Doncaster's system - could we pull it off?

[Sussex Shrimper]

Let me be clear from the outset - I'm not proposing that we radically change the way we play after a fairly successful season, I'm just posting this as food for thought.

For a while now I've felt that one of our weaknesses as a team has been our inability to create space for our wide players. Gower does his best work when cutting inside and players with good reputations like JCR and Black have struggled to find space in which to operate while playing for us. Some of the blame might rest with the players themsleves, but by all accounts JCR has been a success for Barnsley so maybe we have to look at our playing style as a whole too.

A lot of Doncaster's success against us stemmed from the fact that we just couldn't get close enough to them in midfield. They had four players operating in central areas, all of them technically proficient, with the width coming either from the full backs or movement up front.

Could we pull off something similar with the personnel at our disposal?

Flavs

Francis
Clarke
Barrett
Mulgrew

Macca
Bailey
Moussa

Gower

Walker
Barnard

Francis and Mulgrew are both great going forwards, with good delivery (superb in Mulgrew's case), and Bailey is as responsible a player as you could wish for when it comes to plugging gaps.

Thoughts?

 

[Pubey]

fantastic post... donny aren't the only successful team to not use "natural" wingers. perhaps it's something tilly has in mind

 

[maninasuitcase]

Alot of teams that visited Roots Hall put 5 in midfield and played 1 up front and only playing 2 strikers when chasing the game.

We seem stuck at 4-4-2. Although, I prefer this formation we should be able to adapt if the need arises. Maybe going 4-5-1 when defending a lead, or 4-3-3 when chasing a game.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Alot of teams that visited Roots Hall put 5 in midfield and played 1 up front and only playing 2 strikers when chasing the game.

We seem stuck at 4-4-2. Although, I prefer this formation we should be able to adapt if the need arises. Maybe going 4-5-1 when defending a lead, or 4-3-3 when chasing a game.

Absolutely, something that has been raised time and time again is our inability to ADAPT according to what is needed.

 

[loz]

yep, and there's also the fact that we have a long-term vulnerability against teams who have a decent attacking midfielder that can get inbetween the defence and midfield- Coppinger, Thornton + various others. more men in midfield (as least as an alternative option) would help address this., and stop Macca and Bailey getting overrun as they did against Donny.

 

[shrimper4life]

And also the need to have a player who can change a game. IMO Gower is one of few if not the only player we have who can change a game when 1 or 2 nil down and even he is off form for most games. Its no surprise we've won only 2 of 19 games when going behind first.

 

[Jam_Man]

Away Id be happy to see us play more defensively at times but 442 for me at home.

Playing without wingers means less width not more. You cant expect full backs to get forward more, especially if they have no wide player in front of them providing cover.

When we played 3 central midfielders earlier in the season our right back was getting slaughtered .

 

[Jam_Man]

Its no surprise we've won only 2 of 19 games when going behind first.

Wouldnt that stat apply to most teams though ?

Surely its far more likely statistically to win a game if you score first?

 

[Cricko]

A lot of Donny's success was down to how wide there Pitch is..They use there winger's so well at home...........Most teams including us cannot handle it....They, without a doubt used there ammunition well.

 

[secondalibi]

A lot of Donny's success was down to how wide there Pitch is..They use there winger's so well at home...........Most teams including us cannot handle it....They, without a doubt used there ammunition well.

This is why I think they will beat Leeds at Wembley as the size of the pitch will really suit them.

- G

 

[les@donr]

SOD doesn't use wingers, so I'm not sure Tilly would want to play with a similar system, he plays a style more similar to the one we had under Dave Penney.

 

[SUFCLiam]

I would say worth a look in on a friendly

could work but not sure

 

[Andyhsufc]

tbh, the play we have played over the last few has, in the main, worked for us and I would be very cautious about suddenly changing our whole system. I know we were overrun by Doncaster but that was a one-off game and the way every pass was coming off for them, top Championship sides would have had a nightmare. I would give it a go in a friendly as there is nothing to lose but my initial reaction is no

 

[sufcintheprem]

Wouldnt that stat apply to most teams though ?

Surely its far more likely statistically to win a game if you score first?

Yes, we're the sixth best in the league when going behind although Swansea have picked up twice as many poitns from such positions.

 

[leeblue]

mulgrew and francis IMO have got wingbacks written all over them a 3 5 2 could possibly work, giving us that extra bod in the centre of the park, allowing barrett and clarke to mark one man each with a sweeper behind mopping up..................hang on a minute Im gonna dust off my championship manager 1995 and get that going

 

[Sean 2]

A lot of Donny's success was down to how wide there Pitch is..They use there winger's so well at home...........Most teams including us cannot handle it....They, without a doubt used there ammunition well.

Shame for them that the "system" that has raised eyebrows in the world of Doncaster proving to be a world-beater until they needed it to work the most,............away to Cheltenham:D :thump:

 

[hockleyshrimper]

Playing without wingers means less width not more. You cant expect full backs to get forward more, especially if they have no wide player in front of them providing cover.

.

But with 4 midefielders playing more central, one of them could cover either of the full backs when they go forward. Bailey is the most disciplined so its likely to be him. Which means we could miss him going forward. Oh no, ive gone cross eyed.

Definitely worth a look in a friendly though, as is any other formation.

 

[Sussex Shrimper]

Away Id be happy to see us play more defensively at times but 442 for me at home.

Playing without wingers means less width not more. You cant expect full backs to get forward more, especially if they have no wide player in front of them providing cover.

When we played 3 central midfielders earlier in the season our right back was getting slaughtered .

I think that it's greatly over-simplifying things to equate having players starting in wide positions with width.

Brazil, Argentina, Italy, Barca and both Milan teams (to name but a few) have for a while now been playing systems with no conventional wingers, yet they have no problem generating width when they need it. If you can force an opposing team to match your numbers in the middle of the pitch then that inevitably creates space out wide for a full-back or any other player moving into it.

Just look at the contrast in effective use of the wide areas between Donny (no wingers) and us. We couldn't match them in the middle and when we gathered in the necessary numbers they exploited the space created.

 

[les@donr]

The system also relies on the wing backs both left and right overlapping and pushing forward, and so someone in mindfield dropping back.

 

[Pubey]

The system also relies on the wing backs both left and right overlapping and pushing forward, and so someone in mindfield dropping back.

Hi Les,

On a scale of 1 - 10, how worried are you if you don't go up this season, do you reckon you'll end up losing a lot of your team, especially to Leeds?!