Speak English or lose benefits

[Tangled up in Blue]

I can only agree with the the anoymous EU diplomat quoted in the article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...or-lose-benefits-warns-Iain-Duncan-Smith.html

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

I can only agree with the the anoymous EU diplomat quoted in the article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...or-lose-benefits-warns-Iain-Duncan-Smith.html

The quoted toadie suggests the UK will need lots of lawyers if this happens! That shows where the EU priorities are; not doing anything real about the issues BUT wanting more bureaucrats to "take" more money. IDS's idea doesn't have much to make it worthy of promoting and it's main thrust is the same as other citizen skills of which language is a key driver.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

The quoted toadie suggests the UK will need lots of lawyers if this happens! That shows where the EU priorities are; not doing anything real about the issues BUT wanting more bureaucrats to "take" more money. IDS's idea doesn't have much to make it worthy of promoting and it's main thrust is the same as other citizen skills of which language is a key driver.

The point is surely that IDS's "idea" is illegal under current EU law?

“Discriminating against people on the basis of language would be illegal".

The European Commission is, in any case,"already suing Britain for requiring European Union immigrants to pass a test it claims is unlawful before they can claim benefits."

 

[OldBlueLady]

I agree with the principle of this, in whichever country you are residing and seeking employment benefits, not just the UK. You should be making a clear effort to learn the language which will obviously enhance your prospects of finding employment, otherwise you're going to be severely restricting the number of opportunities that would be available to you.

Pretty basic I would have thought.

 

[Beefy]

Would that apply to the hoards of Brits sunning themselves in Spain (not Barna I assume) without a dozen words of Spanish between them?

 

[OldBlueLady]

Would that apply to the hoards of Brits sunning themselves in Spain (not Barna I assume) without a dozen words of Spanish between them?

Yes in my mind it should, Greece, Italy anywhere....only exception is if they are independent and not seeking any kind of benefit...not sure how it works with retired people who have moved abroad - do they get any benefit entitlement from their resident country?

 

[BrettieAngell]

yawn, another gimmick.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Would that apply to the hoards of Brits sunning themselves in Spain (not Barna I assume) without a dozen words of Spanish between them?

As the EU diplomat said in the article:-“Would Britain be happy if pensioners in Spain or expatriates in France were asked to complete a language test before accessing the services to which they are entitled?”

For the record, I'm a self-employed freelance, (these days),and pay over 250 euros each month into the system,irrespective of my earnings.

Yes in my mind it should, Greece, Italy anywhere....only exception is if they are independent and not seeking any kind of benefit...not sure how it works with retired people who have moved abroad - do they get any benefit entitlement from their resident country?

As I understand it,retired British people abroad are currently able to claim special needs payments-eg the winter heating allowance (though this is being hotly contested by the UK government at the moment).

Better ask Yogi for full details.:winking:

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

Would that apply to the hoards of Brits sunning themselves in Spain (not Barna I assume) without a dozen words of Spanish between them?

Don't think Spain has a massive problem with elderly Brits milking the state for all it's worth do you?
A lot of us are utterly fuc*ed off with how things are going - if that makes me sound a racist then to fuc*ing bad.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Don't think Spain has a massive problem with elderly Brits milking the state for all it's worth do you?
A lot of us are utterly fuc*ed off with how things are going - if that makes me sound a racist then to fuc*ing bad.

All the evidence points to the fact that immigrants contribute much more than they take out of Britain (as they do elsewhere).

This is just a cheap Tory ploy to appease potential UKIP voters (which can't possibly work since it's illegal).

Can't you see that?

 

[Swiss Tony]

Would that apply to the hoards of Brits sunning themselves in Spain (not Barna I assume) without a dozen words of Spanish between them?

Rather a big generalisiation there Beefy besides I would hazard a guess that a big percentage of brits in Spain are retired or have their own buisnesses and do not seek employment in Spain unlike the hoards of ponces now coming here.

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

All the evidence points to the fact that immigrants contribute much more than they take out of Britain (as they do elsewhere).

This is just a cheap Tory ploy to appease potential UKIP voters (which can't possibly work since it's illegal).

Can't you see that?

Yes I can. Your not the only one who has ever read a broad sheet.
Maybe the point is that a lot of people think there are too many immigrants already here.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

All the evidence points to the fact that immigrants contribute much more than they take out of Britain (as they do elsewhere).

This is just a cheap Tory ploy to appease potential UKIP voters (which can't possibly work since it's illegal).

Can't you see that?

Are you sure that ALL the evidence suggests that! maybe some does and some doesn't...............or would that be a balanced view?

 

[Lord Football]

I'd get involved in this, use some facts, provide some statistics and prove of a few people wrong.

But I wont.

Last time I did that I was called pompus for actually being able to back up an argument with facts!

So, I'll keep it dead simple. Immigrants being more into the economy than they take out. This is just Cameron appeasing the Little Inglunders and petty racists who he thinks will vote UKIP at the next election, but is safe in the knowledge what he seeks to do is illegal.

The one thing that does make me thing "hmm" is that sooner or later Europe just may tell us to sling our hook. And then we really would be in the doo doo.

 

[steveo]

I'd get involved in this, use some facts, provide some statistics and prove of a few people wrong.

Do you honestly think people who don't speak English will be good for our country then?

I'm not against foreigners coming here to work and if they have already bothered to learn English it shows they are serious about what they are dong. If I went to live in another country I would learn the native language first.

Just clarify this bit please. and thanks for keeping it simple:

So, I'll keep it dead simple. Immigrants being more into the economy than they take out.

So an immigrant turns up here, doesn't speak the language, brings his family and receive benefits. What exactly is he contributing to the economy?

 

[londonblue]

I'm not against foreigners coming here to work and if they have already bothered to learn English it shows they are serious about what they are dong. If I went to live in another country I would learn the native language first.

Good for you. There are plenty of Brits that don't. I have friends that live in various European countries (including Bulgaria - no idea why, but hey!) and all of them learnt the language after settling.

So an immigrant turns up here, doesn't speak the language, brings his family and receive benefits. What exactly is he contributing to the economy?

I think the point is that when you average it all out, immigration makes a net contribution to our economy. Obviously in amongst that there will be some people that take, but the net position is a gain. It would be fantastic if it were possible to only allow people in that contribute, but given that you can't know that before hand you can't do that. You have to allow a few "bad apples" in if you want a net gain.

However, just because someone doesn't speak the language when they arrive doesn't mean they're a bad apple. It doesn't mean they won't be able to learn the language, and doesn't mean they won't be able to contribute in future.

I remember a Chinese kid I went to school with. He turned up in this country and could hardly string a sentence together. (Some would argue he still can't!) He was streamed at school in the lowest class, but by the time we did our O Levels (it was that long ago) he did really well in the sciences. He took Maths, Physics and Chemistry A Levels, got 3 Bs, and has since done a degree in electronics, and masters in electronics, and an MBA, and works for Hewlett Packard. His brothers and sisters are equally talented in other areas, but he and his parents could hardly speak a word of English when they arrived.

The point is that you simply can't know who is going to contribute and who isn't.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

HEALTH AND BENEFIT TOURISTS STEALING OUR SALE BARGAINS!
After having profited from our free medical care and their pockets stuffed with newly drawn benefits, this vermin, that is invading our shores, is even getting in before the Brits at the Boxing Day Sales. We can't even get a look in, those foreigners are buying up everything in front of them in ...............they're bleeding us dry. The Bulgarians, Albanians and Roumanians, who are due to arrive in their droves next week, better hurry up or else there just won't be anything left.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

HEALTH AND BENEFIT TOURISTS STEALING OUR SALE BARGAINS!
After having profited from our free medical care and their pockets stuffed with newly drawn benefits, this vermin, that is invading our shores, is even getting in before the Brits at the Boxing Day Sales. We can't even get a look in, those foreigners are buying up everything in front of them in ...............they're bleeding us dry. The Bulgarians, Albanians and Roumanians, who are due to arrive in their droves next week, better hurry up or else there just won't be anything left.

Check out the cover of the current Private Eye on a similar theme.Regaling Santa with "Bloody North Polish" and similar comments.:smiles:

http://www.private-eye.co.uk/

 

[steveo]

Good for you.
I think the point is that when you average it all out, immigration makes a net contribution to our economy. Obviously in amongst that there will be some people that take, but the net position is a gain.

So let the ones who contribute stay and kick out then ponces.

 

[OldBlueLady]

So let the ones who contribute stay and kick out then ponces.

I have an issue with that in that in some cases, there are some very hard working breadwinners in immigrant families who do make the effort to learn the language, however, their family members who often join them, don't. Where do you draw the line?

I firmly believe that anyone who wishes to go and settle in a country where your native tongue is not the language of the country, then you should make a conscious effort to learn some, even if it's just basics. And that goes for Brits abroad too.

A lot of immigrants are incredibly hard working, it's really unfair to tar everyone with the same brush. The Government just needs to make it much harder for those not wanting to contribute, to claim benefits, especially to the detriment of British born people (of whichever race). Stop rewarding people for doing nothing, and that's primarily aimed at young girls popping out babies to get accommodation! The whole ethos is wrong, encourage everyone to put something in before they get something out - and that's not meant to sound lewd!