Echo News Shrimpers boss Maher addresses goal concern after away draw

[TheSouthendUnitedRunner]

I didn't say primary! I said it's definitely considered before signing and if it's not a strength they've got then I don't think they'd be signed, rather than focusing on their attacking abilities. I would guess it would be possible to sign a player that's more adept at scoring goals but less defensively minded and if we did look at those, maybe we'd score more.

Sorry, I rarely post anymore, but this caught my eye.

I’m not sure Pearce, Dallas or Kelly (plus a few others I’m not allowed to mention) wouldn’t have been signed because they can’t head a set piece away.

Having an aerial presence, in both boxes, is a huge plus, however to suggest we wouldn’t sign a striker because they can’t do the defensive side of the game (in terms of defending our box at set pieces) is wide of the mark. Walker, Waldron & Kendall aren’t exactly superb headers of the ball in our own box…(whether you, or any other poster) rate them is irrelevant as it contradicts the point you’ve been making.

 

[Avl1983]

Sorry, I rarely post anymore, but this caught my eye.

I’m not sure Pearce, Dallas or Kelly (plus a few others I’m not allowed to mention) wouldn’t have been signed because they can’t head a set piece away.

Having an aerial presence, in both boxes, is a huge plus, however to suggest we wouldn’t sign a striker because they can’t do the defensive side of the game (in terms of defending our box at set pieces) is wide of the mark. Walker, Waldron & Kendall aren’t exactly superb headers of the ball in our own box…(whether you, or any other poster) rate them is irrelevant as it contradicts the point you’ve been making.

Did I say I don't rate them? You're making assumptions here. There are different types of forwards aren't there and the target men such as Bonne or Hopper are the ones I was mainly referring to. I don't dislike them at all, I was just putting across an opinion. If Pearce was signed, would we have signed Kendall? Who knows.
But I think Maher likes forwards who can also defend and I definitely think it goes into his thinking. Whereas if we sign a centre back it's not really as important which I think sums up the mentality of the team he wishes to create.

For the record I haven't even criticised it, just given an opinion but looks as though that's not allowed again...

 

[TheSouthendUnitedRunner]

Did I say I don't rate them? You're making assumptions here. There are different types of forwards aren't there and the target men such as Bonne or Hopper are the ones I was mainly referring to. I don't dislike them at all, I was just putting across an opinion. If Pearce was signed, would we have signed Kendall? Who knows.
But I think Maher likes forwards who can also defend and I definitely think it goes into his thinking. Whereas if we sign a centre back it's not really as important which I think sums up the mentality of the team he wishes to create.

For the record I haven't even criticised it, just given an opinion but looks as though that's not allowed again...

You’ve missed the point.

I fully expect people to come out slagging off Kendall, Walker & Waldron but I was getting it in there first. Whether you rate them or not (as many appear not too) none of them were chosen over other forwards because they could head a set piece away as opposed to scoring a goal.

If Pearce had signed, we probably wouldn’t have signed Kendall, but that’s at two different stages of the season, so we’d never know.

 

[Avl1983]

I'm not slagging them off though, not at all. Haven't passed judgement on them!

I'm not missing your point, I'm not sure you've understood mine though.

If there was a choice between two target men, one scores more goals and one scores less goals but is more effective in defence, in my opinion, Maher would go for the one who could defend as well - That's all I've said.

 

[Supershrimper]

Sorry, I rarely post anymore, but this caught my eye.

I’m not sure Pearce, Dallas or Kelly (plus a few others I’m not allowed to mention) wouldn’t have been signed because they can’t head a set piece away.

Having an aerial presence, in both boxes, is a huge plus, however to suggest we wouldn’t sign a striker because they can’t do the defensive side of the game (in terms of defending our box at set pieces) is wide of the mark. Walker, Waldron & Kendall aren’t exactly superb headers of the ball in our own box…(whether you, or any other poster) rate them is irrelevant as it contradicts the point you’ve been making.

More's the pity

 

[TheSouthendUnitedRunner]

I'm not slagging them off though, not at all. Haven't passed judgement on them!

I'm not missing your point, I'm not sure you've understood mine though.

If there was a choice between two target men, one scores more goals and one scores less goals but is more effective in defence, in my opinion, Maher would go for the one who could defend as well - That's all I've said.

I didn’t say you had.

Now I see why I don’t post much anymore. I’ll reply to this then I’m done.

After we lost Cards, Kev was offered players from different agents, which happens at every club (more so in non-league with the lack of transfer window). We turned down numerous of them, some were target man type strikers. One, who I think may have worked out, but didn’t realise how poor his goal scoring record was until I looked into it after being told about him. He is a big, strong lad, and I think would have been a threat in both boxes. Kev didn’t want him, didn’t think he’d get the goals we needed, despite his presence in both boxes.

I won’t name his name, but he has proven Kev right in his goalscoring “exploits” this season. As it turns out, he would have had a similar strike rate to some of our strikers here, and worse compared to some too.

 

[NZamba Legend]

If there was a choice between two target men, one scores more goals and one scores less goals but is more effective in defence, in my opinion, Maher would go for the one who could defend as well - That's all I've said.

The jist of what you’re saying is that Maher prioritises defensive capabilities in choosing defenders and forwards. I get that point and there’s no doubt that Kev values this side of the game and in my opinion is right to do so. (Personally I prefer to watch a dominant, efficient and well executed 2-0 victory over a 4-3 chaos-fest. ) However, I think you’re overstating the point a little because I think evidence shows that Kev does consider attacking threat when signing defenders and doesn’t always prioritise the defensive when signing strikers. I think this pragmatic approach is fine and will ultimately deliver a well balanced squad but I guess you find it too cautious. As you say, differences of opinion

 

[Avl1983]

The jist of what you’re saying is that Maher prioritises defensive capabilities in choosing defenders and forwards. I get that point and there’s no doubt that Kev values this side of the game and in my opinion is right to do so. (Personally I prefer to watch a dominant, efficient and well executed 2-0 victory over a 4-3 chaos-fest. ) However, I think you’re overstating the point a little because I think evidence shows that Kev does consider attacking threat when signing defenders and doesn’t always prioritise the defensive when signing strikers. I think this pragmatic approach is fine and will ultimately deliver a well balanced squad but I guess you find it too cautious. As you say, differences of opinion

I can respect your opinion, I just feel this approach does hinder our team from scoring and that’s what I was trying to say basically. Rightly or wrongly.

 

[tallboyblue]

Gone backwards since we lost Pebble. We need a forward who is big strong and can run at defenders. Doesn’t have to be a world beater just someone who can cause a bit of havoc.

 

[Grayson]

After we lost Cards, Kev was offered players from different agents, which happens at every club (more so in non-league with the lack of transfer window). We turned down numerous of them, some were target man type strikers. One, who I think may have worked out, but didn’t realise how poor his goal scoring record was until I looked into it after being told about him. He is a big, strong lad, and I think would have been a threat in both boxes. Kev didn’t want him, didn’t think he’d get the goals we needed, despite his presence in both boxes. I won’t name his name, but he has proven Kev right in his goalscoring “exploits” this season. As it turns out, he would have had a similar strike rate to some of our strikers here, and worse compared to some too.

I know you said you won't name names but sounds like Joe Quigley, which is another 'name' at this level who has 1 or 2 seasons being good and most of them not so much.

Finding a striker who clicks and scores lots of goals really isn't as easy as people on here make out.

 

[fbm]

Surely you dont think wanting to be an EFL team is an unrealistic expectation?

No, not at all. But just because we are called Southend United and are one of the biggest teams in the NL, we do not have a divine right to win games, score goals, get promoted, etc. We have predominantly players from levels below where we are. They are doing their best, the coaches are doing their best. A change at the top will just be even more unsettling.

Last year Kev said after many matches that he couldn't stress what an achievement it was for that group of players to do what they did. The siege mentality united everyone and I think it's fair to say they played above themselves.

This year there have been some notable changes and some players - Miley, Bridge and Husin are just 3 that come to mind - simply haven't performed to the same level.

And yet we are still in with a shout of the play offs, plenty of points still to play for and we have lost one league game in the last ten.

For God's sake everyone get off the managements and players backs and let's see where we end up.

 

[Cricko]

No, not at all. But just because we are called Southend United and are one of the biggest teams in the NL, we do not have a divine right to win games, score goals, get promoted, etc. We have predominantly players from levels below where we are. They are doing their best, the coaches are doing their best. A change at the top will just be even more unsettling.

Last year Kev said after many matches that he couldn't stress what an achievement it was for that group of players to do what they did. The siege mentality united everyone and I think it's fair to say they played above themselves.

This year there have been some notable changes and some players - Miley, Bridge and Husin are just 3 that come to mind - simply haven't performed to the same level.

And yet we are still in with a shout of the play offs, plenty of points still to play for and we have lost one league game in the last ten.

For God's sake everyone get off the managements and players backs and let's see where we end up.

Whilst i agree with your points Mark, without discussions on relevant topics we might as well turn the forums off. You can't expect people to keep silent and just "see where we end up". It's all about the bits inbetween.

 

[rigsby]

But he's not a defender apparently? And when we signed GSM we didn't sign him looking at his goal scoring ability, we signed him for his other attributes, I think he scored something like 5 goals overall before we signed him so that wasn't a consideration at the time.
Just because GSM has scored goals doesn't mean this was considered before we signed him - because it just wasn't. And it isn't when we sign our other defenders in my opinion.

So what your really saying is credit to Kev. For the coaching and tactics that have allowed GSM to be the most successful attacking defender in world football.......Or have I misread your post?

 

[jarvisyeh]

On the flip side, when we sign defenders I don't think much is looked at from an attacking perspective, it's kind of like an added bonus if they score a goal but the attackers like the ones mentioned above are specifically scouted with their defensive qualities being important to us I think, which shows you what mentality he wants to play with.

People have mentioned GSM but I'm pretty sure Ollie Kensdale and James Golding were defenders brought in with a consideration for how they bring the ball forward and start attacks, so your point kind of falls flat here.

 

[Avl1983]

People have mentioned GSM but I'm pretty sure Ollie Kensdale and James Golding were defenders brought in with a consideration for how they bring the ball forward and start attacks, so your point kind of falls flat here.

I disagree, I believe they were signed knowing they can bring the ball forward, not to create chances or start attacks, those runs very rarely get past the half way line. So I don't think it falls flat at all.

 

[Avl1983]

So what your really saying is credit to Kev. For the coaching and tactics that have allowed GSM to be the most successful attacking defender in world football.......Or have I misread your post?

I'm not against giving Kev credit, if he's done good things then I'll say so.

Doesn't mean he was signed or scouted as a goalscorer. GSM has done fantastically in front of goal, not so much performance wise recently, even by his own admission, but we'd be fighting relegation without his goals.

I'm not sure you've misread my post, rather you're trying to use it to say how amazing you think Maher is, as usual. We get it, you've said so numerous times. I hope you turn out to be correct.

 

[Gt Yarmouth Shrimper]

How about rather than bringing both back to defend leaving 1 up.

I have been 'banging on'about this for ages.

Bonne stayed up on Saturday and, hey presto, we scored from it.

 

[kentblues]

Poor old Kev, damned if you do, damned if you don't. If I was you mate, I'd refuse to give Chris Phillips any further copy for the Echo. That way you can be criticised for not saying anything.

Quite- the whinging and whining from some is becoming very tedious. He must have the skin of a Rhino.

Any chance to moan and groan is leapt upon with glee…

We already have a manager out thread running it seems forever, do we need to pollute other threads as well? Can threads be colour coded in some way so we identify positive threads that aren’t (yet at least) hijacked by those wanting the manager and others out of work?

 

[Cricko]

We are done with this thread The Echo started as we already have a Maher one to discuss things.