Ron in court.

[Robert Baldwin]

I

On Tuesday afternoon my wife paid our cleaner in cash ie straight in her pocket so no GST (Australian equivalent of VAT) paid on the transaction. Does that make us 'Fraudsters'? Is everything always so black and white?
If Ron and Geoff have committed a crimes no doubt the law of the land will deal with him in due course. That is what it is there for.
Ron has many faults but I would doubt he is evil or wholly bad.
In the meantime what reputation he had has been further tarnished by his recent troubles. Unlike if you ot I had been charged with similar offences because of his high profile (thanks to his association with SUFC) his court appearance was the subject of widespread publicity. This would have caused much anguish to people close to him
He is probably a driven ambitious man and this I suspect the crime he has been charged with was motivated by his drive and ambition.
A few hundred years ago perhaps Shakespeare would have written a play about him.
In 2021 we have given up on nuance and on Shrimperzone he is vilified by some as being some kind of especially reprehensible human being.
In a world populated by serial killers and sex offenders, where incest occurs, where organised crime is rife in all corners of the globe etc cheating on your tax seems to me to be on the low scale of anti social behaviour.
Weird.

VAT is a very complex area, this will not be a clear cut case. Ron will have taken advice and this will be a battle of the Barristers. Ron’s secured our future and right now he needs our support.

 

[Dave Smiths Love Child]

You speak for yourself. I am Mary Poppins. Practicality perfect in every way.

Because of you I have diabetes , A spoonful of bloody sugar grrrrrrr

 

[bluesfansince1952]

I think the weirdest thing is your post. Because there are sex offenders, we should not be concerned that our chairman is potentially going to prison for fraud? Its a serious offence and will carry a serious penalty if found guilty. Evading tax deprives the state of the money it needs to provide basic services. £5mil may not be a lot to the treasury but thats hardly the point....

I have obviously expressed myself badly.
You have every right to be concerned that the chairman has been charged with a serious offence, and, may face imprisonment. I share that concern.
I am NOT saying because others commit crimes his transgressions should be ignored.
I am trying to say even if convicted I do not think it makes him a reprehensible human being whereas I would say that about those people who commit the crimes I mentioned in my message
He has been investigated and now charged and he must face the consequences.
You may disagree but I think with many on here a sense of proportion has been missing.

 

[harveyoe]

I have obviously expressed myself badly.
You have every right to be concerned that the chairman has been charged with a serious offence, and, may face imprisonment. I share that concern.
I am NOT saying because others commit crimes his transgressions should be ignored.
I am trying to say even if convicted I do not think it makes him a reprehensible human being whereas I would say that about those people who commit the crimes I mentioned in my message
He has been investigated and now charged and he must face the consequences.
You may disagree but I think with many on here a sense of proportion has been missing.

Of course I don't see Ron as a reprehensible human being, but I think we can probably accept that he is no choirboy either.

If by sense of proportion you mean comparing the severity of different types of offences and deciding which ones are the most severe, I really don't see how this would be possible.

Ron has been charged with offences which fall under the heading of "Cheating the Public Purse". This may appear to some, on a quick glance, to be a victimless crime, but this is not the case. It hurts each and everyone of us.

As fans of the football club it has the potential to hurt us more than most.

Having said this, I do have some sympathy for RM and particularly his family who must be going through a terrible time just now.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Do you know him? Actually know him? I dont know how anybody can say things like this without really knowing the person.

As it happens I've never met the Chairman (though I know people who have).

Not sure that really matters anyway.As they say "actions speak louder than words."

And frankly the Chairman's actions have not only brought SUFC into disrepute but also caused us to lose our football league status for the first time in our history.

 

[pottster]

The thing is how long has Ron known about this, is this the reason he took his eye of the club , and we are where we are due to this. I suspect Ron is skint, and without saying too much and that's why he is in this position.

 

[mattytheshrimper]

VAT is a very complex area, this will not be a clear cut case. Ron will have taken advice and this will be a battle of the Barristers. Ron’s secured our future and right now he needs our support.

WOW

 

[Strykr]

As it happens I've never met the Chairman (though I know people who have).

Not sure that really matters anyway.As they say "actions speak louder than words."

And frankly the Chairman's actions have not only brought SUFC into disrepute but also caused us to lose our football league status for the first time in our history.

I agree to some extent but it isnt just ron that sees us in non legaue, i think many players and managers have to share responsibility for our constant failure..

And to have such venom for someone and their family without knowing them in real life is ridiculous imo. And i bet the venom wasnt there when we were winning div 1.

Its like people who cry when celebrities die, yeah its sad but i didnt know them so why would i cry? I just dont get it.

For me, our new setup will hopefully see us back in the EFL in 2-3 years, we will get the stadium, and ron can move on.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I agree to some extent but it isnt just ron that sees us in non legaue, i think many players and managers have to share responsibility for our constant failure..

And to have such venom for someone and their family without knowing them in real life is ridiculous imo. And i bet the venom wasnt there when we were winning div 1.

Its like people who cry when celebrities die, yeah its sad but i didnt know them so why would i cry? I just dont get it.

Who was the man who appointed the managers you're taking about?

Also what about the late payments of VAT which not only meant that SUFC couldn't sign players during various transfer windows but have lead to the Chairman's latest court appearence?


(Personally I don't do celebrity culture but as the poet said "Ask not for whom the bell tolls."

 

[Tinks]

As my dear old nan used to say "There are only two things certain in life - one is dying and the other is paying your taxes"

I have worked all my life and paid my due taxes (that I know of) so I have little sympathy for those who deliberately avoid it

 

[Strykr]

Who was the man who appointed the managers you're taking about?

Also what about the late payments of VAT which not only meant that SUFC couldn't sign players during various transfer windows but have lead to the Chairman's latest court appearence?


(Personally I don't do celebrity culture but as the poet said "Ask not for whom the bell tolls."

He appointed tilly sturrock and 1st time brown, also powell was a good appointment shafted by injuries.

Ron isnt solely to blame imo.

 

[Strykr]

As my dear old nan used to say "There are only two things certain in life - one is dying and the other is paying your taxes"

I have worked all my life and paid my due taxes (that I know of) so I have little sympathy for those who deliberately avoid it

Agree.

If ron is guilty, he has been carrying this around a long time. No excuse for it.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

He appointed tilly sturrock and 1st time brown, also powell was a good appointment shafted by injuries.

Ron isnt solely to blame imo.

Posibly not, if in recent years he hadn't become so obsessed with the FF project and rather taken his eye off the ball as far as matters on the pitch are concerned.

 

[Strykr]

Posibly not, if in recent years he hadn't become so obsessed with the FF project and rather taken his eye off the ball as far as matters on the pitch are concerned.

Irony being he should have appointed someone like tom 5 years ago and totally stepped away from from the football side of things! He is not a football man.

 

[rigsby]

Who was the man who appointed the managers you're taking about?

Also what about the late payments of VAT which not only meant that SUFC couldn't sign players during various transfer windows but have lead to the Chairman's latest court appearence?


(Personally I don't do celebrity culture but as the poet said "Ask not for whom the bell tolls."

The court appearance has nothing to do with football.

That aside a few of us Shrimpers were discussing it today and its easy to be distracted when your in the middle of internet banking. Who amongst us has not typed £4.85 and then forgot to add the 0,000 bit before hitting the send button.

 

[Chrisb]

Irony being he should have appointed someone like tom 5 years ago and totally stepped away from from the football side of things! He is not a football man.

Well, thank goodness Tom is here now as I am sure SUFC football related matters are way down on the list of Ron's priorities. At the end of the day, as a supporter, I just want to watch my team play to the best of their abilities and give their all for the club - fed up with all the sideshows.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Irony being he should have appointed someone like tom 5 years ago and totally stepped away from from the football side of things! He is not a football man.

Granted .Though friends who know him, tell me he's a SUFC fan.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

The court appearance has nothing to do with football.

That aside a few of us Shrimpers were discussing it today and its easy to be distracted when your in the middle of internet banking. Who amongst us has not typed £4.85 and then forgot to add the 0,000 bit before hitting the send button.

Football is a business (not quite) like any other.And if you regularly don't pay your VAT bill on time, it's hardly suprising that the tax man gets a bit peeved.

In answer to your second point, I imagine most of us are familiar with the principles of internet banking.I check my Spanish, French and UK accounts on a daily basis, (and I'm no accountant).

 

[bluesfansince1952]

Of course I don't see Ron as a reprehensible human being, but I think we can probably accept that he is no choirboy either.

If by sense of proportion you mean comparing the severity of different types of offences and deciding which ones are the most severe, I really don't see how this would be possible.

Ron has been charged with offences which fall under the heading of "Cheating the Public Purse". This may appear to some, on a quick glance, to be a victimless crime, but this is not the case. It hurts each and everyone of us.

As fans of the football club it has the potential to hurt us more than most.

Having said this, I do have some sympathy for RM and particularly his family who must be going through a terrible time just now.

I was not comparing offences but was comparing the people who commit offences.
I think we can agree on the fact that this, as well as the possible fall out, has the potential to threaten the Club's very existence.
That this is super serious there can be no doubt.

 

[Pak66]

If and only if Mr Martin is found guilty as charged and Hm Customs & Excise essay to extract over £5,000,000 from Mr Martins assets we would be well to heed the fact Roots Hall, the fixtures and fittings and Training ground are nothing to do with our Southend United but fully owned by Mr Martins companies.