Another slant on the defensive problems....

[Richard_Cadette]

Having seen the three games this week, and then having read the post match comments on this board regarding the problems we are currently having defensively, I have an alternative view on things.

It is patently obvious to everyone we have real problems in our backline, and I think the two main reasons for this are the centre halves AND the right back!

Barrett and Prior are clearly not good enough to play at this level, Prior was once, but not anymore, and AB was at full stretch last season and never looked comfortable.

My other worry, and I know I will get slated for this, is in the right back slot. In each of the pre seasons, and now each of the three games this week, Francis has looked incredibly shakey, and in all honesty, not as competent as Hunt or, dare I say it, Jupp in that position.

He got beat so many times yesterday it was a miracle we only went in 2-0 down, and every game so far he has made numerous mistakes, and at this level, you cannot get away with that. I am sure Tilly sees something in him, and not everyone can be wrong, he was very highly thought of last season, but so far, I think he has looked as bad as any of the defensive line.

My suggestion then, and I base this on what I saw in the friendlies so it must be in Tilly's mind, would be to switch Francis to centre half and play him alongside Clarke and bring Hunt in at right back. Radical perhaps, but to me, Francis looks a better Centre back than he does right back.

I think that would make us a much more solid unit, and form what I have seen in Hunt so far in pre season and against Stoke, he looks to be very sharp.

I dont want to get on any of the new lads back yet, after three games it is unfair to judge, but I just feel Francis looks a better centre half, and the way we have defended in the last two games, he and Clarke could hardly do much worse!!

 

[Angell Delight]

Quote[/b] (Richard_Cadette @ Aug. 13 2006,23:36)]Francis has looked incredibly shakey, and in all honesty, not as competent as Hunt or, dare I say it, Jupp in that position.

Eh?

Lewis is a decent RB (or CB) though IMHO Francis is better but Juppy (although good going forward) was defensively poor.

 

[palexander]

After QPR the last place I want Francis is centre-back! He looked terrified to tackle.

Still, like I've said, once he settles in I'm sure he'll be getting rave reviews like last year.

 

[Richard_Cadette]

Quote[/b] (Angell Delight @ Aug. 13 2006,23:55)]

Quote[/b] (Richard_Cadette @ Aug. 13 2006,23:36)]Francis has looked incredibly shakey, and in all honesty, not as competent as Hunt or, dare I say it, Jupp in that position.

Eh?  

Lewis is a decent RB (or CB) though IMHO Francis is better but Juppy (although good going forward) was defensively poor.

My point of the post wasnt to really argue who was a better right back, Juppy, Hunt or Francis, I merely used that term to express my point... That being Hunt IMHO would do a better job there right now than Francis, but I think Francis would do a better job at centre half than Messers Barrett and Prior!

 

[keefmoon]

Sorry mate...the first two games Francis was a real threat.
Get Juppy back over my dead body...

 

[Beefy]

Francis was no worse than Hammell on saturday.

The whole defensive unit needs a shake-up, but I don't think the best way to do that would be to bring in Hunt or Wilson. That would be a massive step back in my opinion.

 

[EastStandBlue]

Wow... 2 defeats in a row and everythings wrong with the team. i guess this shows how far we've come over the last 2 or 3 years, as Pre-Tilson 2 defeats in a row was never a problem.

We were unlucky against Palace because of the 10 minute spell of bad defending, and a terrible 1st half against QPR cost us. Get over it. These things happen.
Juppy was terrible defensively and would've been made a mockery of against the pacier wingers in this league. Take a look at the first game of the season. Luke Chadwick is meant to be one of the best wingers in this division, and up until he was stretcherd off Francis kept him incredibly quiet.

I'd still argue francis is probably the best Right Back we've had for some time... maybe even a decade. People complain him of looking too laid back or not caring, but the fact is he's composed on the ball and knows exactly what hes doing.

 

[Shrimpbizkit]

Arent we all being a little impatient? A brand new back 4 needs time to adjust to each other. Francis is a quality player and will prove that. AB IS good enough for this level. He took time to adjust last season and will do again. However I agree with Prior, not good enough and along with Jay Smith shouldve been released. I think once Sodje and Clarke get playing regularly we will have some good competition in the middle.

 

[Richard_Cadette]

Quote[/b] (EastStandBlue @ Aug. 14 2006,09:06)]Wow... 2 defeats in a row and everythings wrong with the team. i guess this shows how far we've come over the last 2 or 3 years, as Pre-Tilson 2 defeats in a row was never a problem.

We were unlucky against Palace because of the 10 minute spell of bad defending, and a terrible 1st half against QPR cost us. Get over it. These things happen.
Juppy was terrible defensively and would've been made a mockery of against the pacier wingers in this league. Take a look at the first game of the season. Luke Chadwick is meant to be one of the best wingers in this division, and up until he was stretcherd off Francis kept him incredibly quiet.

I'd still argue francis is probably the best Right Back we've had for some time... maybe even a decade. People complain him of looking too laid back or not caring, but the fact is he's composed on the ball and knows exactly what hes doing.

You have kind of agreed with my point there matey. I wouldnt argue that in the first three games we have played well in patches, against Stoke we were excellent first half, against Palace, we were excellent for 80 mins and in the second half against QPR, we created enough to have got a point.

But you are right, a mad ten minutes against Palace and we lose, a shocking first half against QPR and we lose. We cant afford to play well and then be let down by bad defending, it is no good playing pretty football, which we do, but have a soft centre, because teams will destroy us.... Thats exactly what happened to Crewe last season.

Don't ge me wrong, I have perspective, but we cannot afford to have too many of these results as condifence will soon drop.

I am sorry to disagree with majority, but I have not been impressed with Francis at all yet. He often gets beaten (every game we have played so far, including the friendlies), his distribution is poor and overall, I actually do not believe he is a better right back than Lewis Hunt... So far I would add.... I am sure he is a better player than he has displayed so far, and I am sure with time he will improve, but I think we need to make ourselves harder to beat right now, and if that means changing things at the back, then so be it.

I think Francis would make a better centre half, when he played there in the friendlies, he looked more comfortable than at right back.

I think Clarke has to be given a game this weekend, and I dont think either AB or Spinner can have any complaints about being dropped.... Although I am well aware that only one will be.

I am not surprised most of you disagree, but I dont hold with this 'Its only 3 games into the season, lets get some perspective' stuff..... Problems like these need to be sorted early, otherwise confidence ebbs away, and if we dont sort that out, it will be a long tough season ahead.

 

[Mrs P]

Quote[/b] (Shrimpbizkit @ Aug. 14 2006,09:09)]Arent we all being a little impatient? A brand new back 4 needs time to adjust to each other. Francis is a quality player and will prove that. AB IS good enough for this level. He took time to adjust last season and will do again. However I agree with Prior, not good enough and along with Jay Smith shouldve been released. I think once Sodje and Clarke get playing regularly we will have some good competition in the middle.

Pretty much agree with your words.. AB is good enough and the 2 new guys at the back will settle in time..

Think the back 4 will come good and think once Clarke and Sodje are settled and fit Prior will become the squad player that he was kept to be - he has been an excellent servant to this club over the years and some other people posting on here seem to forget that..

 

[sufcintheprem]

To be honest, defenders should be judged on their consistency over a period of time. Our game against Palace was the perfect example of the idea behind this. We defended well for most of the game but a few lapses and we were two goals behind with little chance of getting back in the game.

While Francis has looked very good for large periods, some of his mistakes should have been punished.

I reckon both him and Hammell will both come through and be very good plaers for us but I think they have to get a run in the team in order to make this development. Poor play by any of our settled players can't be excused in the same way.

 

[Westcliff Shrimper]

Tilly did saw that it would take 10 games to get used to the step up in class - there is a massive gulf between League 1 and the Championship. To be honest, from the games so far, I think there is a massive gulf between the Championship and Division One from 10 years ago when we last graced the second tier of English football...