SUFC: The Future Sustainability of the club

[Holy Joe]

No doubt their fanzone plays a part. Here's hoping COSU take note
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Their non football revenue was something like £1m a year. Ours is zero. Their loss in 21/22 was attributed to COVID and not being able to use conferencing etc.

 

[Tommy2holes]

I think we are all agreed that staying at roots Hall is great as it's location is far better but let's be honest, to turn Roots Hall into a modern 365 day a year stadium is one hell of a task. Arguably a new purpose built stadium is easier to achieve.

We need to get out of the national league and as we have seen and are seeing from other clubs, teams are spending big to get out.

It's a massive gamble without big money owners.

I guess if we are well placed going into the final couple of months then a few end of season loans on higher wages may well be the answer.

The longer we stay in the national league the less likely breaking even becomes as crowds would undoubtedly dwindle. Maybe not this season or next but eventually.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

I think we are all agreed that staying at roots Hall is great as it's location is far better but let's be honest, to turn Roots Hall into a modern 365 day a year stadium is one hell of a task. Arguably a new purpose built stadium is easier to achieve.

We need to get out of the national league and as we have seen and are seeing from other clubs, teams are spending big to get out.

It's a massive gamble without big money owners.

I guess if we are well placed going into the final couple of months then a few end of season loans on higher wages may well be the answer.

The longer we stay in the national league the less likely breaking even becomes as crowds would undoubtedly dwindle. Maybe not this season or next but eventually.

I think crowds will always turn up to watch a team competing at the top end of any league. Luton and Wrexham were down here ages and their crowds didn’t drastically fall.

Our best chance always was/still is the play offs. We don’t need the very best players just a bit of luck and a couple of good runs. Last season showed team spirit counts for a lot too. It’s such a shame we had the points deduction last season as I think we’d have given the play offs a really good go and might’ve gone up. Aim is to repeat that with a better outcome.

 

[Tommy2holes]

I think crowds will always turn up to watch a team competing at the top end of any league. Luton and Wrexham were down here ages and their crowds didn’t drastically fall.

Our best chance always was/still is the play offs. We don’t need the very best players just a bit of luck and a couple of good runs. Last season showed team spirit counts for a lot too. It’s such a shame we had the points deduction last season as I think we’d have given the play offs a really good go and might’ve gone up. Aim is to repeat that with a better outcome.

Luton crowds weren't all that great until the season they got promoted and had around 7500 odd. Prior to that it was sub 6000 on average.

Wrexham had seasons well under a 4k average and one season had an under 3k average. It was only when they got taken over that they suddenly gained and extra 100% each week.

Luton were here for 5 seasons and Wrexham for about 13 seasons.

This is our 3rd season and it's important we capitalise on the feel good to gain momentum. Winning promotion would massively help with that.

 

[Rob1920]

The Championship has long been known as the financial graveyard division. No club makes a profit in that division. You’re either spending way over your means to try and get promoted to the Prem, or way over your means to avoid relegation (I.e. us). You need owners with seriously deep pockets to stay in that division long term. Best bet for clubs like us is to accept our natural level is between where we are now and L1, and hope for the occasional season or two in the championship but on a L1 budget. Which ultimately will always mean relegation won’t be far away. But it’s that, or be the next Reading.

 

[Tommy2holes]

The Championship has long been known as the financial graveyard division. No club makes a profit in that division. You’re either spending way over your means to try and get promoted to the Prem, or way over your means to avoid relegation (I.e. us). You need owners with seriously deep pockets to stay in that division long term. Best bet for clubs like us is to accept our natural level is between where we are now and L1, and hope for the occasional season or two in the championship but on a L1 budget. Which ultimately will always mean relegation won’t be far away. But it’s that, or be the next Reading.

It's why teams like posh and Rotherham get up occasionally but always come straight back down.

At least they don't try to punch to hard to stay..

 

[stewart]

Lot of good comments on this thread, yes i agree if we want to be sustainable we need to get out of the NL and back into the EFL asap. As i see it at present and the Hartlepool game today will show us where we are at a loss wont be good , COSU and i am fully supportive of them will have to decide whether or not they are going to put a little extra cash into gettingthe players we need to be fully competitive with the competition,or risk of falling attendances going from almost 8000 against York back to 5000 ,thats how i see it.Yes RH does need prettying up i agree plus the training ground, needs completing there are so many tasks that are required doing and can be more afforded by keeping the supporters happy ,At present i see as the most important tasks for COSU is to make the 3 or 4 signings we need happen ,keep the supporters happy and our club in the top echelon ,gets us back in the EFL asap, Im sure if we are challenging for promotion RH will rock even more ,we have a cup run all the better, Look at the support we got when at Wembley and Millenium stadium that was no fluke it happened what 3 or 4 times it wasnt a one off , the fans are there just need a top challenging team and they will come . At present we are a possible playoff team at best . I hope im proved wrong and we go on to finish at least top 4 .

 

[* ORM *]

Where have COSU stated any requirement to get out of this division this season? I wish people would get a grip and be thankful for what we have. Rock bottom is behind us, the hill is steep but we’ve made a start.

 

[stewart]

Where have COSU stated any requirement to get out of this division this season? I wish people would get a grip and be thankful for what we have. Rock bottom is behind us, the hill is steep but we’ve made a start.

I dont believe anyone has stated COSU have said that, but what i was referring to in my post is what many have stated here , the club would be more sustainable being in the EFL even if its only league 2 for the foreseeable future, many reasons given for that by posters also . What i alluring to is COSU themselves deciding is it more sustainable in NL or EFL, If they believe its more sustainable in the EFL then we need to get the players that will take us there, if they believe its more sustainable in the NL then lets just go with what with have for now unless a bargain comes up with promise off course or decent loanees who wont cost the club too much in Salary.

 

[Thundersley Blue]

Where have COSU stated any requirement to get out of this division this season? I wish people would get a grip and be thankful for what we have. Rock bottom is behind us, the hill is steep but we’ve made a start.

I agree and the recent Podcast on Football Finance involving Tom Lawrence was an eye opener. He clearly said that the management team were under no pressure. Just to comment on something the previous poster said, it isn't a case of "prettying " up Roots Hall, in many areas it is a case of making it safe.

 

[BoyWonder2]

Lot of good comments on this thread, yes i agree if we want to be sustainable we need to get out of the NL and back into the EFL asap. As i see it at present and the Hartlepool game today will show us where we are at a loss wont be good , COSU and i am fully supportive of them will have to decide whether or not they are going to put a little extra cash into gettingthe players we need to be fully competitive with the competition,or risk of falling attendances going from almost 8000 against York back to 5000 ,thats how i see it.Yes RH does need prettying up i agree plus the training ground, needs completing there are so many tasks that are required doing and can be more afforded by keeping the supporters happy ,At present i see as the most important tasks for COSU is to make the 3 or 4 signings we need happen ,keep the supporters happy and our club in the top echelon ,gets us back in the EFL asap, Im sure if we are challenging for promotion RH will rock even more ,we have a cup run all the better, Look at the support we got when at Wembley and Millenium stadium that was no fluke it happened what 3 or 4 times it wasnt a one off , the fans are there just need a top challenging team and they will come . At present we are a possible playoff team at best . I hope im proved wrong and we go on to finish at least top 4 .

I’m not sure that’s how COSU see it.

Getting the new training ground fit for purpose and applying their short terms goals at Roots Hall is more pressing. TL stated they need to switch on areas of Roots Hall that had been switched off for example.

Luckily their aren’t mutually exclusive, so the footballing department can do the work on the 3/4 players and COSU can work on the unglamorous stuff that will benefit the club going forward.

 

[* ORM *]

Just to be clear my post wasn’t aimed at individuals. Fans are all guilty, including me. Being exiled gives a sense of objectivity that’s not possible when you’re setting out on the long trip to Hartlepool or the short trip to Roots Hall.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

Luton crowds weren't all that great until the season they got promoted and had around 7500 odd. Prior to that it was sub 6000 on average.

Wrexham had seasons well under a 4k average and one season had an under 3k average. It was only when they got taken over that they suddenly gained and extra 100% each week.

Luton were here for 5 seasons and Wrexham for about 13 seasons.

This is our 3rd season and it's important we capitalise on the feel good to gain momentum. Winning promotion would massively help with that.

Yeah the point is their crowds returned/improved when they were competing at the top as ours would. Fans love a winning team. I think we’re capable of going up this season without chucking a wad of cash at it. I’m sure Kev/the players feel the same and won’t be aiming for mid table.

At the end of the day though having a club to support trumps everything and being able to be much more sustainable going forward. We’re in a better place and let’s enjoy that. Those that don’t want to stick around as we aren’t ****ing the league, good riddance!

 

[Imperator]

I agree and the recent Podcast on Football Finance involving Tom Lawrence was an eye opener. He clearly said that the management team were under no pressure. Just to comment on something the previous poster said, it isn't a case of "prettying " up Roots Hall, in many areas it is a case of making it safe.

Where can I listen to this podcast?

 

[Cricko]

Where can I listen to this podcast?

 

[Thundersley Blue]

Where can I listen to this podcast?

Within the Thread "The Price of Football" Last post on that was 3rd August and at the moment is on Page 6. The other contributor was Liam from the Fanzine. A good listen.

 

[Carl]

Hate to say it but having seen football from the other side, financially it is screwed. The figures I hear other fans talking about are unrealistic without proper investment - as the sponsorship revenue isn’t there. And wages etc are likely a lot lower than you imagine. Most we paid for a player at NLS was £400 / week, however, teams in the step below were paying £1k.

The brutal reality is that it’ll take a few insolvencies for any real regulation to happen. Regulation isn’t better fit and proper tests - as that just certifies you haven’t been bankrupt, not that you have the means to invest. Instead, something along the lines of wage caps, Premier League subsidies, or enforced part time status below a certain level.

At current wage levels, I don’t believe L2 should be full time from a financial perspective, let alone NL. Yet some teams in Step 3 are full time.

Here’s something that may put it into perspective. I worked bloody hard to make my club sustainable at NLS when I was in football. Gate receipts pretty much only paid the officials, video operator for what was BT Sport, and the 4 or so casual employees we had - the rest of the club were volunteers. Bar receipts paid for wages. And sponsors / season tickets paid for the summer, because costs still exist. Paying for away day coaches, costs of postponements etc… we made it work. But it is a lot tighter than anyone would imagine.

Best thing we as fans can do? Buy a cuppa / pint, not moan too much when ticket prices go up, and not expect too much. I understand the additional costs from a playing budget for promotion is half a mil. At top end NL rates, that’s 10 shirt sponsors I’d guess… at NLS bottom end, that’s 100 shirt sponsors. Just puts it into context a little.

 

[Thundersley Blue]

Where have COSU stated any requirement to get out of this division this season? I wish people would get a grip and be thankful for what we have. Rock bottom is behind us, the hill is steep but we’ve made a start.

I agree with you. The playing side is only a part of what needs to be done. Just a small example, the medical facilities clearly need upgrading. Not great if a player has to wait over a week for a scan on a hamstring injury. Had the takeover taken place earlier, then we would be in a slightly better place. Twenty plus years of poor ownership can't be rectified overnight.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

Twenty plus years of poor ownership can't be rectified overnight.

This, 100%