included, would absolutely be chuffed if he were to bring us success. I just do not think he will and I believe he has spurned opportunities to do so already, not least this season in particular.

This post sums up my thoughts perfectly.

As someone who is in the belief that a change is needed over the summer, I’m often labeled as someone who lacks respect or as someone who hates KM.. that couldn’t be further from the truth. Growing up he was my favourite player, the player when whilst at school when everybody else wanted to be the Gerrard’s, the Ronaldo’s etc on the playground, I was the Kevin Maher. He’s combative, lead from the front style as a player is what made me idolise him growing up and despite not being a huge fan of returning legends in a managerial capacity (after the way things turned sour towards the end of Chris Powell‘s reign) I was thrilled when he got the job.

Separating what Kev did for us as a player and what he’s done for us as a manager is something I think some who are fully behind him no matter what is also something that leads to the disconnection between some sets of fans. There can be ZERO DOUBT though when it comes to the fact KM deserves the upmost respect for what he and the rest of his coaching team managed to achieve whilst under the circumstances they found themselves in. Last season, they simply performed miracles and that, rightly or wrongly gave some of us false hope coming in to this season. I said at the beginning of the season that I thought with the squad we had, the playoffs were a realistic target. Losing the likes of Cardwell and Pepple during the season of course didn’t help, nor did losing out on certain summer targets but KM has still been given the players he’d have signed off on and bar one or two, they simply haven’t improved us. Key players from last season (Jack Bridge, I’m looking at you) have gone backwards as well.

We’ve spoke to death about how KM likes to set up his team, how he wants us to play etc and my biggest worry is that to date, Kev hasn’t shown the ability to be able to make decisions that can help turn a 0-0 at home to teams like Braintree in to wins and that’s why I believe it’s time for a new face with fresh ideas to come in during the summer.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

How many great, attacking games have we seen this season, compared to the laboured, dull slow fair that we have seen in the last 2 games. Those games you mentioned are few and far between.
Deep down does any fan really think we are going to rip it up next season, if things stay the same, or do they have their fingers and toes crossed that something good happens.

I’m hoping better players equals more goals equals more points. I don’t think we’re dull as such just slow in getting it forward and the quality of balls into the box/finishing has been sub standard. Better players *might* improve this.

 

[Avl1983]

Absolutely. This is the crux of it. My view is that some underplay the importance of the clean sheets and the ability to not get beat easily. But we totally need to balance that that with a more potent attack. I think Kev can do it, but if he doesn’t he will inevitably be gone next season. I think everyone, including Kev and COSU recognises this.

I think a lot of my frustration has come from worrying more about the clean sheets and not losing than going for the win. I agree clean sheets are important but I’d rather we attacked and went for the win!

 

[Avl1983]

If only!

There’s only a handful that post generally, I think that number is increasing over time as more people are getting frustrated but calling people trolls is embarrassing! Childish really.