Kenneth Biggley reported dead

[Birri]

Sadly yes he has been killed (reports on the news thismorning that MI6 paid a syrian & an egyptian to rescue him & all 3 were caught & killed). But mr Bigley + the 2 yanks were over there knowing the risks, to earn very large sums of money. They did not however take sensible precautions of living within a secure area, or having armed guards. So from the moment they moved into the house they were taken from they were all dead men.

 

[chadded]

Quote[/b] (shrimpboy @ Oct. 10 2004,11:29)]Yes. Sadly, it was observed disgracefully by some ****ed morons who decided to shout and chant.:(

It was observed disgracefully by me in the pub on principle. He deserves nothing. He was out there becasue he wanted to be, he didn't have to go.

Most importantly, he didn't even live in the green zone, an aread of Baghdad that was safe for Western contractors, as it was protected by US forces. Had he lived there, like he was advised to (but refused) he probably wouldn't have been kidnapped in the first place. His plight has been his own fault.

Heroic escape? That's b******s and all.

Sorry if I offend, but I don't agree. Had he been a British soldier, then I'd feel differently. They're sent out to Iraq on orders, they don't go just because they want to.

 

[Guest]

R.I.P ken.

 

[footymad13]

Quote[/b] (Matt the Shrimp @ Oct. 08 2004,16:41)]Less of the "Scottish pr*ck" as well... the fact that he's often a total nob is, to be fair, nothing to do with the fact that he's Scottish.

Come on Matt, There is always banter and between the English,Welsh and Scottish. Certainly didn't think that comment was anything personal against the Scots. Always think theres a love, hate relationship between the two countries but when they need eachother they will unite. Which is a tad Ironic considering what we did to the poor sods hundereds of years back. Before anyone jumps on my back i have nothing at all against the Scots, i have a number of friends in Scotland and its certainly has some of the most beauiful parts in the UK. I just don't abide by all this political correctness.

Anyways, Tragic what happened to Bigley but at the end of the day what on earth was he doing out there. I said this to someone at the game on Friday and he said he had a friend out there whos on £1000 a day as a bodyguard. If you go over there then you realise the risk that you take and if you feel its worth it then ok but if he wasn't in a safe area as Chadded said then you can't do much for these people. Tragic none the less and R.I.P.

I personally feel the Foreign Office should not allow any British Citizen into Iraq unless it is essential and they are working with the Armed forces.

BTW, Being a tad harsh on Billy Connelly, im sure we have all said things we would rather forget as for him being funny, i personally think his one of the best comedians around and his TV program around the UK was really good. Beats the unfunny Lee Evans anytime.

 

[McScriven]

I was at the England match and it was the Welsh who started making the noise, only a few mind you, which was then retaliated by some English shouting something back and so forth. The majority tried to hush everyone.

 

[* ORM *]

Quote[/b] (McScriven @ Oct. 10 2004,20:56)]I was at the England match and it was the Welsh who started making the noise, only a few mind you, which was then retaliated by some English shouting something back and so forth. The majority tried to hush everyone.

Any chance of Eriksson quitting so I can start watching my national team again ?

 

[McScriven]

Quote[/b] (* ORM * @ Oct. 10 2004,23:12)]

Quote[/b] (McScriven @ Oct. 10 2004,20:56)]I was at the England match and it was the Welsh who started making the noise, only a few mind you, which was then retaliated by some English shouting something back and so forth. The majority tried to hush everyone.

Any chance of Eriksson quitting so I can start watching my national team again ?  

Dunno why you'd want that?

He got it spot on Saturday. Wales were weak at the back (very weak, dreadful in fact) so we went out and attacked.

This bollox about an English manager does my head in. Brazil the greatest team in the world have very rarely had a Brazilian manager in any of their successes.

 

[* ORM *]

I feel exactly the same about player eligibility by birthright/parentage - not that this is a current issue. I also feel exactly the same about government, either domestically being run by Scots (though access to the oil and gas isn't a bad trade off) or in Europe. We survived long enough without European interference in everything we do.

Sadly the damage of the Nanny State and the Great Nanny EU has already been done. I can't seem to fart these days without contravening some regulation or other.

 

[Matt the Shrimp]

Quote[/b] (McScriven @ Oct. 10 2004,23:26)]This bollox about an English manager does my head in. Brazil the greatest team in the world have very rarely had a Brazilian manager in any of their successes.

Huh?

Not sure where you've got that gem of info from, Scriv - but I'm 95% sure you're completely wrong about that stat.  Every world cup winning manager Brazil has had has been a Brazilian, so far as I can tell.

Here's a list of all of Brazil's world cups, how they got on and who the manager was.  I'm pretty sure that all of them - not just the victorious ones - are Brasileiros.

If you're thinking "hey, isn't 'Big Phil' the manager of Portugal?", then you'd be absolutely right.  But he's a Brazilian who is managing the Portuguese team; he wasn't a Portuguese guy managing Brazil.

Most Brazilians find themselves in the ORM school of thought: i.e. it would be unimaginable to have anyone other than a Brazilian managing the Brazilian team.

Matt

1930 - Eliminated in the 1/8 finals - Managed by 3 men from the Brazilian Football Federation (CBD)
1934 - Eliminated after one match - Manager: Luiz Vinhais
1938 - 3rd Place - Manager: Adhemar Pimenta
1950 - Runner-Up - Manager: Flávio Costa
1954 - 1/4 Finalists - Manager: Zezé Moreira
1958 - World Champions - Manager: Vicente Feola
1962 - World Champions - Manager: Vicente Feola and Aymoré Moreira
1966 - Eliminated in the 1/8 Finals - Manager: Vicente Feola
1970 - World Champions - Manager: Mário Zagalo
1974 - 4th Place - Manager: Mário Zagalo
1978 - 3rd Place (Unbeaten) - Manager: Cláudio Coutinho
1982 - Eliminated in 2nd Round - Manager: Telê Santana
1986 - Lost in Quarter Finals - Manager: Telê Santana
1990 - Lost in the Quarter Finals - Manager: Sebastião Lazaroni
1994 - World Champions - Manager: Carlos Alberto Parreira
1998 - Second Place - Manager: Mário Zagalo
2002 - World Champions - Manager: Luiz Felipe Scolari

 

[overseas shrimper]

I thought the same thing, Matt, about the Brazilian managers.

Where'd you get that idea from, Scriv?

 

[footymad13]

Quote[/b] (* ORM * @ Oct. 11 2004,11:20)]I feel exactly the same about player eligibility by birthright/parentage - not that this is a current issue. I also feel exactly the same about government, either domestically being run by Scots (though access to the oil and gas isn't a bad trade off) or in Europe. We survived long enough without European interference in everything we do.

Sadly the damage of the Nanny State and the Great Nanny EU has already been done. I can't seem to fart these days without contravening some regulation or other.

The EU will be the downfall of this country.

Its ok for the French they are in mainland Europe we are a island and we our economy will suffer because of it.

 

[Hong Kong Blue]

Quote[/b] (footymad13 @ Oct. 11 2004,20:29)]The EU will be the downfall of this country.

Its ok for the French they are in mainland Europe we are a island and we our economy will suffer because of it.

I'm intrigued by your argument that this country's economy will suffer because the country is an island. Please tell me more.

 

[Hong Kong Blue]

Going back to the original topic I'd like to make the following points

1) What Billy Connolly says isn't funny.
Thats not a comment on his Kenneth Bigley joke, but his act in general.

2) Its sad when anyone dies.
As Wessex Blue (I think it was) said many people are dying out in Iraq, (mainly Iraqis). Its a tragedy when a single person dies - that is a tragedy for their friends and families, for those who don't know them its not a tragedy. That's not being callous, that is just the truth and I find the insincerity and the mock grief (be it for Kenneth Bigley, Princess Diana or whoever) far more disgusting.

3) The fourth estate are beyond contempt.
Kenneth Bigley was kidnapped and then beheaded in an attempt to put pressure on the government to withdraw from Iraq. It would be unrealistic for the media not to report the story (although if they had any true desire to save his - and future kidnap victim's lives - they would not have) but the media go and build up the story and encourage future kidnapping - as it sells newspapers, gets coverage and furthers their own careers. The media were no doubt disgusted by Billy Connelly's quip that the kidnappers should get it over with, as that would deprive them of a couple of weeks' copy. The way the media manipulate the family's grief merely confirms in my eyes that journalists are the lowest of the low.

 

[Kim Mitten]

Quote[/b] (Hong Kong Blue @ Oct. 11 2004,21:30)]I find the insincerity and the mock grief (be it for Kenneth Bigley, Princess Diana or whoever) far more disgusting.

Agree with the mock greif thing there Hong Kong.

What people don't seem to have mentioned is that its a war out there, the government might say they have won the war, but they haven't there is currently a war in Iraq, and Bigley is a civilian that has died in the war.

It is a disgrace that this man has been singled out when so many Soliders have died out there with little mention, his killing may have been different, but he had a choice about going out there, currently one of the most dangerous places in the world.
i'm sure he knew the risks and maybe his death will put off some of these others going out there to make quick money doing 'secruity' jobs.

 

[footymad13]

Quote[/b] (Hong Kong Blue @ Oct. 11 2004,20:50)]

Quote[/b] (footymad13 @ Oct. 11 2004,20:29)]The EU will be the downfall of this country.

Its ok for the French they are in mainland Europe we are a island and we our economy will suffer because of it.

I'm intrigued by your argument that this country's economy will suffer because the country is an island. Please tell me more.

Because i believe the countries in Mainland Europe find it much easier to trade and do tend to stick together, where as Britain is somewhat isolated from the rest and has one of the strongest currencies in the world, if we lose that then i do believe it will damage the country and the econemy. The Euro would be of no benefit to us. In my opinion anyway.

 

[CANV]

we do about 40 per cent of our trade with europe and a similar amount with the us block in us dollars.. the current set up currency wise is pretty good.. as for the EU as a trading block its brilliant.. its the richest part of the world, 300 million plus well off people wanting to buy stuff.. with china coming on strong it would be wise to stay in with the EU.. the EU wont finish this country, our blind following of the crap regulations it chucks up might, and the crap regulations our glorious leaders invent as well..
having said that this country isnt as incompetent as we all think, there are many european countrys that would love to be in our semi detached position.. we get the benefits with less of the hassle..
in a world that is becoming 3 giant trading blocks we seem to have joined 2 of em.. good effort!

 

[CANV]

oh and as for bigly.. very sad but a minutes silence at an international football match.. totally over the top.. can we get a bit more princess di about it..
i dont know how many people died on the day he copped it, how many kids got run over or killed in a house fire..how many people died from some disease or other.. but sh*t happens, total over reaction...
as for billy connelly.. as someone said black humour is a major part of what this countrys sense of humour is all about.. or used to be

 

[Guest]

In one thread I've seen talk of Bigley, the rise of the EU superstate, Billy Connolly's "act", the media, whether being an island affects our economy as well as the issue of Brazilian managers.

Is everyone ****ed?

 

[The Artful Shrimper]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Oct. 12 2004,10:12)]Is everyone ****ed?

No...perhaps that's the problem !