Ron Martin

[united we stand]

lets be honest here, the below has all been said before, but is relevant to this thread, getting in freddie was not genius , it was common sense

• He wants to be here
• he has failed at his last two clubs
• We know what he can do at this level
• I am guessing that he is costing very little, if not then I would ask why this wasn't sorted out a kit earlier. More likely it was last minute as any money we are paying is better than Coventry getting sod all
• Having Freddie puts the gates up- more money for the club

so thank you Ron for using common sense

 

[Shrimp and two veg]

One signing won't appease my good nature, not after spending 2yrs of his time forcing out every squad player we had and ruining a very good management duo for this club and taking us to the brink of extinction and making our club a laughing stock in football circles and... oh, i'm getting upset again damnit.

 

[fbm]

I see him more as someone using what he can to protect his family's legacy.

Agreed. And as long as that is his aim, then we will be the benefactors of that as well.

 

[Thorpe Groyney]

You have to hand it to Ron when, in spite of everything, he still manages to somehow garner credit for the return of a popular player, when it was actually someone else's actions behind the scenes that made the loan move possible.

 

[Crowstone Crevette]

sorry kent shrimper.
understood very little of your last post. please proof read before sending next time.:unsure:

 

[Tampa Blue]

Err no - it's all about the profit from FF after which he will hopefully walk away

 

[Kent Shrimper]

sorry kent shrimper.
understood very little of your last post. please proof read before sending next time.:unsure:

I've re read it and it's fine.

However just for you, I'm asking the same question I have for the past 6 months, where is all the money coming from to have a squad the size we have and what implications will it bring. Ron is after 1 thing and 1 thing alone (FF) but has continued to gamble with our club to get there. Why would I congratulate the man that has lied to us, treated us like idiots and is always looking for an angle to be the hero??

Build the stadium, take your money but make sure our football club is self sufficient!

 

[Gt Yarmouth Shrimper]

*Ties fingers up and throws Laptop away*

As long as it stops you being so condescending to others, I'm all for that action. Good man.

One signing won't appease my good nature, not after spending 2yrs of his time forcing out every squad player we had and ruining a very good management duo for this club and taking us to the brink of extinction and making our club a laughing stock in football circles and... oh, i'm getting upset again damnit.

Where have you heard or read that. All I ever saw during our bad period was support and empathy from the football community.

I've re read it and it's fine.

However just for you, I'm asking the same question I have for the past 6 months, where is all the money coming from to have a squad the size we have and what implications will it bring. Ron is after 1 thing and 1 thing alone (FF) but has continued to gamble with our club to get there. Why would I congratulate the man that has lied to us, treated us like idiots and is always looking for an angle to be the hero??

Build the stadium, take your money but make sure our football club is self sufficient!

I do not know of any progressive football clubs that are though. We all want better things for our club and I'll bet you that, if in 10 years time we finish 3rd in the premier league, the majority of supporters will demand we splash the cash to ensure we win it the next season.

 

[Jam_Man]

I've re read it and it's fine.

However just for you, I'm asking the same question I have for the past 6 months, where is all the money coming from to have a squad the size we have and what implications will it bring. Ron is after 1 thing and 1 thing alone (FF) but has continued to gamble with our club to get there. Why would I congratulate the man that has lied to us, treated us like idiots and is always looking for an angle to be the hero??

Build the stadium, take your money but make sure our football club is self sufficient!

The money problems stopped when we got 5 million from Sainsburys. 3.5m of it was spent on the tax bills etc but the rest was to run the club. Im sure this had the impact of stabilising us but it obviously was a one of fix and how we will be financed in the future is open to question.

Ron Martin was never the cartoon villain he was painted to be, he never was evil out to ruin us intentionally he just didnt have the capability to deliver what he promised and when things went wrong acted in desperate ways to keep us going. Many of these actions, the actions of a desperate man were not savoury to say the least.

He deserves credit for not putting us into admin, and for getting us to where we are now, but thats only because he had no choice and not because he was a gallant saviour.

I agree totally that bringing one player in on loan does not balance everything that has happened over the past few years.

We still have no idea how the stadium will benefit the football club, only Rons assurances which no longer count for anything.

We still dont even know when the stadium will start, and if it will even be completed. Its very likely we will be playing in some god awful 3 sided embarrassment for years.

If Ron Martin wants to come out of this with any credit he will finish the stadium and leave the club with a secure financial backing. Until then nothing he can do will mean anything, certainly not one loan signing, or a period of stability funded by Sainsbury.

 

[Wise Head]

Over 12 years ago Ron Martin took over a Division 2 club which owned it's own stadium and training ground (worth £8 million+ at the time) and had a £4 million overdraft/outstanding loans, so positive asset value of £4 million+. At present we are still in Division 2 do not own our stadium or training ground (having to technically pay just under £500k a year in rent) and have debts ofaround £10 million. In my simplistic view his tenure so far has been a complete disaster for the club. When he leaves, having hopefully built a new stadium, it will be interesting to see how the club is set up. The omens do not look good. It appears that the club will not own the new ground and will be subject to the same rediculous rent situation as at Roots Hall, the ground will probably be built without a main stand which will be bizarre and I think a first in football, and the level of the debt will be completely up to Ron as there is no obligation on him to give any of the profits on the new stadium move to the club WHICH IS WHY HE MOVED THE ASSETS OUT OF THE FOOTBALL CLUB IN THE FIRST PLACE.

 

[Jam_Man]

Over 12 years ago Ron Martin took over a Division 2 club which owned it's own stadium and training ground (worth £8 million+ at the time) and had a £4 million overdraft/outstanding loans, so positive asset value of £4 million+. At present we are still in Division 2 do not own our stadium or training ground (having to technically pay just under £500k a year in rent) and have debts ofaround £10 million. In my simplistic view his tenure so far has been a complete disaster for the club. When he leaves, having hopefully built a new stadium, it will be interesting to see how the club is set up. The omens do not look good. It appears that the club will not own the new ground and will be subject to the same rediculous rent situation as at Roots Hall, the ground will probably be built without a main stand which will be bizarre and I think a first in football, and the level of the debt will be completely up to Ron as there is no obligation on him to give any of the profits on the new stadium move to the club WHICH IS WHY HE MOVED THE ASSETS OUT OF THE FOOTBALL CLUB IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Unfortunately the club loses money and always has, it was inevitable that the ground would be sold at some point unless we had an owner that wanted to bankroll the club out of love of football only, sadly that never happened.

Not owning the ground is not unusual and not a disaster on its own.

However as you point out, the assets have been moved out of the football club, yet the football club has accumulated massive debts now.

How this is resolved and whether there is any guarantee of how the new stadium will service these debts and ultimately fund the club in the future will be the indicator of whether Ron Martin was successful.

The stadium will never be given to the club, it will have to be bought, and as the football club doesnt make any money I cant see how that will happen.

 

[devonexile]

The money problems stopped when we got 5 million from Sainsburys. 3.5m of it was spent on the tax bills etc but the rest was to run the club. Im sure this had the impact of stabilising us but it obviously was a one of fix and how we will be financed in the future is open to question.

Ron Martin was never the cartoon villain he was painted to be, he never was evil out to ruin us intentionally he just didnt have the capability to deliver what he promised and when things went wrong acted in desperate ways to keep us going. Many of these actions, the actions of a desperate man were not savoury to say the least.

He deserves credit for not putting us into admin, and for getting us to where we are now, but thats only because he had no choice and not because he was a gallant saviour.

I agree totally that bringing one player in on loan does not balance everything that has happened over the past few years.

We still have no idea how the stadium will benefit the football club, only Rons assurances which no longer count for anything.

We still dont even know when the stadium will start, and if it will even be completed. Its very likely we will be playing in some god awful 3 sided embarrassment for years.

If Ron Martin wants to come out of this with any credit he will finish the stadium and leave the club with a secure financial backing. Until then nothing he can do will mean anything, certainly not one loan signing, or a period of stability funded by Sainsbury.

And those highlighted quotes from Jam Man sum up the crux of the problem. I can find no reason to congragulate Martin for anything.

 

[Firestorm]

Over 12 years ago Ron Martin took over a Division 2 club which owned it's own stadium and training ground (worth £8 million+ at the time) and had a £4 million overdraft/outstanding loans, so positive asset value of £4 million+. At present we are still in Division 2 do not own our stadium or training ground (having to technically pay just under £500k a year in rent) and have debts ofaround £10 million. In my simplistic view his tenure so far has been a complete disaster for the club. When he leaves, having hopefully built a new stadium, it will be interesting to see how the club is set up. The omens do not look good. It appears that the club will not own the new ground and will be subject to the same rediculous rent situation as at Roots Hall, the ground will probably be built without a main stand which will be bizarre and I think a first in football, and the level of the debt will be completely up to Ron as there is no obligation on him to give any of the profits on the new stadium move to the club WHICH IS WHY HE MOVED THE ASSETS OUT OF THE FOOTBALL CLUB IN THE FIRST PLACE.

I may have mentioned this before :winking: but in the two years prior to VJ selling the club , he artificially inflated the asset value to A) make the club appear profitable and B) to make it more attractive to a buyer.

Also RM was only 50% of the company which took over from VJ , the other 50% decided they could not wait for their profit any longer and sold out to RM (Liquidating the club was their other option) some years ago.

As for RH being an asset of the club, perhaps we should look at who was responsible for making the ground an asset of the club and then borrowing so heavily against it that the only option left was to sell to a property developer, rather than blaming the businessman who took the resultant business opportunity ?

 

[Wise Head]

I may have mentioned this before :winking: but in the two years prior to VJ selling the club , he artificially inflated the asset value to A) make the club appear profitable and B) to make it more attractive to a buyer.

Also RM was only 50% of the company which took over from VJ , the other 50% decided they could not wait for their profit any longer and sold out to RM (Liquidating the club was their other option) some years ago.

As for RH being an asset of the club, perhaps we should look at who was responsible for making the ground an asset of the club and then borrowing so heavily against it that the only option left was to sell to a property developer, rather than blaming the businessman who took the resultant business opportunity ?

I appreciate that VJ did re-value the assets prior to selling but I still believe the valuation of RH and the training ground were still around £8 million. The rent charged in exchange for taking over the overdraft was over 10% on £4 million of debt and suggested a higher value without even taking into account the potential opportunity for development. Also I am not convinced all of the £4 million was put in initially as the overdraft was soon up to £1.5 million a year or so later. The sale had a 10% profit share on any move to the new ground, but this was soon overtaken by the 20% per annum interest charged on non payment of rent. The sale of the stadium & training ground out from the club was a textbook asset strip under the guise of helping the club. The money that was given for the sale could have just been injected directly into the club without selling the assets, as is often the case.

I blame Vic Jobson for developing the south bank which meant we needed to move and for poor running of the club. Before him we had Anton Johnson, enough said. As for Ron Martin he has asset stripped and we have a very uncertain future off the field. The biggest mugs were the supporters who mistakenly thought that giving the ground to the club meant that a future owner would have the integrity to honour their gift - they obvious hadn't dreamt that the likes of Ron Martin and some other owners of football clubs would in the future put their own interests above the club they owned.

 

[Jam_Man]

I appreciate that VJ did re-value the assets prior to selling but I still believe the valuation of RH and the training ground were still around £8 million. The rent charged in exchange for taking over the overdraft was over 10% on £4 million of debt and suggested a higher value without even taking into account the potential opportunity for development. Also I am not convinced all of the £4 million was put in initially as the overdraft was soon up to £1.5 million a year or so later. The sale had a 10% profit share on any move to the new ground, but this was soon overtaken by the 20% per annum interest charged on non payment of rent. The sale of the stadium & training ground out from the club was a textbook asset strip under the guise of helping the club. The money that was given for the sale could have just been injected directly into the club without selling the assets, as is often the case.

I blame Vic Jobson for developing the south bank which meant we needed to move and for poor running of the club. Before him we had Anton Johnson, enough said. As for Ron Martin he has asset stripped and we have a very uncertain future off the field. The biggest mugs were the supporters who mistakenly thought that giving the ground to the club meant that a future owner would have the integrity to honour their gift - they obvious hadn't dreamt that the likes of Ron Martin and some other owners of football clubs would in the future put their own interests above the club they owned.

The problem is that without the money to be made from redevelopment Ron Martin and co wouldnt ever have got involved and love him (lol) or hate him they have kept the club going in all that time at a loss. They certainly wouldnt have done so if they couldnt turn that loss into profit at some point.

It would be great to have an owner like Col U's Cowling who just bankrolls them for the love of it (although they dont own their own stadium either) but there arent many who would do it long term for a club like ours and the wheels would come off at some point.

 

[Csboy]

The only thing I credit Ron Martin with is getting us relegated 2 years ago and making Tilson and Brush scapegoats. Like so many Southend fans I will never forgive him for that.

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

Yeah we win 4 nil, hero returns and Roots Hall roars once more - time for Ron bashing - ZZZzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[Fairport]

The only thing I credit Ron Martin with is getting us relegated 2 years ago and making Tilson and Brush scapegoats. Like so many Southend fans I will never forgive him for that.

Exactly, this is how very many of us feel.

 

[jimmyshrimp]

Maybe it's time we got over the past and moved on.

 

[blue79]

jimmyshrimp I don't think your point will be valid if we don't go up. Failure to get up and there will be scapegoats and Ron will be one of the first to point the finger at. Freddy coming in has created a feelgood factor which is great but it will only last if promotion happens. Not reaching League 1 then the atmosphere on here will soon change.