Plans for a League 3

[stickyboy]

Your argument that you stopped supporting England because you don't like the players doesn't really hold up. Otherwise, you would have stopped supporting Southend when we had Mohsni, Dickinson, Ferdinand and Hall. All of which proved themselves to be pretty odious characters. Would you stop supporting your club side just because you don't like a few of the players. Of course not. I don't see why you would turn your back on your national side for the same thing - I thought all fans were loyal, supporting their team through thick and thin.

Its more a case of i only really watch Southend these days (through thick and thin) and dont really have time or any inclination to watch England, by the same token if Brazil played Spain down at Roots Hall wouldnt be interested either. I need the buzz of a game where you want your team to win and the only these days works watching Southend has that for me

 

[stickyboy]

All that said and done (and to get back to the point of the thread) I still dont want the integrity of our English leagues compromised to improve the National side's chances of doing better at them. The leagues and our Saturday afternoons mean more to most supporters than international tournaments (despite how much we moan after going out of every one!)

now i WILL AGREE on this :)

 

[stickyboy]

I smell something

have you farted?

 

[Jam_Man]

Signed the petition yesterday and now getting spammed in my mailbox

Just a quick note on day one to say thanks a lot for all your support, we now have a website set up which we will hope to center the campaign from.

You can find it here at www.againstleague3.co.uk

We will not have our football pyramid ruined by anybody and together we can stop the plans in place. It's fantastic to see fans unite like this and long may it continue, together we can bring change.

Thankyou.

Together we will keep things the same surely ?:smile:

 

[Uncle Leo]

Possibly interesting tweet here from a Guardian journo:

"Worth noting that when Dyke was at BBC his negotiating style was often to use the cover of a radical suggestion to get other stuff through..."

 

[Blue_Wes]

No, but World Cups are different, people who dont even follow football get involved.

Its not about being a hardcore England supporter, these days I rarely watch friendlies, and not all qualifiers, but the World Cup is a massive event and the biggest coming together in the sport. I dont watch Nigeria vs Argentina because I support either, I watch them because its the World Cup.

If you dont like the World Cup that's your choice, not one I can comprehend to be honest.

All that said and done (and to get back to the point of the thread) I still dont want the integrity of our English leagues compromised to improve the National side's chances of doing better at them. The leagues and our Saturday afternoons mean more to most supporters than international tournaments (despite how much we moan after going out of every one!)

It feels like a smoke screen though, this argument that the B' league is designed to improve the national side. If anything this proposal will reduce the number of English players in the game. The number of foreign kids in the acadameies of Chelsea, Arsenal and City for example is going in excess of the clubs their promotions could displace.

How is the likes of Galindo*, Gnabry*, Martinez*, Miguel*, Boateng* and Zak Ansah playing for Arsenal B' against Braintree or Southend going to improve the national side, whilst an Accrington or Wycombe get relegated a league to accomadate Arsenal's opportunity to develop their own players to improve their already vast squad of players they are depriving the smaller squad's of.

Sokilok stopping Corr** scoring the vital goal that could give us promotion is going to benefit Roy Hodgson's selection headache how, whilst a lesser player who steps into Sokilok's shoes is unable to stop N'goo scoring the winner?

Without a cap of the number of non-GB players in a match day squad, this will just double the number of cheaper foreign players the larger clubs can field on a Saturday afternoon.

*Thank you Football Manager for the knowledge
**Obviously this is an entirely fictional scenario. No-one can stop Barry Corr doing anything, let alone scoring.

 

[Fish]

How about singing this in the Burton games:

"Que sera, sera,
We don't want your crap League 3,
We won't play your **** team B,
Que sera sera"

 

[united we stand]

that may be the intention, but the fact is the big clubs apparently like the idea , and the small ones do not. I can bnot imagine for on e second that the big clubs will be agreeing to this unless they think it will benefit them . \\Its not even as though the big clubs are owned by Englishmen who might care about the national side and therefore might be willing to help, even if there was nothing in it for their own club.

My fear as someone posted earlier is that there is a 'plan B' that is also 'bad' for smaller clubs, but we end up being 'pleased' to ahe it as it isn't as bad as this plan

 

[united we stand]

I don't know how these proposals help the below statistic . Surely this is a major piece of the problem?
UEFA data shows that England has 1,395 coaches holding Uefa’s A and Pro qualification badges compared to Germany’s 6,934, Italy’s 2,281, France’s 3,308 and Spain’s whopping 15,423.

 

[stickyboy]

interesting article

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...gue-B-teams-end-disaster-just-like-Spain.html

 

[Jam_Man]

interesting article

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...gue-B-teams-end-disaster-just-like-Spain.html

Look at the title of the video

Dyke: Its not our intention to devalue quality of the Premier League.

What about the other 72 league clubs and all of the conference you muppet?

This bloke is in charge???!

 

[David Icke]

They could win the bloody thing and still would have no interest i'm afraid. I enjoy watching Southend and pretty much go all over the country watching them but i dont expect everyone living in Southend to do likewise?

Couldn't agree more. I gave up taking an interest in the England football team 20 years ago or more, when top flight football became focused on super greed. To this day I couldn't give a fig about England. As born and bred Southend I am 100% Southend United, and not even .1% will go to enthusing about another team - and that includes the over paid, over hyped, couldn't give a monkeys about football outside the Premiership, greed egos that comprise the England football team.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Signed it yesterday, 17,000 signatures now!

Reading the comments and some people dont seem to get it


It has nothing to do with helping big clubs, its about helping the England team, which I would suggest most fans put secondary to their own club.

No, you're completely wrong here. This isn't about helping the England team, it's about helping the big clubs under the guise of helping the England team.

Maybe they wouldn't but at least they'd be honest. Supporters Direct don't care about the bigger picture. They care about their clubs and are as selfish in that regard as the big clubs are being. Almost everyone associated with football from Premier League chairmen to lower league supporters are primarily concerned with the wellbeing of their own club.

Exactly. The people pushing this are pushing this not to help England (the plan doesn't actually make sense) but to help the Premier League big boys (only 10 of them).

Seems quite an intelligent bloke. One idiot criticised him for being American and not caring about "England". Darragh MacAnthony fears that the FA will use the opposition to the plan to withdraw funding to the lower leagues.
I just cannot get this argument at all. The Premier League because it attracts the best players in the world is probably the best league in the world. If it reduces the number of foreign players (just think Ya Ya Toure or Suarez) then there might be more English players but the league will be worse. Remember when Division 1 (the proper one) was full of English players and we were still crap nationally. It's a red herring. We do produce talent in this country. We produced the player commanding the biggest transfer in the world. OK he's Welsh but he came through the curent system. How will a league of B teamers most of whom will not be English playing conference teams improve things. It may cut some of their careers short by dodgy tackles and dodgy pitches. Insane and illogical. It just does not bear scrutiny. Maybe MacAnthony is right and ther is a hidden agenda.

He's Irish.

Quotas won't stop Toure or Suarez, probably the only two foreigners in the EPL who'd be in the conversation for a spot in a World squad. But there are hundreds of non-entities.

Is English football really going to be any worse off if there are no Vito Mannone, Santiago Vergini, Marcos Alonso, Stephane Sessegnon, Diego Lugano, Youssouf Mulumbu, Jonas Olsson, Matej Vydra, Emanuele Giaccherini to pick a selection from one of Wednesday's games.

Possibly interesting tweet here from a Guardian journo:

"Worth noting that when Dyke was at BBC his negotiating style was often to use the cover of a radical suggestion to get other stuff through..."

This. I've been warning about this since this stalking horse was first released.

Look at the title of the video

Dyke: Its not our intention to devalue quality of the Premier League.

What about the other 72 league clubs and all of the conference you muppet?

This bloke is in charge???!

Dyke is a Man U fan from Surrey (or somewhere else in the home counties). This isn't about England. It's another power grab from the EPL. Dyke's taking this step to avoid the flack when England get knocked out in Brazil, and the EPL are using the national team as a smokescreen to push through reforms that favour them.

 

[Jam_Man]

How does it actually help the premiership though ? That makes even less sense to me that helping England.

 

[Beefy]

Dyke is a Man U fan from Surrey (or somewhere else in the home counties). This isn't about England. It's another power grab from the EPL. Dyke's taking this step to avoid the flack when England get knocked out in Brazil, and the EPL are using the national team as a smokescreen to push through reforms that favour them.

He's a Brentford fan isn't he?

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

How does it actually help the premiership though ? That makes even less sense to me that helping England.

It's about helping them maintain their enormous squads. If you have a squad of 30 players you can't give them enough match practice to keep them all sharp and keep them interested.

You can send them out on loan but what if you don't have a Cauley Woodrow clause in your loan agreement and they get put on the bench? See how Norwich recalled Loza.

They'd also be able to charge more for entrance and maybe retain some of the fans they've priced out of first team football so has the added benefit of expanding your brand.


If the lack of competitive reserve team football for 21 year olds is what is holding English football back, why don't we encourage our best youngsters to go to Real Madrid or Barcelona where they will be able to go and play for their C team in the third tier of Spanish football?

He's a Brentford fan isn't he?

He's a Man U fan and was on their board until he had to resign because of a conflict of interest.

Brentford is his second team.

 

[stickyboy]

heres an article regarding the extra B teams in the German League and what a shambles it has become

http://www.wsc.co.uk/the-archive/923-Europe/598-the-killer-bs

 

[londonblue]

heres an article regarding the extra B teams in the German League and what a shambles it has become

http://www.wsc.co.uk/the-archive/923-Europe/598-the-killer-bs

Was just about to post that myself...very interesting article.

 

[Jam_Man]

It's about helping them maintain their enormous squads. If you have a squad of 30 players you can't give them enough match practice to keep them all sharp and keep them interested.

You can send them out on loan but what if you don't have a Cauley Woodrow clause in your loan agreement and they get put on the bench? See how Norwich recalled Loza.

They'd also be able to charge more for entrance and maybe retain some of the fans they've priced out of first team football so has the added benefit of expanding your brand.


If the lack of competitive reserve team football for 21 year olds is what is holding English football back, why don't we encourage our best youngsters to go to Real Madrid or Barcelona where they will be able to go and play for their C team in the third tier of Spanish football?



He's a Man U fan and was on their board until he had to resign because of a conflict of interest.

Brentford is his second team.

I really dont see that being a big enough attraction for the Premiership clubs.

Yes there are some benefits, but I cant imagine they are falling over themselves to get a B club set up just so they can play Gateshead.

As for making money for entrance these games would get little to no-one turning up. In the German leagues in that article Stickyboy psoted they were getting 400 people turn up for a B-team match where other clubs in the same division were getting 18000. I dont see that as commercially attractive to anyone.

I still see it as a (terrible) solution for the English team.

 

[Blue_Wes]

Couldn't agree more. I gave up taking an interest in the England football team 20 years ago or more, when top flight football became focused on super greed. To this day I couldn't give a fig about England. As born and bred Southend I am 100% Southend United, and not even .1% will go to enthusing about another team - and that includes the over paid, over hyped, couldn't give a monkeys about football outside the Premiership, greed egos that comprise the England football team.

What would you do if Southend became ultra successful, and achieved their dream of reaching the Premiership, employed several well played international footballers to keep them there, continued their succcess, reached europe and eventually had a squad full of 'over paid over hyped greed egos'. Including prominent England internationals?

Just because a player is successful in what he does and is well paid for it, automatically he's labelled greedy, a prima donna, doesn't care about the game, ego-tistical, etc, etc. It's almost like you can't be a successful well paid footballer without someone who hasn't achieved any where near as much making a scathing character assassination of someone they only know through the media.

I'd be more concerned about the character of somoene who tars every England player with the same scathing brush based on their income alone, than that of someone who is successful enough in their chosen profession to have reached the top and be well paid for their achievements.

Every club and player strives to be in the position of those you despise, even Southend United. We aren't in it to make up the numbers you know.