Question Is it time for us to take a leaf out of Cardiffs book?

[EastStandBlue]

trying to think of some other clubs owned by the fans ....

B B B ?? oh yeah BARCELONA ....

it simple really - when you buy your season ticket you get a vote for the chairman/board -

It's a membership scheme at Barcelona, not outright ownership, and the only democratic decision made is to decide who runs the club.

We'll also forget to mention at just how many fans are part of the membership scheme at Barcelona and how much revenue they generate in comparison to how much we would using a similar scheme.

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Mr Chairman, what are you going to do about getting us somewhere to play football? You know, what with Ron Martin owning Fossetts Farm and Sainsburys all but owning Roots Hall.

rather than RM making a lot of money it of all this the club would -

one of the few people to do the sums correctly on football was Abromovich -

given that a top UK/Euro club is worth 900 million (man U) or 700 m (liverpool) a lot of people think Roman is just indulging himself but he bought Chelsea for 10 m - spent 500 m on it and could flog it tomorrow for a profit -

its all relative - what did RM pay for SUFc ? 10 quid ?

 

[Beefy]

rather than RM making a lot of money it of all this the club would -

So how exactly would the Club go from having no assets to being able to make a lot of money from moving? Where to? How would we afford it? Who is going to lend £50m to a homeless, loss-making business with no assets at all?

 

[Rayleigh boy]

we do have assets and income -

 

[EastStandBlue]

rather than RM making a lot of money it of all this the club would -

one of the few people to do the sums correctly on football was Abromovich -

given that a top UK/Euro club is worth 900 million (man U) or 700 m (liverpool) a lot of people think Roman is just indulging himself but he bought Chelsea for 10 m - spent 500 m on it and could flog it tomorrow for a profit -

its all relative - what did RM pay for SUFc ? 10 quid ?

I don't understand this... Are you inferring that we find a buyer along the same lines as Abramovich? Are you listening to yourself?

 

[Beefy]

we do have assets and income -

We have no assets. We sold the ground years ago. We have a few tables and chairs but not really anything that a bank will take as security.

We have income which goes nowhere near to meeting our outgoings. Hence the shambles we're seeing this season. We're in this mess because the Directors aren't/can't cover the gap between money in and money out anymore. If the Directors are you, me and wiggy how the **** are we going to bridge that gap?

 

[Tommy2holes]

nobody praised Ron when he saved this club or when we rose up the leagues

Scott. Your a passionate supporter but that has to rank up there with one of your poorest statements ever.

Everybody praised ron for staving off relegation on promotions on appointing a great manager on giving funds and championship football.

My point is this. You have to take the rough with the smooth. He was out there chest out waving with fists clenched like some kind of god, but now is quieter than a church mouse.

Its not on. We need answers and atleast some truth would go a long way to appeasing my present anger and torment.

I would rather protest in an honest and decent way now than wait until certain relegation and see the baying masses hovering outside the club reception.

 

[TrueBlue]

Scott. Your a passionate supporter but that has to rank up there with one of your poorest statements ever.

Everybody praised ron for staving off relegation on promotions on appointing a great manager on giving funds and championship football.

My point is this. You have to take the rough with the smooth. He was out there chest out waving with fists clenched like some kind of god, but now is quieter than a church mouse.

Its not on. We need answers and atleast some truth would go a long way to appeasing my present anger and torment.

I would rather protest in an honest and decent way now than wait until certain relegation and see the baying masses hovering outside the club reception.

On reflection yes I recall Ron getting praise but people are quick to turn

 

[Somerset Ex-TTB]

It's investing too much into the squad which got us into this mess in the first place. Now you want more?

Complete and Utter Tosh, for the past 5 years we have heard the same excuses about players looking for more wages, blah blah, its hard to get players in.

What has been invested has been paid for by the sale of Eastwood, JCR, Hooper, Painter, and Bailey (and I am sure there are couple of others that we have sold for cash)

£1.9m in Sundry Expenses isn't investing in the squad.

 

[TrueBlue]

Complete and Utter Tosh, for the past 5 years we have heard the same excuses about players looking for more wages, blah blah, its hard to get players in.

£1.9m in Sundry Expenses isn't investing in the squad.

I suppose planning permission is free then?

 

[Beefy]

Complete and Utter Tosh, for the past 5 years we have heard the same excuses about players looking for more wages, blah blah, its hard to get players in.

£1.9m in Sundry Expenses isn't investing in the squad.

Those expenses were broken down in the finance board, as I've said before. You keep ignoring that, perhaps because it doesn't fit in with whatever conspiracy theory you've got going on.

EDIT: I suggest you read this again:
http://www.shrimperzone.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1067100&postcount=1

2008's expenses haven't been broken down on anything I've seen yet but the figure was in line with 2007's and there's nothing to suggest in the slightest that any money has been spent on the new ground or anything else that it shouldn't have been.

 

[Tommy2holes]

Its the nature of the beast fella. Norwich fans loved Bryan Gunn but it didnt stop them throwing season cards at him when it all went the way of the pear. Tilson would have been under alot of stick this season if we were in a similar position with a little bit of funding. Fact is because of all that has gone on he is immune from any critisiscm. I love tilly but he has been tactically naive on many occasions this season.

 

[TrueBlue]

Those expenses were broken down in the finance board, as I've said before. You keep ignoring that, perhaps because it doesn't fit in with whatever conspiracy theory you've got going on.

EDIT: I suggest you read this again:
http://www.shrimperzone.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1067100&postcount=1

2008's expenses haven't been broken down on anything I've seen yet but the figure was in line with 2007's and there's nothing to suggest in the slightest that any money has been spent on the new ground or anything else that it shouldn't have been.

Maybe its why he is ex-trust treasurer

 

[Somerset Ex-TTB]

We have income which goes nowhere near to meeting our outgoings. Hence the shambles we're seeing this season. We're in this mess because the Directors aren't/can't cover the gap between money in and money out anymore. If the Directors are you, me and wiggy how the **** are we going to bridge that gap?

True, but you have to ask yourself why. There are 9 clubs in League one that have average attendances less than 60% of ours. None of these have "rich" owners putting in cash, and you can assume that they have similar sized ancillary income in comparison to their attendances.

All of these clubs have at least 5 more professional players than us. Using this type of maths (assuming 20 is a normal sized squad), those clubs must be paying every single one of their players at least 50% less than ours get. (or don't get).

That obviously is not the case, as we all know that we have missed out on players due to the poor wages that we pay or have paid.

These 9 clubs do not have the same issues as us, so why the **** is there a gap that needs to be bridged, other than expenses on RM Hair and Bentley.

 

[tommy tucker]

OK this is what I know about the concortem .I work with a guy who,s uncle was and is part of the group of men who are waiting in the wings to take over the running of the club if it goes into administation .And I firmly beleve that is why Ron martin is loaning money from sainsburys because he knows they can match any offer an administrator would want to get the club back on its feet .

 

[EastStandBlue]

Complete and Utter Tosh, for the past 5 years we have heard the same excuses about players looking for more wages, blah blah, its hard to get players in.

What has been invested has been paid for by the sale of Eastwood, JCR, Hooper, Painter, and Bailey (and I am sure there are couple of others that we have sold for cash)

£1.9m in Sundry Expenses isn't investing in the squad.

And what other club, aside from those who have considerably wealthy owners and/or the infrastructure to compensate for such expenditure, have invested heavily in their squads?

I won't even go into the sundry expenses remark, because that was dicussed, at great length, by others more in the know than me and they all concluded that such a figure wasn't alien or distorted.

 

[BrettieAngell]

Its the nature of the beast fella. Norwich fans loved Bryan Gunn but it didnt stop them throwing season cards at him when it all went the way of the pear. Tilson would have been under alot of stick this season if we were in a similar position with a little bit of funding. Fact is because of all that has gone on he is immune from any critisiscm. I love tilly but he has been tactically naive on many occasions this season.

And how stupid do those 2 Norwich "fans" look now?

 

[Somerset Ex-TTB]

Those expenses were broken down in the finance board, as I've said before. You keep ignoring that, perhaps because it doesn't fit in with whatever conspiracy theory you've got going on.

EDIT: I suggest you read this again:
http://www.shrimperzone.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1067100&postcount=1

2008's expenses haven't been broken down on anything I've seen yet but the figure was in line with 2007's and there's nothing to suggest in the slightest that any money has been spent on the new ground or anything else that it shouldn't have been.

I never suggested otherwise, but its sheer **** poor financial control and management to allow these sort of expenses to spiral to this level.

With a little bit of control over expenditure at the football club, and a little bit of common sense, those expenses could be cut by about 40%

I am not saying that this would solve all the problems but it would help, and the buck for this has to stop with the MD of the company which is RM.

For your information I do not have any conspiracy theory going on, I am just frustrated at the amount of money that the club has wasted and is now paying for on the pitch.

 

[Beefy]

True, but you have to ask yourself why. There are 9 clubs in League one that have average attendances less than 60% of ours. None of these have "rich" owners putting in cash, and you can assume that they have similar sized ancillary income in comparison to their attendances.

Presumably they have cashflow statements which are in better shape than ours.

I recently got a new job earning about 50% more than I did before. However I'm certainly not any better off because at the same time I'm suddenly having to pay back a load of money which I'd borrowed as a student and since, when I wasn't earning so much.

Saying that we earn 'x' now and therefore can spend 'y' is only a fair assumption if we're starting from scratch. Our income must be higher than several at this level, as you rightly point out, but if we're paying historic debt then that means nothing. Leeds had a higher income than a huge number of Clubs in the Premier League, let alone the Championship, but they still ended up skint in League One.

 

[Beefy]

I never suggested otherwise, but its sheer **** poor financial control and management to allow these sort of expenses to spiral to this level.

With a little bit of control over expenditure at the football club, and a little bit of common sense, those expenses could be cut by about 40%

That's easy to say... those admin expenses don't look too terrible considering the level of turnover. Not many businesses will have total admin expenses running at 50% of the wagebill.

If you're looking for where we've over-spent then it has to be wages.