Jeremy Corbyn's Labour

[mrsblue]

Not on this thread. I guess there has already been 9/11 threads or perhaps you could start one.

If you or I committed mass murder on an industrial scale then the courts would scrutinise our every movement and every action,they would put question after question after question,they would disprove the theory that an ordinary car driver could become F1 champion,yet 9/11 with far too many riddles was swept away alongside the evidence.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Meanwhile back to JC.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-34967024

 

[Napster]

,yet 9/11 with far too many riddles was swept away alongside the evidence.

name one riddle oh wise one

 

[Napster]

What has that got to do with anything,I don't know any Irish folk but still managed to work out "the troubles" was crazy,likewise I don't know any Americans but again somehow I thought their gun law is mad.

Violence only breeds more violence.

Your entire argument is opinion based without first hand experience. Trust me Iraqis were not exactly happy under Saddam!

 

[MK Shrimper]

Your entire argument is opinion based without first hand experience. Trust me Iraqis were not exactly happy under Saddam!

I've seen estimates that he's responsible for nearly 500,000 deaths.

 

[THE SEVENTIES NORTH BANK]

Anyway, back to Corbyn. He should resign. He is dividing his own party. He hasn't got the backing of his own party. When he went on the Lorraine Show and started talking about collecting manhole covers, and the different types, she was laughing her head off. She said she never thought she would be listening to a speech about manhole covers, when he was invited on. Anyone that saw that instantly knew that this man will never be in charge of the Country. He's a pussycat at Prime Ministers question time. The Tories can't believe their luck. Even the Tories have stopped attacking the leader of the opposition because they want him to stay as leader of the Labour Party. It's a bit like when the IRA didn't kill Reverend Paisley, because he was seen by so many on both sides as a nutter.
This man has many good points and a good heart, but he can never win a general election. He has to go. The Labour Party must come first. They made the mistake with Milliband, as he was clearly the wrong choice. Surely they won't do it again.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Anyway, back to Corbyn. He should resign. He is dividing his own party. He hasn't got the backing of his own party. When he went on the Lorraine Show and started talking about collecting manhole covers, and the different types, she was laughing her head off. She said she never thought she would be listening to a speech about manhole covers, when he was invited on. Anyone that saw that instantly knew that this man will never be in charge of the Country. He's a pussycat at Prime Ministers question time. The Tories can't believe their luck. Even the Tories have stopped attacking the leader of the opposition because they want him to stay as leader of the Labour Party. It's a bit like when the IRA didn't kill Reverend Paisley, because he was seen by so many on both sides as a nutter.
This man has many good points and a good heart, but he can never win a general election. He has to go. The Labour Party must come first. They made the mistake with Milliband, as he was clearly the wrong choice. Surely they won't do it again.

And again, people are flocking back to the Labour Party like never before. Don't believe all you read in the Tory press mate.

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

So the man who heads up what is supposed to be the alternative government shows a lack of leadership yet again on what is likely to be one of his most important decisions. I would have had more respect for him if he whipped his MP's but instead this.
Weak man, Weak leadership, Weak opposition.

 

[RHB]

And again, people are flocking back to the Labour Party like never before. Don't believe all you read in the Tory press mate.

I can't argue with the fact that membership of the Party has risen since JC decided to stand and since his election as leader. Neither can I argue with the probability that the majority of the membership agree with his opinions and values. But the total membership is about 360k, which is a minority in relationship to potential Labour voters in the UK. I'm just not convinced that those voters that aren't members but have Labour tendencies, share Jeremy's and the Party faithful views on some of the most important issues of the day. I don't see Corbyn as weak, but neither have I yet seen anything about the man which convinces me that he has PM credentials that will win over the undecided, and I say that as a life long Labour voter.

 

[londonblue]

I can't argue with the fact that membership of the Party has risen since JC decided to stand and since his election as leader. Neither can I argue with the probability that the majority of the membership agree with his opinions and values. But the total membership is about 360k, which is a minority in relationship to potential Labour voters in the UK. I'm just not convinced that those voters that aren't members but have Labour tendencies, share Jeremy's and the Party faithful views on some of the most important issues of the day. I don't see Corbyn as weak, but neither have I yet seen anything about the man which convinces me that he has PM credentials that will win over the undecided, and I say that as a life long Labour voter.

Totally agree. I have never voted any other way, but I can't see myself voting Labour whilst he's in charge.

Shame really, because I won't vote Lib Dem because I consider it a wasted vote, and I won't vote tory till the day I die, which also rules out UKIP, and greens aren't really any better than Corduroy.

 

[Napster]

Believe it or not, like Rees-Mogg pointed out, I have a great deal of admiration for JC who is sticking to his principles. Alas, his "friends" are doing the damage - spinning against him and splitting the party asunder. He won't last but he's a decent cove even so.

 

[Uncle Leo]

And again, people are flocking back to the Labour Party like never before. Don't believe all you read in the Tory press mate.

Membership on the rise, but are these new members really engaging? Are they getting out on the doorstep, are they attending meetings, etc?

Couple of interesting paragraphs here from Janice Turner. Yes, it's from The Times but she's a firm Labour supporter and has gone on record many times as saying she doesn't like the Conservatives.

The real deal
Having rejoined the Labour party in May, I went along to my constituency gala dinner, a jolly evening at a local Italian. Sadiq Khan spoke and delivered his new joke about Sajid Javid: “You wait for years for the son of a Muslim bus driver to turn up and two come along at once.”
The highlight was the auction of books, posters and the like signed by Labour luminaries. An autographed volume of Barbara Castle’s Fighting All The Way raised a large sum. Then came a copy of What Would Keir Hardie Say? signed by Jeremy Corbyn and Tom Watson. The auctioneer had to cajole to get a first bid and it was eventually sold for a fifth of Babs’s book. In fact, the final item, a plastic, self-snowing Christmas tree from Lidl, raised almost as much. And it wasn’t even signed by Santa.
Cyber politics
One Labour stalwart remarked that while membership had risen, attendance at this dinner had declined. More people are just internet members, who believe — as when re-tweeting a petition — they can change the world in one click, never leaving the house.
But political parties are meant to be sociable; ideas exchanged over a beer. You could disagree with Geoff, the branch secretary, but appreciate his dedication to a shared cause. Without mixing in real life, you will not understand that this is a rough coalition, a broad church. But why endure wearying human interaction when in the social media echo chamber you can stay ideologically pure.
The comedian Robert Webb is leaving Labour after two years, appalled by Jeremy Corbyn’s foreign policy and his odious online trolls. And this week, a young woman told me she quit when Corbyn’s first shadow cabinet had no women in senior posts. She only joined in May! Flouncing out because a party doesn’t immediately deliver your bespoke agenda seems petulant. What happened to stay and fight? But this is an age when our desires are met instantly by Amazon Prime.

 

[Napster]

But this is an age when our desires are met instantly by Amazon Prime.

Only if you pay £79 a year, natch.:winking:

 

[mrsblue]

Your entire argument is opinion based without first hand experience. Trust me Iraqis were not exactly happy under Saddam!

Yes of course that was true nobody can deny it,but now different tribes have a free for all battling it out to be the rulers which only leads to more deaths.Under Saddam it was bad but now it seems so much worse.

 

[mrsblue]

name one riddle oh wise one

Novice pilots became incredible pilots !
Terrorists were extremely lucky they chose the day when America were playing war games 400 miles away!
Terrorists had even better luck as around 20 staff were starting their first day including Ben Sliney and many top army bods,the chain of command was broken,identical scenario to the Pearl Harbour attack!
The towers became the first in history to collapse .
Tower 7 became the first in history to collaspe even though it suffered only minor damage.
United 93 became the first airliner to crash on the ground yet left little debris.
America's mystery of the 2 trillion defence black hole was wiped clean.
Silverstien the owner of the trade centre was very lucky as he only insured the buildings with a clause of aircraft terrorist attack only 6 weeks before the event!
George Bush was lucky as members of his family were due for meetings on that day,they cancelled them before the attack.
Silverstien was also lucky as his sons also cancelled their meetings.
The jet engine near the Pentacon crash was identified by a Rolls Royce as not the type used in the supposed airliner that crashed.


If you need more let me know.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

So the man who heads up what is supposed to be the alternative government shows a lack of leadership yet again on what is likely to be one of his most important decisions. I would have had more respect for him if he whipped his MP's but instead this.
Weak man, Weak leadership, Weak opposition.

In what way is he being weak? He has put on record his opposition to airstrikes based mainly on 1) they have been used for years already to little effect 2) there is no after plan - no plan to deal with Assad or plan to fill the vacuum. He could have just gone along with the 'popular' vote and saved himself any trouble, but chose to state what he believed is right in a reasonable way without emotive language or trying to discredit the other view.


He then allowed the party membership to have their say - and 70,000 did. He then discussed with the shadow cabinet and agreed to a free vote for all Labour MPs.


Reasonable and democratic is what I see. You see weakness - where exactly?

 

[mrsblue]

In what way is he being weak? He has put on record his opposition to airstrikes based mainly on 1) they have been used for years already to little effect 2) there is no after plan - no plan to deal with Assad or plan to fill the vacuum. He could have just gone along with the 'popular' vote and saved himself any trouble, but chose to state what he believed is right in a reasonable way without emotive language or trying to discredit the other view.


He then allowed the party membership to have their say - and 70,000 did. He then discussed with the shadow cabinet and agreed to a free vote for all Labour MPs.


Reasonable and democratic is what I see. You see weakness - where exactly?

Agreed,

Jezza maybe eccentric but I think he has done the right thing.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Membership on the rise, but are these new members really engaging? Are they getting out on the doorstep, are they attending meetings, etc?

Couple of interesting paragraphs here from Janice Turner. Yes, it's from The Times but she's a firm Labour supporter and has gone on record many times as saying she doesn't like the Conservatives.

The real deal
Having rejoined the Labour party in May, I went along to my constituency gala dinner, a jolly evening at a local Italian. Sadiq Khan spoke and delivered his new joke about Sajid Javid: “You wait for years for the son of a Muslim bus driver to turn up and two come along at once.”
The highlight was the auction of books, posters and the like signed by Labour luminaries. An autographed volume of Barbara Castle’s Fighting All The Way raised a large sum. Then came a copy of What Would Keir Hardie Say? signed by Jeremy Corbyn and Tom Watson. The auctioneer had to cajole to get a first bid and it was eventually sold for a fifth of Babs’s book. In fact, the final item, a plastic, self-snowing Christmas tree from Lidl, raised almost as much. And it wasn’t even signed by Santa.
Cyber politics
One Labour stalwart remarked that while membership had risen, attendance at this dinner had declined. More people are just internet members, who believe — as when re-tweeting a petition — they can change the world in one click, never leaving the house.
But political parties are meant to be sociable; ideas exchanged over a beer. You could disagree with Geoff, the branch secretary, but appreciate his dedication to a shared cause. Without mixing in real life, you will not understand that this is a rough coalition, a broad church. But why endure wearying human interaction when in the social media echo chamber you can stay ideologically pure.
The comedian Robert Webb is leaving Labour after two years, appalled by Jeremy Corbyn’s foreign policy and his odious online trolls. And this week, a young woman told me she quit when Corbyn’s first shadow cabinet had no women in senior posts. She only joined in May! Flouncing out because a party doesn’t immediately deliver your bespoke agenda seems petulant. What happened to stay and fight? But this is an age when our desires are met instantly by Amazon Prime.

On the first point of the auction - who really buys this kind of thing? I would fully expect someone who is nigh on a historical character to have more value that the very accessible current leader - if you want his autograph you would have plenty of opportunities to get it.

On the point of troops on the doorsteps there is nothing to sell yet. I went canvassing a lot in May and I will again for the London Mayor elections but I'd never dream of going to a gala dinner and I suspect a lot of the new members would be in the same boat. It's a strange accusation that the new members are not active and at the same time new members are being accused of trying to take over local parties.


i put it down to the fact that as with anything else when something you have supported changes a fair few people will bemoan the changes because they liked things the way they were. At the same time the changes will attract new faces.

 

[rigsby]

Excellent post MK.

May I add the West believe dropping bombs from 30,000 feet which with out question kill innocent people will solve the situation is utterly barking mad,General Melchiot type response.

For decades the West have installed leaders only to turn their back on them,the West sell arms by the truckload whilst strutting their stuff yet ignoring the madness in other parts of the world.The ME loaded with oil and opium,now if they never had these valuable commodities would the a West give a damn,of course not.

It would seem that most people would bomb ISIS in Syria if we could guarantee not killing any innocent civilians. Then the simple and safe solution would be to use the experts. Saudi terrorists in Boeing 757's

Novice pilots became incredible pilots !
Terrorists were extremely lucky they chose the day when America were playing war games 400 miles away!
Terrorists had even better luck as around 20 staff were starting their first day including Ben Sliney and many top army bods,the chain of command was broken,identical scenario to the Pearl Harbour attack!
The towers became the first in history to collapse .
Tower 7 became the first in history to collaspe even though it suffered only minor damage.
United 93 became the first airliner to crash on the ground yet left little debris.
America's mystery of the 2 trillion defence black hole was wiped clean.
Silverstien the owner of the trade centre was very lucky as he only insured the buildings with a clause of aircraft terrorist attack only 6 weeks before the event!
George Bush was lucky as members of his family were due for meetings on that day,they cancelled them before the attack.
Silverstien was also lucky as his sons also cancelled their meetings.
The jet engine near the Pentacon crash was identified by a Rolls Royce as not the type used in the supposed airliner that crashed.


If you need more let me know.

 

[mrsblue]

It would seem that most people would bomb ISIS in Syria if we could guarantee not killing any innocent civilians. Then the simple and safe solution would be to use the experts. Saudi terrorists in Boeing 757's

Very true indeed !

The airmanship achieved by the Pentacon novice pilot was truly remarkable ,Since then many highly skilled pilots have attempted to copy this stunning feat on a flight sim,every single pilot failed as the air speed was too great,plus the other factor that a passenger jet is not designed to fly at 2 feet doing 530mph.

That guy was a top top top top top top gun.