England ODI side

Jonny_Stokes · Jun 26, 2008

Following on from the debate/dissection in the ODI thread, let's do the selectors' job for them, and pick an ODI side that can actually beat second-rate teams like New Zealand:

Bell - really growing into the role as opener
Mustard (wk) - what exactly did he do to be dropped?
Pietersen - the more time he gets at the crease the better
Key (c) - One of the best captains on the county scene, and in top form
Shah - the real form player in the ODI side
(Flintoff*) - if he's ever uninjured he has to play, if only for his bowling
Wright - late-innings banger and superb death bowler
Broad - England's best bowler and natural #8
Swann - hugely econimical spinner capable of scoring quickly and taking wickets. Not worth dropping for one controversial moment.
Sidebottom - economical opening bowler and left-arm gives variety
Anderson - a tad expensive, but our best wicket-taker

*If not, it's got to be Collingwood - rediscovering form, and probably the best fielder on the planet

shrimpingbythesea · Jun 26, 2008

New Zealand are a very good 1 day side though - There weak in the 5 day game!

I would have:

Ian Bell
Luke Wright
KP
Bopara
Collingwood (C)
Flintoff
Shah
Foster
Broad
Swann
Sidebottom

If Flintoff is not fit then play Anderson and alter the line up. This team is very attacking with a Batting line up going all the way down - Broad has shown he can bat. With Flintoff you have a bowler alongside Sidebottom, Broad and Swann. You then have Wright, Colly and Bopara to chip in. Bar my Essex favourtism I would have Foster in the side. He is a strong batter and an excellent wickie. He has shown this year and recently in the 2020 he bats very well with high strike rate.

number11 · Jun 26, 2008

shrimpingbythesea said:
New Zealand are a very good 1 day side though - There weak in the 5 day game!

I would have:

Ian Bell
Luke Wright
KP
Bopara
Collingwood (C)
Flintoff
Shah
Foster
Broad
Swann
Sidebottom

If Flintoff is not fit then play Anderson and alter the line up. This team is very attacking with a Batting line up going all the way down - Broad has shown he can bat. With Flintoff you have a bowler alongside Sidebottom, Broad and Swann. You then have Wright, Colly and Bopara to chip in. Bar my Essex favourtism I would have Foster in the side. He is a strong batter and an excellent wickie. He has shown this year and recently in the 2020 he bats very well with high strike rate.

I think the two teams above show how much easier it is to pick a team with Flintoff fit, as he really is like having an extra man....without him you have to decide whether to go for a batter and fill in the 5th bowling spot with bits and pieces bowling, or a bowler, and rely on the batsmen to get runs and keep wickets.

For me, With Flintoff: Bell, Prior (Wk), Pieterson, Bopara, Shah, Collingwood, Flintoff, Broad, Swann, Sidebottom, Anderson. You then have 5 genuine bowlers, with Collingwood Shah, Bopara and Bell able to chip in if necessary, plus a fairly decent line up and long middle order. Not too many weak links in the field either.

Without Flintoff it becomes harder to get the same balance, so at a push Id probably go with Luke Wright as a replacement (and consider a switch with Prior) to see if he can blossom into a useful one day player. Not too far off the current team really...but at the moment too many players just arent performing.

Yorkshire Blue · Jun 26, 2008

Jonny_Stokes said:
Following on from the debate/dissection in the ODI thread, let's do the selectors' job for them, and pick an ODI side that can actually beat second-rate teams like New Zealand:

Bell - really growing into the role as opener

Is averaging 24.2 from his last 15 ODIs. He's passed 50 once in that time.

Mustard (wk) - what exactly did he do to be dropped?

Averages 23.3 from his 10 ODIs, might be worth persevering with because I feel he gives the side more balance, but is struggling at county level this season and averages 12 in first class cricket and 25.87 with just one 50 in List A cricket this season.

Pietersen - the more time he gets at the crease the better

His batting average has done the complete opposite. He is however still the class act in the England side.

Key (c) - One of the best captains on the county scene, and in top form

Key is undoubtedly one of the classier acts in county cricket. I think he deserved longer in test cricket, but it wasn't to be. An interesting idea however dropping Bopara (average 61.55, with 1 hundred (and a 99) and 5 fifties) in favour of Rob Key (average 24.42 with 1 50) on the basis of form. Bopara has actually scored more runs in one-day cricket in one innings than Key has managed all season, but even without that extraordinary innings, Bopara has the better one-day form.

Shah - the real form player in the ODI side

Collingwood averages 37.31 to Shah's 32.10 over the last 12 months, or over the 2 series against NZ its even more pronounced, Collingwood averages 42.85 as opposed to Shah's 25.25.

(Flintoff*) - if he's ever uninjured he has to play, if only for his bowling

Finally, a comment I can agree on!

Wright - late-innings banger and superb death bowler

I want to see more of him at the top of the innings before deciding his batting role. Shows promise as a death bowler, but he's only bowled 2 overs at the death in international cricket, one at a no.11.

Broad - England's best bowler and natural #8

Not sure he has the range of shots to be considered a natural no.8 in ODIs. You need 6 hitting ability at 8, which Broad hasn't displayed enough of. One of England's better bowlers though.

Swann - hugely econimical spinner capable of scoring quickly and taking wickets. Not worth dropping for one controversial moment.

Agree entirely that you don't drop him for one controversial moment, you drop him on a whole load of reasons. His bowling gets milked and he isn't a wicket-taking threat unless batsmen (or even more aptly, tailenders) are trying to slog him out of the ground. His batting averages 15 at a strike-rate of 72 is not a touch on someone like Plunkett (21.07 at 85.26), who is also a superior bowler. If you want to field a spinner to keep it tight, pick a batsman who can turn his arm over economically - Samit Patel. If you want a spinner to take wickets, pick Monty.

Swann's fielding is another black mark against him.

Sidebottom - economical opening bowler and left-arm gives variety
Anderson - a tad expensive, but our best wicket-taker

Fair enough.

My XI

1. Wright
2. Mustard
3. Bell
4. Pietersen
5. Bopara
6. Collingwood
7. Shah
8. Flintoff
8. Broad
10. Sidebottom
11. Anderson

If it is a bunsen, Monty in for Sideshow. If you need to take pace off the ball, KP and Shah can turn their arm over in addition to Bopara and Colly.

If Flintoff is unavailable, I'd have another look at Tim Bresnan, who seems to have come along nicely at Yorks this season. My other squad players would be Saj Mahmood, Matt Prior as both a keeper and a batsman and a young batsman, maybe Joe Denly at Kent or Samit Patel of Notts. James Hildreth at Somerset is another to keep an eye on, but has had a disappointing season.