Strikers

[shrimperton]

IMO Foran was NEVER given a decent run in the team in his natural position, he would have scored more goals this season than other strikers we have/had at the club imo.

Like webbsbrain says, we all saw foran out on the wing, the guy is never a winger in is life, and if tilly bought him as a winger his player scouting & judgement needs some serious assessment, Foran was a striker!

 

[Kris]

Er, Foran played for Motherwell on the wing as well. He hasn't been a striker since his Carlisle days, I don't think, and that was in League 2.

He did play a couple of times up front for us in The Championship and was completely anonymous.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Er, Foran played for Motherwell on the wing as well. He hasn't been a striker since his Carlisle days, I don't think, and that was in League 2.

He did play a couple of times up front for us in The Championship and was completely anonymous.

He was given loads of chances up front then....deserves all he gets!!!

 

[Reg Martin]

Just to be difficult and because I'm bored, you say about little money available for us to spend and then show the top scorers in our league:

Scotland - Free
Beckford - Small fee from Non League
Forster - Small fee
Maynard - Through their Youth Team
Garner - £150,000
Graham - Free
Agogo - £200,000?
Barker - £80,000
Boyd - Free
Cox - £200,000?

That sort of shows that the top scorers in this league weren't that expensive in the first place and in the bracket of what we could spend on a player. Unfortunately instead of spending £150,000 on someone like Garner, we spent it on Foran. Instead of £80,000 on someone like Barker, we spent it on Harrold. Yes we can't blow big money on players but some of the judgement has been a little poor as has been proved. All managers get things wrong and we have to accept that as fans really. Won't stop us complaining obviously though. ;)

What we don't always know is whether SUFC have sounded players out and either their wage demands have been unreasonable or they haven't wanted to move south.
Some of the players we now see as poor signings are done with that marvellous gift all us fans have - it's called hindsight.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Er, Foran played for Motherwell on the wing as well. He hasn't been a striker since his Carlisle days, I don't think, and that was in League 2.

He did play a couple of times up front for us in The Championship and was completely anonymous.

Douglas Bader could play on the wing in the Scottish leagues!!

 

[the_goat]

I bet if you look on every message board in this league you will see a similar thread as this one. From what ive seen so far in league one some of the opposition forwards have been absolute cack.

Any lower league striker who has the least bit of potential is soon whisked off to the championsip and above ie Vokes to Wolves.

Its the easiest thing in the world to criticise signings, but you can only go on the evidence in front of you beforehand, and the small amount of money at tillys disposal.

LEAGUE ONE top scorers 07-08
Scotland-Swansea 23
Beckford-Leeds 20
Forster-Brighton 15
Maynard-Crewe 15
Garner-Carlisle 14
Graham-Carlisle 14
Agogo-Forest 13
Barker-Hartlepool 13
Boyd-scum 13
Cox-Swindon 13
Gillespie-Cheltenham 13
BARNARD-SOUTHEND 12

Apart from Scotland and Beckford a pretty poor return from all strikers it has to be said.

Perhaps one more forward to come in and a couple go out, but on the whole im happy with the bunch we have

You say small amount of money at his disposal, but thats not true is it! We may not be able to spend as much as Forest and Swansea(yet), but we still seem prepared to spend a lot more money than the majority of league one clubs. Over the past two years...

JCR...?
Peter Clarke £300
Francis £100
Paynter £200
Harrold £75
Foran £150
Liptack £50
Macormack £40
Baily £175(+ rising...)
Barnard £75+
Revell £150
Walker (six figure sum)

...and thats excluding players like ricketts - his wages AND his release fee.

THEN theres the fact that we brought 7 players in in January. Yes 7 -3 are included above, but its easier to forget the wages associated with the loan players.

Admittadly, Tilson screwed up on quite a lot of those 'bigger money' (considering the size of our club) signings, but to say the he only has a 'small amount of money at his disposal', is a bit unfair to be honest.

 

[bazzashrimper]

at the same time he sold freddy for £1.5m and JCR for £250000? so has still made a transfer profit. And we have a squad full of players we could sell for cash too - that certainly wasn't the case a few years ago when he started.

He makes the odd mistake, but even Fergie does - £30m for Veron etc.

 

[the_goat]

at the same time he sold freddy for £1.5m and JCR for £250000? so has still made a transfer profit. And we have a squad full of players we could sell for cash too - that certainly wasn't the case a few years ago when he started.

He makes the odd mistake, but even Fergie does - £30m for Veron etc.

....which immediately become 'gobbled up' due to the loss in revenue from our relegation. We continued to spend however...

 

[bazzashrimper]

....which immediately become 'gobbled up' due to the loss in revenue from our relegation. We continued to spend however...

we only got promoted in the first place because Tilly brought in so many cheap 'gems'. So really we spent a season getting extra revenue?? Add another million to my last figure.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Just to be difficult and because I'm bored, you say about little money available for us to spend and then show the top scorers in our league:

Scotland - Free
Beckford - Small fee from Non League
Forster - Small fee
Maynard - Through their Youth Team
Garner - £150,000
Graham - Free
Agogo - £200,000?
Barker - £80,000
Boyd - Free
Cox - £200,000?

That sort of shows that the top scorers in this league weren't that expensive in the first place and in the bracket of what we could spend on a player.

That's nothing new. I think I did a post last summer when everyone was clamouring to break the bank for an expensive striker arguing that spending money on a proven striker isn't the way forward.

I consider strikers the final piece in the jig-saw. If you have a good team which creates lots of chances, its fairly easy to find someone who can score enough goals to have you compete. Strikers tend to be as good as their supply line. "Proven" strikers who people suggested we missed out on signing like Billy Sharp, James Hayter, Phil Jevons and Darren Byfield scored 4, 7, 7 and 8 league goals respectively last season (Walker got 7, Barnard 12).

Build from the back.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

That's nothing new. I think I did a post last summer when everyone was clamouring to break the bank for an expensive striker arguing that spending money on a proven striker isn't the way forward.

I consider strikers the final piece in the jig-saw. If you have a good team which creates lots of chances, its fairly easy to find someone who can score enough goals to have you compete. Strikers tend to be as good as their supply line. "Proven" strikers who people suggested we missed out on signing like Billy Sharp, James Hayter, Phil Jevons and Darren Byfield scored 4, 7, 7 and 8 league goals respectively last season (Walker got 7, Barnard 12).

Build from the back.

ps Paynter scored 8. That is as many as Byfield and more than Hayter, Jevons and Sharp.

 

[the_goat]

we only got promoted in the first place because Tilly brought in so many cheap 'gems'. So really we spent a season getting extra revenue?? Add another million to my last figure.

But bringing in of these 'gems'...does anyone think we would have achieved two back to back promotions without the services of the extreemly talented Freddy Eastwood?

He was our gem - a real individualist that acted as the catalyst to the recent footballing sucess. Bentley, Gray, Pettefer, Guttridge(!) I hear you say - but were they real 'gems'? Some played a massive part, but, and perhaps this is harsh, shouldn't a club of Southend's comparable size in our league two season, be attracting such players with comparable ease?

That covers the 04/05 and 05/06.

Things changed in 06/07 - we spent heavily, in an attempt to retain Championship status. The singings, in some instances, were NOT good enough.

The subsequant loss in revenue was not even matched by the transfer fees of FE and JCR. The increase in wages of existing players due to promotion, and the singing of 'Championship' players on Championship wages, meant that the drop in to league one could potentially hit hard in financial terms. YET STILL, the club and therefore the financial backers(Ron Martin) continued to spend considerable(in comparision to similar sized clubs in league one) money on transfers and wages.